[jriggy]

Hey mike,
We’ve had similar gear paths before and I think I know what you have but not sure... Apart from tube choice, I may be able to help some in the detail department. Shoot me a PM if ya want...

Jason

Also, if going with the DAC 2.0 module and get some Daedalus DiD’s under the LIO, you will be very happy in the detail department.

[Chris Adams]

Ever since getting the LIO I've been curious to hear these tubes. Price was a factor as I thought how much better really? So a few days ago I struck a deal with Parts Connexion and here they are. Take this with a grain of salt as the first listen was with 45 minutes on the tubes. My system is in the gallery if you want to know. Well first off, they don't suck! I had been using KR PX-4s and I'm very familiar with their clear, clean, and full sound. I have a very expensive tube R2R dac using 101D tubes that I stuck in the system just to get a sense of it compared to the Vinnie Rossi 2.0 dac. Well, the sound stage seemed to open up and draw me in to it. Definitely warmer, richer, and very dense. But, it lacked some bass depth and solidity compared to the 2.0. So back to the 2.0 and now with the Taks. Yikes, everything I like about the tube dac was there, but tighter bass and less fuzz. Like in the middle between the KR PX-4s with the 2.0 and the tube dac. I'll chime in when the Taks have some more time on them. So far, I'm really liking what I'm hearing. Buy the way, the 2.0 dac is so much better than the 1.0. It is truly a bargain if you own a LIO and want to upgrade.

[Vinnie R.]

Hi Chris,

 

So back to the 2.0 and now with the Taks. Yikes, everything I like about the tube dac was there, but tighter bass and less fuzz. Like in the middle between the KR PX-4s with the 2.0 and the tube dac. I'll chime in when the Taks have some more time on them. So far, I'm really liking what I'm hearing. Buy the way, the 2.0 dac is so much better than the 1.0. It is truly a bargain if you own a LIO and want to upgrade.

I'm glad to are enjoying those Tak 300Bs!  Thanks for posting your initial impressions.

LIO "X1" DHT PRE  (with Tak 300B) + VR120 monoblocks + Spatial X1s...  N I C E ! ! ! 

Enjoy it, Chris!

Vinnie

[Chris Adams]

A quick update. I just listened again and with the tubes having only 4 1/2 hours on them, I would happily live with them as is and I've read that break in is 200-250 hours. Of course that's in a power amp and not the way they are being run in the LIO, so I guess I'll find out just how long. When I first listened last night what immediately came to mind was "Space, the final frontier." The sound stage is vast, with air and space and it just sounds scrumptious. And that's on a multi mic studio recording.
I have never heard my gear at any point in time sound this good to me.

If you havn't looked at my system, here's what it looks like from my chair:

[ebag4]

A quick update. I just listened again and with the tubes having only 4 1/2 hours on them, I would happily live with them as is and I've read that break in is 200-250 hours. Of course that's in a power amp and not the way they are being run in the LIO, so I guess I'll find out just how long. When I first listened last night what immediately came to mind was "Space, the final frontier." The sound stage is vast, with air and space and it just sounds scrumptious. And that's on a multi mic studio recording.
I have never heard my gear at any point in time sound this good to me.

If you havn't looked at my system, here's what it looks like from my chair:

Very cool, nice system Chris, I'll bet it sounds fantastic.

Best,
Ed

[sbj23]

Ed, what are you using as tube covers on the LIO?  Can you also describe more the difference between the Tatsuki and the KR PX4s?

[Chris Adams]

I'm assuming you mean me.

The tube covers come with the LIO. They work extremely well to reduce noise with the DHT tubes when necessary.

The difference I hear is that the KR PX-4s are leaner overall and maybe have better definition in the bass than the Taks. That's not to say the PX-4s are lean, just in comparison. With my setup, I like the fullness of the Taks better.

[TimS]

Hi Chris

I also have the X1's with the LIO (DHT Pre, DAC 2.0) amp and am interested in how others have set up their system with these speakers.
Would you mind describing your system and what changes (if any) you made to get where you're currently at?

Thanks

I'm assuming you mean me.

The tube covers come with the LIO. They work extremely well to reduce noise with the DHT tubes when necessary.

The difference I hear is that the KR PX-4s are leaner overall and maybe have better definition in the bass than the Taks. That's not to say the PX-4s are lean, just in comparison. With my setup, I like the fullness of the Taks better.

[Chris Adams]

TimS, You have a PM.

[sbj23]

Vinnie,

Are the LIO tube covers available now, or are you still having trouble finding a supplier for it?

Jason

[Vinnie R.]

Vinnie,

Are the LIO tube covers available now, or are you still having trouble finding a supplier for it?

Jason

Hi Jason,

I had a few different vendors try to make the covers ('deep drawing' process) and finish them (black or
silver anodize) and they all couldn't seem make them without scratches, dings, etc.  They just didn't look good
enough, so I kinda gave up for now on them out of frustration. 

In the meantime, if you want to try something to see if it makes a difference, you can do a google image search
for:

- Aluminum canister
- Aluminum container
- etc.

The dimensions of the one that I wanted to work out was:  3.25" dia. x 5.25" tall

I just spotted this and it is very inexpensive (and ugly, but I think any cover over the tubes will not really look that good anyway):

https://www.specialtybottle.com/metal-tin-containers/tea/tws6?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIuY7mlMmo1wIVTpJ-Ch3iSwzxEAQYASABEgJiB_D_BwE

2.6" x 6".  Should work out and you can initially just place it on top of the LIO top panel and test it out.



The ones that I was having made were much, much more costly because it was a custom size and I had to buy a deep draw die
(tooling costs) to the dimensions that I wanted, and have them sandblasted smooth and finished.  This is a different process than the usual CNC machining, which you wouldn't do with a thin metal cover like this. 

Best regards,

Vinnie

[flkin]

The tube covers are important for the TA – 300Bs because they are slightly microphonic. You can test this by playing something loud and pressing stop on the music player. You can hear the decay of the last bit of music.

[jriggy]

The difference I hear is that the KR PX-4s are leaner overall and maybe have better definition in the bass than the Taks. That's not to say the PX-4s are lean, just in comparison. With my setup, I like the fullness of the Taks better.

Are they otherwise comparable to each other in detail and upper extension?

Thanks
 [a diferent] Jason

[jriggy]

Reguarding tube covers... I used a cut down 4” poster tube for mailing (extra thick) (no top). After getting used to the systems sound in a new room I felt the sound was just a touch forward. I removed the tube covers And the mids relaxed just enough and 3verything seemed to ‘breath’ just a bit more... Not saying tube covers are good OR bad in every scenario, it probably depends on what tubes you are using and where the LIO is placed. So just like tube dampeners, YMMV.

Vinnie,
Have you thought of a plexiglass tube cover with an aluminum top plate and bottom ring for securing? The top could even be perforated if nessisary. I thought of making an all plexi version before I realized I like the sound without tube dampeners or a cover.

[Vinnie R.]

Hi jriggy,

For reducing / removing hum, the covers need to be metal.

Vinnie

[Chris Adams]

Are they otherwise comparable to each other in detail and upper extension?

Thanks
 [a diferent] Jason

At this point they are pretty close. The Taks have only 30 hours or so on them and they are morphing a bit. Until they settle down it's going to be hard to compare subtle differences.

[Vinnie R.]

All,

I'm also placing an order for TAK TA-300B's as well.  Once I get them and rack up some burn-in hours, I'll also post my
impressions of TA-300B vs. KR PX-4. 

Looking forward to it!

Vinnie

[rollo]

A quick update. I just listened again and with the tubes having only 4 1/2 hours on them, I would happily live with them as is and I've read that break in is 200-250 hours. Of course that's in a power amp and not the way they are being run in the LIO, so I guess I'll find out just how long. When I first listened last night what immediately came to mind was "Space, the final frontier." The sound stage is vast, with air and space and it just sounds scrumptious. And that's on a multi mic studio recording.
I have never heard my gear at any point in time sound this good to me.

If you havn't looked at my system, here's what it looks like from my chair:

Sweet Chris ENJOY !!!!


charles

[Vinnie R.]

All,

TAK TA-300B's should be here by the end of next week, and then I'll run them in for a few day and update this thread. 

Vinnie

[flkin]

Recently my DHT LIO with Tata TA-300Bs was sounding compressed. The sound stage smaller than what I remembered. Bass not as solid and highs sort of flatter.

I was in the midst of testing cables, trying to see if JSSG shielded cables  were better than plain ones on signal and DC cables.

Something was not right. I wasn't getting the usual fix of audio happiness after a session in the HiFi room. And I continue to fiddle with power supplies,  earthing, cables. And it got better in some configurations but not the usual magical feeling I normally feel.

Then it happened. What was that sound? A 65Hz hum from the left speaker. Surely an earthing problem. Unplugged one by one all components, power supplies, routers, UltraRendu, LPS-1 ultra capacitor supply. Eventually arrived at only the LIO and power amp on with nothing else attached. Still the hum. Swapped the  balanced cables on the LIO from left to right channel, the hum moved  to the right side speaker. Oh no, it's coming from the LIO for sure now.

Then suddenly the memory of what Vinnie said in bold came to me - keep your tube connectors clean. So I did my first cleaning in a long time. Ear buds, alcohol, the works. Amazing what black gunk comes out of those cleaning looking shiny gold connectors.

The hum disappeared. The magic all came back, soundstage regained to original size, bass much cleaner and solid, details and air in the treble all came back. It was like changing a new superior component.  It was beautiful again. A lesson learned - KEEP THOSE CONNECTORS CLEAN! It really makes a difference and saves a bunch of worries. In this hobby with so many variables affecting the sound, it can be a quite a task to troubleshoot problems. Worst still if there no clear problem but the sound is 80% of the potential all because of dirty connectors, what a waste of a good system. How long have I been listening to a sub-standard system I wonder?