Name your favorite DAC.

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gefski

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Re: Name your favorite DAC.
« Reply #60 on: 16 Jan 2019, 01:49 am »
Are you referring to the Schiit Yggdrasil?
How do you feed Dante to this specific DAC?

Yes.
Buy a Dante device (in my case Atterotech unDAES-O, $700). Buy Dante Virtual Soundcard $30 and load to Mac or PC. Load Dante Controller (free) to Mac or PC. Now the computer has "become" a Dante device and will "talk" to the unDAES-O. Ethernet cable from computer to unDAES-O, transformer coupled AES cable to Yggy.
Dante videos will talk you through setup on computer.

Nothingness that is beyond black background, true timbre, touch, texture, space and (perceived) hall sound. Enables Yggy to do everything it was made to do with the thousands of 16/44 files available.

Downside for some is no sample rate follow (set manually in Dante). For me (98% Redbook), Hi-Rez files aren't needed.



 

orientalexpress

Re: Name your favorite DAC.
« Reply #61 on: 16 Jan 2019, 03:58 am »
Well, I went ahead and committed to a new DAC - a SW1X DAC III STD. I've spent the last couple months researching it and chatting with two owners of the same model - one of whom owns the same D Sachs amp and preamp that I own. My new DAC will be delivered to me a few days after I return to the States in March.

I haven't yet decided if I want the black or silver front panel.  Edit: I decided on black.  :thumb:

http://sw1xad.co.uk/product/sw1x-dac-iii/
excellent choice ,I’m currently listening to this in my references system.everything sound so real and organic. :thumb:

MttBsh

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Re: Name your favorite DAC.
« Reply #62 on: 16 Jan 2019, 06:17 am »
Yes.
Buy a Dante device (in my case Atterotech unDAES-O, $700). Buy Dante Virtual Soundcard $30 and load to Mac or PC. Load Dante Controller (free) to Mac or PC. Now the computer has "become" a Dante device and will "talk" to the unDAES-O. Ethernet cable from computer to unDAES-O, transformer coupled AES cable to Yggy.
Dante videos will talk you through setup on computer.

Nothingness that is beyond black background, true timbre, touch, texture, space and (perceived) hall sound. Enables Yggy to do everything it was made to do with the thousands of 16/44 files available.

Downside for some is no sample rate follow (set manually in Dante). For me (98% Redbook), Hi-Rez files aren't needed.


Gefski,

Being an Yggy owner, I'm intrigued.

Currently I use JRiver on my PC and an ethernet connection to a Sonore Microrendu, then a Schiit EITR to convert USB to SPDIF to the Yggy. It sounds exceptionally good, and using my iPad for JRemote is extremely convenient for selecting and playing music. I'm curious if you feel the Atterotech unDAES-O solution would improve on my set-up. I know the Yggy to be capable of extremely fine sound - maybe untapped potential until fed by an optimimal source. 

Dynky

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  • Posts: 27
Re: Name your favorite DAC.
« Reply #63 on: 16 Jan 2019, 07:13 am »
Yes.
Buy a Dante device (in my case Atterotech unDAES-O, $700). Buy Dante Virtual Soundcard $30 and load to Mac or PC. Load Dante Controller (free) to Mac or PC. Now the computer has "become" a Dante device and will "talk" to the unDAES-O. Ethernet cable from computer to unDAES-O, transformer coupled AES cable to Yggy.
Dante videos will talk you through setup on computer.

Nothingness that is beyond black background, true timbre, touch, texture, space and (perceived) hall sound. Enables Yggy to do everything it was made to do with the thousands of 16/44 files available.

Downside for some is no sample rate follow (set manually in Dante). For me (98% Redbook), Hi-Rez files aren't needed.


I'm well known with the Dante ins & outs, but then you're not feeding the Schitt Dante (which I concluded after reading your post), you're feeding him AES...all clear now.
Enjoy your setup :wink:

shooter

Re: Name your favorite DAC.
« Reply #64 on: 16 Jan 2019, 03:39 pm »
Well, I went ahead and committed to a new DAC - a SW1X DAC III STD. I've spent the last couple months researching it and chatting with two owners of the same model - one of whom owns the same D Sachs amp and preamp that I own. My new DAC will be delivered to me a few days after I return to the States in March.

I haven't yet decided if I want the black or silver front panel.  Edit: I decided on black.  :thumb:

http://sw1xad.co.uk/product/sw1x-dac-iii/

I just checked their website, excellent choice!
TDA1541 a 2nd generation Phillip DAC chip from the 80’s continues to find new admirers! New developments in implementation continue with this chip from DIYers, so much new development in its use is hard to keep up. Genuine chips are getting hard to find and price has sky rocketed for the s1 and s2 selected chips.
Don’t expect it to measure very well but will be an ear opener for those never heard a properly implemented TDA1541 dac.

jaylevine

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  • Posts: 312
Re: Name your favorite DAC.
« Reply #65 on: 16 Jan 2019, 03:44 pm »
The one I own--Emotiva DC-1 Stealth. Purchased used, excellent as pre-amp/DAC into my VTA 120 Tube Amp....

Just sorry Emotiva can't seem to get the DC-2 out the door into market :cry:

gefski

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 39
Re: Name your favorite DAC.
« Reply #66 on: 16 Jan 2019, 10:49 pm »
Yes.
Buy a Dante device (in my case Atterotech unDAES-O, $700). Buy Dante Virtual Soundcard $30 and load to Mac or PC. Load Dante Controller (free) to Mac or PC. Now the computer has "become" a Dante device and will "talk" to the unDAES-O. Ethernet cable from computer to unDAES-O, transformer coupled AES cable to Yggy.
Dante videos will talk you through setup on computer.

Nothingness that is beyond black background, true timbre, touch, texture, space and (perceived) hall sound. Enables Yggy to do everything it was made to do with the thousands of 16/44 files available.

Downside for some is no sample rate follow (set manually in Dante). For me (98% Redbook), Hi-Rez files aren't needed.


Gefski,

Being an Yggy owner, I'm intrigued.

Currently I use JRiver on my PC and an ethernet connection to a Sonore Microrendu, then a Schiit EITR to convert USB to SPDIF to the Yggy. It sounds exceptionally good, and using my iPad for JRemote is extremely convenient for selecting and playing music. I'm curious if you feel the Atterotech unDAES-O solution would improve on my set-up. I know the Yggy to be capable of extremely fine sound - maybe untapped potential until fed by an optimimal source.

No way to tell without comparing, but that Sonore MR setup is raved about compared to USB from PC to dac, so I doubt that my rig would give you meaningful improvements. I haven't listened to a Sonore setup at any of our meets in Seattle, but would like to.

WGH

Re: Name your favorite DAC.
« Reply #67 on: 27 Jan 2019, 09:04 pm »
I pick up this cheap SMSL SU-8 Dac over the holiday.mine mine ,what a surprise how good this Dac sound. :o

The SMSL SU-8 Version 2 DAC is one of the current favorites at Audio Science Review
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/smsl-su-8-version-2-balanced-dac.5433/

Looking over the DAC's this guy has measured it is amazing how many well regarded brands measure so poorly.
The site is similar to the reviews written by Julian Hirsch in the old Stereo Review magazine, all measurements with no comments on persevered sound quality but still....

SINAD graph (signal above power of distortion and noise) for each DAC. It is the average of the two channels tested.

mr_bill

Re: Name your favorite DAC.
« Reply #68 on: 27 Jan 2019, 09:35 pm »
interesting chart

Tyson

Re: Name your favorite DAC.
« Reply #69 on: 27 Jan 2019, 10:04 pm »
It's easy to get GREAT measurements as long as you're willing to use a shit-ton of negative feedback.  Problem is that it'll sound pretty crappy.  Which is why a modestly measuring device can sound better than a super great measuring device.

MttBsh

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Re: Name your favorite DAC.
« Reply #70 on: 28 Jan 2019, 04:09 am »
It's easy to get GREAT measurements as long as you're willing to use a shit-ton of negative feedback.  Problem is that it'll sound pretty crappy.  Which is why a modestly measuring device can sound better than a super great measuring device.

That point is made in the fact that the $99.00 Schiit Modi scored 107 while the far better sounding $2,399 Schiit Yggdrasil scored 86. These scores are not a measure of sound quality.

Tyson

Re: Name your favorite DAC.
« Reply #71 on: 28 Jan 2019, 04:18 am »
That point is made in the fact that the $99.00 Schiit Modi scored 107 while the far better sounding $2,399 Schiit Yggdrasil scored 86. These scores are not a measure of sound quality.

Then what's the point of the measurements?

mresseguie

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Re: Name your favorite DAC.
« Reply #72 on: 28 Jan 2019, 04:59 am »
Measurements are for the folks who listen with their eyes...perhaps? :lol:

Joking aside, I think we all know many folks need measurements in order to make up their minds.

MttBsh

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Re: Name your favorite DAC.
« Reply #73 on: 28 Jan 2019, 05:55 am »
Measurements are for the folks who listen with their eyes...perhaps? :lol:

Joking aside, I think we all know many folks need measurements in order to make up their minds.


We'd all like to have meaningful measurements to help us choose our audio gear, but I'm afraid that putting stock in charts like the one above will only lead to bad assumptions followed by bad choices.

WGH

Re: Name your favorite DAC.
« Reply #74 on: 28 Jan 2019, 05:23 pm »
That point is made in the fact that the $99.00 Schiit Modi scored 107 while the far better sounding $2,399 Schiit Yggdrasil scored 86. These scores are not a measure of sound quality.

Schiit Yggdrasil review on Audio Science Review:
"We immediately notice a few issues. On the FFT spectrum to the left of our 1 kHz tone (all others are noise/distortion), we see significant spikes at double the mains AC supply. This is created by the internal power supply and is bleeding into the output of the DAC.

"To the right, we see an awful lot of distortion spikes. They translate into poor SINAD of just 86 dB. This means that above the energy of distortions+noise, we only have 86 dB to work with. Let's remember that we need 93 dB for our CDs properly dithered."

Humans like the sound of distortion, if they didn't then low powered tube amps would disappear and all amps would be Class D.  :bawl: Plus the amount of distortion measured probably can't be heard in most instances. In the case of the Yggdrasil I wouldn't be surprised if Ver. 2 has much lower distortion and improved power supply filtering making a good product even better.

Tyson

Re: Name your favorite DAC.
« Reply #75 on: 28 Jan 2019, 06:05 pm »
Even with tubes, it's not that simple.  Take a 45 SET triode - it's perhaps the most linear tube around, and needs no feedback to sound good.  On the other hand, take a pentode in push-pull configuration, it's inherently less linear than the triode, so you have to correct for that in the circuit.  In the end, after correction, the pentode actually measures better than the triode.  But it doesn't sound better, because it needed feedback to get to the "good" measurements. 

Same with any other piece of gear - how are they getting their measurements?  If it's starting out with an inherently non-linear device and then applying feedback to correct for that natively poor initial performance, you get exactly what I was talking about - a great measurement that sounds worse than something using less feedback (and hence measures worse).

Now, having said all that, I will also say that if the power supply measures badly, well there's NO excuse for that in the high end.  Every piece of hifi gear should have an exceptional power supply - after all that's at the heart of what makes hi-fi actually hi-fi. 

But even power supplies can be deceptive.  For example, with my iFi iDSD Pro, the iFi designed laptop brick power supply measures better than the after-market linear power supply I got to use with it.  But guess which one sounds better?  Yeah, the linear power supply.  So, even with PSUs, measurement matter but they aren't the whole story.

rollo

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Re: Name your favorite DAC.
« Reply #76 on: 28 Jan 2019, 09:38 pm »
  You measure it I'll listen to it. Back to topic.  :popcorn:


charles

jMelvin

Re: Name your favorite DAC.
« Reply #77 on: 28 Jan 2019, 10:52 pm »
My favorite is the MHDT Lab Pagoda (PCM1704) followed by the dB Audio Labs Tranquility. I guess that puts me firmly in the NOS camp.

adydula

Re: Name your favorite DAC.
« Reply #78 on: 28 Jan 2019, 11:34 pm »
ASR and its relationship with Schitt is well documented and discussed ad naseum on several sites.

Several engineers have refuted ASR's measurments on Schitt's stuff....

These measurements IMO are not accurate at all when it comes to really listening....

But hey, if you only look at one source as the end all to making a decision on buying stuff...buyer
beware....

Alex

SlushPuppy

Re: Name your favorite DAC.
« Reply #79 on: 29 Jan 2019, 01:09 am »
Over the past 18 months I have bought and sold (or returned) around 10 DACs at various price points. The Schiit Yggdrasil I bought recently is the only one that sounds [to me] like real music (if there is such a thing). No listener fatigue (a huge problem with all the others). It has a "tube-like" warmth that I've never experienced before in a DAC, and what's really incredible is that I'm hearing so many subtle new things in very familiar recordings. Yeah, we're all tired of the "veil being lifted" BS from the popular audio sites, but for me this purchase was a game changer. I've listened to Tears for Fears "The Seeds of Love" hundreds of times. I listened to it once a day during a 6-month Navy deployment in 1995! I didn't know until two weeks ago that the keyboards on songs I have listened to for almost 30 years were multi-layered! They always sounded one dimensional to me. What is really amazing is how good drums sound. Everything from cymbals to kick drums. They just sound fantastic! I'm listening to much more old-school jazz now because of this. Tyson nailed it a while back on a reply to a comment I made a few months ago in the Spatial Audio circle, he said "Now comes the fun part - re listening to all your favorite recordings. If you're anything like me, it'll do one other very interesting thing: allow you to understand and appreciate artists that were closed off before. I'm thinking of people like Bob Dylan and Janis Joplin. I respected what they did, but their music didn't really resonate with me. Part of that was the recordings are very challenging to reproduce well. But with speakers like the X2s (and Super 7s), the recording itself stops being a barrier. That's pretty damn cool." He was commenting on my X2 loudspeakers, but that could also be applied to this DAC. I started re-listening to Tom Waits for the first time in years and finally, I get it. His music always sounded like a joke to me. Like Buster Poindexter or some kind of early SNL sketch that some thought was real but in reality was a parody. Now I'm starting to get it and my appreciation of music outside of my comfort zone is increasing daily. I'm finally happy with a DAC! Until the next best thing...  8)