[KLH007]

Take a quick read here, http://www.indiespinzone.com/magnestand.html  .  I've heard a pair of 1.6s modded as Magnestands and couldn't believe the bass reach, impact, and especially their ability to play loud w/o strain, Wells Akasha amp. I have visited my friend's home many times and instead of getting into the component comparisons that were the goal, we mostly listen to music and have a great time, these Magnestand 1.6s stunned me, I never would believe any Maggie could sound like these and I've heard 3.6s with Pass monos and they sounded anemic compared to these.

[timind]

I just finished reading Doug Schroeder's review of the ET speakers. I met him back in 2005 when I sold him a pair of Vandersteen 1C speakers. This was before he was hired on at Dagogo, I'm pretty sure.
My reason for posting here is I have owned Magnepan 12QRs, 1.6QRs and the Eminent Technology LFT-8b. The ETs were with me for only a short while as I didn't care for their tonal balance. The tweeter was just too hot no matter what I did. What sealed there fate for me was listening to Johnny Cash. I put on the Deadman Walking soundtrack and 15 seconds into Mr Cash's In Your Mind I knew these speakers weren't going to work for me.
As for their ability to play loud though, when I sold them, a buyer came to audition them and man did he blast them. I wasn't really paying attention to their sound at that point but I remember my wife's reaction once we boxed the speakers up.
Going back to Schoeder's review, he compared them to the Maggie 1.6 and the Vandersteen 2CE. Of the three speakers I would chose the Vandies. All a matter of taste and preference. Unfortunately, my current room is too small for the Vandies. Before selling the 1.6s though, I had a pair of Revel M20s next to them. I had 3 or 4 people in my room to listen and all found the Revels the better over all speaker.

[Davey]

It's too bad you sold the ET speakers so soon.  The hot tweeter issue is easily solved and the tonal balance can be addressed in a couple of different ways.
Of course, the midrange driver is the star of the show and these speakers have easily more potential than any of the Magnepan models.  But, it takes some work to get 'em there.

I'm not sure the Dead Man Walking soundtrack is appropriate evaluation software.  I think most of the tracks on that disk are horribly recorded and they will make most speakers sound bad.

Cheers,

Dave.

[timind]

It's too bad you sold the ET speakers so soon.  The hot tweeter issue is easily solved and the tonal balance can be addressed in a couple of different ways.
Of course, the midrange driver is the star of the show and these speakers have easily more potential than any of the Magnepan models.  But, it takes some work to get 'em there.

I'm not sure the Dead Man Walking soundtrack is appropriate evaluation software.  I think most of the tracks on that disk are horribly recorded and they will make most speakers sound bad.

Cheers,

Dave.

Glad you enjoy your ETs. I honestly thought mine sounded better with the tweeter disconnected. You've done way more work on yours then the design warrants, IMO.

Curious which cuts on the Deadman Walking cd you consider poorly recorded? I find a couple of them sound wonderful, and the Johnny Cash contribution is one of the better ones.

[gnostalgick]

Haven't heard the ETs, but the Spatial Audio M3s may provide what you're looking for without venturing too far away from what you like.

[I.Greyhound Fan]

I would look to the used market for a sub to save some money.  I bought my Martin Logan Original Dynamo's for $180 and $280.  They sold for $700 new.  They come up from time to time.  They are musical, fast and integrate seamlessly with my Maggies.   Here is a Martin Logan Dynamo 700 with wireless option for a great price-

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Martin-Logan-Dynamo-700W-Wireless-High-Resolution-Subwoofer-System-700-Watt/142193611698?_trksid=p2141725.c100337.m3725&_trkparms=aid%3D777000%26algo%3DABA.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20141212152338%26meid%3D57f2b704443a4e2f84fd6a617e9b9870%26pid%3D100337%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D1%26sd%3D252658478170

Nothing to lose here.  You could easily turn around and sell it.  There are better subs that go deeper but these integrate seamlessly with fast, articulate bass with no bloat or boom.  It is non ported.  The 300 and 500 versions are ported and are not very good.  If you want new, consider the SVS SB-1000 for about $600.   Great sub for that price.

I would forget larger Maggies, you will still have the same problem with the bass.

[Hiphile]

I really, really want to thanks all of you guys for the enlightenment and excellent comments, it did help through this brainstorming process. So the Sub option is gonna be! seems the most reasonable and cheap way. Call  Magnepan and no upgrade program for .7, call my dealer and offer me 400 for the speakers I bought from them 3 months ago that are in pristine conditions I even keep'em covered with the plastic bag they came with, damn I sure I can get 800 for them in A-gon. Dave's advice sounds awesome but I don't want go through that process right now, the Spatial proposal is tempting as well. I like what this speakers do well, so I will try to work things around their strengths and ameliorate their weakness
ps you haven't got rid of me yet, will do my homework on the sub and will post again for comments. Thanks again you people are a great resource!

[Davey]

Glad you enjoy your ETs. I honestly thought mine sounded better with the tweeter disconnected. You've done way more work on yours then the design warrants, IMO.

Well, I've actually done some work on the speakers, so I think my insight is much better than yours.

Dave.

[Hiphile]

Hi Dave, just curious. How diffcult will be to do the woofer's job in the ET I read somewhere that they're sealed??

[I.Greyhound Fan]

Haven't heard the ETs, but the Spatial Audio M3s may provide what you're looking for without venturing too far away from what you like.

The Spatial Audio M3's are a very nice sounding speaker.  I had a pair for a few days in my home for an audition early this fall.  While they are a nice sounding speaker and do nothing wrong except for needing a sub as well, they were less musical and resolving next to my Magnepan 1.6's.  The midrange on the Maggies had them beat by a long shot.  Vocals were more textured.  The Spatials did image better and had a greater sense of air.  They were a more forgiving speaker. I had a friend over who thought the same when we compared them side by side.  He preferred the Maggies as did my audiophile son. I would have liked to hear the Turbo S model though.

Get a sub and I think that you will be pleasantly surprised with the Maggies. I set my crossover on the sub just a few hz above the lower end of the Maggies and run the Maggies full range.  The Maggies also need about 75 to 100 hours of break in and the sound gets better and bass improves some.

[timind]

Well, I've actually done some work on the speakers, so I think my insight is much better than yours.

Dave.

Really?

As an owner of the speakers, I think my opinion is just as valid as yours.

You point out many technical flaws with the speaker. You've taken the time to fix these problems to your satisfaction. I applaud your effort there. I chose to put my Meadowlark Kestel Hot Rods back in service, listen to Johnny Cash the way he should sound, and sell the ETs.

The question for me, and I'd say to the OP as well, why not simply purchase speakers that aren't as flawed? A very easy solution.

I seriously doubt the LFT-8 is a better speaker than the Vandersteen 2CE (any iteration), no matter the amount of tweaking. That's MY opinion as one who has owned both models. Others may disagree.

[Davey]

Hi Dave, just curious. How diffcult will be to do the woofer's job in the ET I read somewhere that they're sealed??

It's not too difficult.
You need to drive out all the screws and pull the woofer out.  You can accomplish the modification without unsoldering the wires, but it's easier if you do.
Here's a photo of my setup after installing the RC shunt.  The capacitor is secured to the driver with a big glob of RTV.
This doesn't eliminate the cone resonance, but attenuates it considerably.

The other photo shows an external resistor added into the tweeter leg to attenuate it further than the "low" position would.

Cheers,

Dave.

[charmerci]

My opinion is also for the OP to get a sub - because as he said in the original post.

I'm about to give up on my recently bought Maggies .7 this is a tough decision because I just love how these things sound with 75% of my music collection. The issue is not with the low end per se, acoustic bass sound magnificent. My problem is what the British call PRAT factor, drive and dynamics in the lower frequencies are a turn off when I listen to old Rock music Yes, Genesis et al.

Can consider a subwoofer if and only if they can completely solve the problem with the low frq's. dynamics, which I doubt.

Why sell these and buy something else and risk the possibility that he might not like the new ones?

[OzarkTom]

Hi Early B, I using an Acoustat TNT-200 recently worked by Roy Esposito and a Vacuum Tube Audio SP9 preamp with a digital front end, my analogue gear is currently out of action. My previous speaker were  Merlins TSM which provided way more articulated and tight bass. Now, I hear my music at reasonable levels ( not head bangers here). The room dimensions are 16'.5 x 19' my main issue is, that the "tapping the foot" factor in the music's foundation is not there, the "low end" (I guessing between 40-80hz) rhythm and pace feels sluggish compared with the Merlin. Don't get me wrong they are fabulous, maybe to good in other areas for their own good. Probably I been to harsh toward these $1400.00 speakers

Roy also does a great job in modding the OTL tube amps for the Acoustat x and monitor series. These are much more dynamic than any of the Maggie's and  much better bass.  Steve Deckart of Decware and bpape still uses these as reference speakers and still cannot find a replacement after. 30 years plus.

since you have a modded TNT amp, you might look for a pair of Acoustst 2+2's,  Jeff at Tone Audio said recently that he could live with a pair of those the rest of his life and you see how many speakers he reviews.
The Acoustats were state of the art 30-40 years ago, and it still stands today. I have recently seen many 2+2's sell in the range of 500-1200 these days. Roy also as a great mod for the transformers of the Acoustats. I would love to hear a pair of 2+2's with the servo tube amps.

I saw today a Roy modded  TNT 200 amp on Ebay for 1250.

[Davey]

Really?

As an owner of the speakers, I think my opinion is just as valid as yours.

You point out many technical flaws with the speaker. You've taken the time to fix these problems to your satisfaction. I applaud your effort there. I chose to put my Meadowlark Kestel Hot Rods back in service, listen to Johnny Cash the way he should sound, and sell the ETs.

The question for me, and I'd say to the OP as well, why not simply purchase speakers that aren't as flawed? A very easy solution.

I seriously doubt the LFT-8 is a better speaker than the Vandersteen 2CE (any iteration), no matter the amount of tweaking. That's MY opinion as one who has owned both models. Others may disagree.

If you think the Vandersteen 2ce (or even a primitive design like the Meadowlark HotRod) is preferable to LFT-8's then we clearly have a different reference regarding speaker system performance.    I wouldn't even consider the Model 5's equivalent.
Vandersteen speakers are extremely over-priced...for what they are.  And anybody can throw some quality Scan-Speak drivers in a box and make them sound decent.

My insight regarding the ET speakers is related to their 'potential' and not necessarily their stock performance.  I have listened to my pair for well over a year now....in stock form and with various modifications.  I think I have a pretty good idea the type of potential these speakers have.    But, if you think your insight is equivalent to that then so be it.

Cheers,

Dave.

[timind]

If you think the Vandersteen 2ce (or even a primitive design like the Meadowlark HotRod) is preferable to LFT-8's then we clearly have a different reference regarding speaker system performance.    I wouldn't even consider the Model 5's equivalent.
Vandersteen speakers are extremely over-priced...for what they are.  And anybody can throw some quality Scan-Speak drivers in a box and make them sound decent.

My insight regarding the ET speakers is related to their 'potential' and not necessarily their stock performance.  I have listened to my pair for well over a year now....in stock form and with various modifications.  I think I have a pretty good idea the type of potential these speakers have.    But, if you think your insight is equivalent to that then so be it.

Cheers,

Dave.

Ok then. We'll agree to disagree and each listen to what we prefer. As for my insight being equivalent to yours, when it comes to telling me what sound I prefer, my insight is  superior to yours.  I wish you well and sincerely hope you enjoy your holidays.

Tim

[sunnydaze]

A nice Maggie .7 video review here,  including integration with dual subs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJro26WxdaQ

[Hiphile]

Hi Early B. and OzarkTom this pictures shows how the amp looks after Roy's magic touch. Mine was updated and upgraded two months ago was lucky that someone cancel its appointment and was able to squeeze in, the waiting list is around 8+ months. Amazing sounding for a 30 years old amp. built like a tank. In my book one of the top 3 amps I had ever own along with the Plinius SB-300, Symphonic line RG1

[audiobasic2000]

Hi Hiphile:

   Your TNT-200 looks almost new.    Did you buy it used or new? Roy did a great job on your unit. Wanted to have it done by him but just couldn't afford to send it to him to have the work done as the Canadian to US exchange rate is low.    Can you take closer pictures of the innards especially the PCB boards? I'm curious as to which parts were swapped/replaced. Can tell that the smaller caps have been replaced. Really enjoying mine (bought used and had a local tech, who is very good and has done repairs/replacement/mods to Cello, Mark Levinson, Krells, Macs, and other high-end SS and tube gear, go over it) aside from the slight turn on thump (I've read that it's normal for these amps). The pre is a TNP also gone over by the same tech. (The cost of the repairs/replacement parts, small mods, and labor for both units ran $1k  which would not be far from Roy's works aside from the shipping and exchange rates.) It mates well with the Acoustat 3s in a small 11'x10.5' treated room.    Also have a HSU VTF-2 sub handling the lower end of things.

   Your pre is probably quite a bit better than the TNP... so the electronics you currently have would mate well with a selection of loudspeakers if you choose to go that route.   

   I agree with most of the other posters that adding one sub (or two if it'll fit in your room) is probably the best route to take as the dealer isn't giving you much of a trade in value (which is kind of strange since you purchase the .7s from them   ).

  Hope you find the prat/sound you are looking for.   

Sincerely,
Kingsley.

[Hiphile]

Hi Hiphile:

   Your TNT-200 looks almost new.    Did you buy it used or new? Roy did a great job on your unit. Wanted to have it done by him but just couldn't afford to send it to him to have the work done as the Canadian to US exchange rate is low.    Can you take closer pictures of the innards especially the PCB boards? I'm curious as to which parts were swapped/replaced. Can tell that the smaller caps have been replaced. Really enjoying mine (bought used and had a local tech, who is very good and has done repairs/replacement/mods to Cello, Mark Levinson, Krells, Macs, and other high-end SS and tube gear, go over it) aside from the slight turn on thump (I've read that it's normal for these amps). The pre is a TNP also gone over by the same tech. (The cost of the repairs/replacement parts, small mods, and labor for both units ran $1k  which would not be far from Roy's works aside from the shipping and exchange rates.) It mates well with the Acoustat 3s in a small 11'x10.5' treated room.    Also have a HSU VTF-2 sub handling the lower end of things.

   Your pre is probably quite a bit better than the TNP... so the electronics you currently have would mate well with a selection of loudspeakers if you choose to go that route.   

   I agree with most of the other posters that adding one sub (or two if it'll fit in your room) is probably the best route to take as the dealer isn't giving you much of a trade in value (which is kind of strange since you purchase the .7s from them   ).

  Hope you find the prat/sound you are looking for.   

Sincerely,
Kingsley.

Boug

ht it used!