Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!

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Hugh

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Re: Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!
« Reply #40 on: 20 Aug 2015, 10:54 pm »
Both FedEx & UPS are counting on people not wanting to waste their time to go to court and so they keep practicing their claim denial. :-)

In our case, not only did we file the claimed value amount but also the amount of time we spent on dealing with them at a certain $$ per hour.
Once they denied our claim, we sent them a letter to state as such.

Think about it, once they received the complaint form from the court, they will forward it to their legal department and I am sure it's better for them to settle out of court than pay their lawyer and take a chance at the mercy of the judge.

Having said that, we have practiced safe measures for quite a while now.
Prior to shipping, we took pictures of the box and the item(s) unboxed and boxed.
This will go a long way to prove negligence on their part.
Without pictures then it's impossible to prove anything to the judge.

bladesmith

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Re: Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!
« Reply #41 on: 20 Aug 2015, 11:08 pm »
mresseguie,

Hang in there, I know what it feels like. It just turns a "good" experience into a "bad" one.
And we all just want to listen to our music and enjoy our tunes..Right ?
So just let the process unfold, everything will be okay, when it's done !

(It sounds like you are being as proactive, as you can be..)

Good luck,
V...


Tomy2Tone

Re: Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!
« Reply #42 on: 20 Aug 2015, 11:37 pm »
Having said that, we have practiced safe measures for quite a while now.
Prior to shipping, we took pictures of the box and the item(s) unboxed and boxed.
This will go a long way to prove negligence on their part.
Without pictures then it's impossible to prove anything to the judge.

This is great advice. I think you or someone else has mentioned something like this before, thanks for reminding me!

mr_bill

Re: Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!
« Reply #43 on: 20 Aug 2015, 11:49 pm »
I'm going to do that next time - thanks Hugh.

Once you've had a bad shipping experience like that makes you not want to buy or sell anything again.

Photon46

Re: Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!
« Reply #44 on: 21 Aug 2015, 12:07 am »
Both FedEx & UPS are counting on people not wanting to waste their time to go to court and so they keep practicing their claim denial. :-)

In our case, not only did we file the claimed value amount but also the amount of time we spent on dealing with them at a certain $$ per hour.
Once they denied our claim, we sent them a letter to state as such.

Think about it, once they received the complaint form from the court, they will forward it to their legal department and I am sure it's better for them to settle out of court than pay their lawyer and take a chance at the mercy of the judge.

Having said that, we have practiced safe measures for quite a while now.
Prior to shipping, we took pictures of the box and the item(s) unboxed and boxed.
This will go a long way to prove negligence on their part.
Without pictures then it's impossible to prove anything to the judge.

Anyone who's been a long time reader of audio forums has seen multiple iterations of this sorry tale repeated over & over. Your advice is good counsel, document the fact that the shipper provided sufficient protection. I have read in several similar threads on other forums where folks who have worked for FedEx and UPS say those companies do indeed have a default "claim denied" response to damaged goods and they often won't settle unless the shipper is indeed willing to take them court. I have also read that UPS will often deny a claim unless the item was shipped in a brand new, previously unused box.

My workplace ships a lot of expensive artwork with FedEx. However, we only use them when time pressures are so urgent a gallery can't wait for an art shipper service or when we're shipping flat, unframed prints. Everything gets shipped encased in custom built plywood containers or crates, we never use cardboard boxes to ship anything, ever. Even then, FedEx manages to mangle and multilate shipments occasionally. It's not the falling off the conveyor belts in the warehouse that does our stuff in, it's the FedEx gorillas that have the keys to the forklifts that do the damage! There's no packaging on earth that withstand the assault of a runaway forklift blade :cry: We once had to re-fabricate and replace a $50,000 sculpture that took a direct forklift blade hit to the center of a crate in FEdEx's NYC airport terminal facility. (Replacement fabrication was done on our dime, FedEx won't insure Fine Art shipments for more than $500.00)

Folsom

Re: Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!
« Reply #45 on: 21 Aug 2015, 02:14 am »
Jesus Christ.... What can you do? It all seems so hopeless.... Maybe I should make an indestructible box. You can order whatever you want, but there's a massive deposit on the box you'll get back when it's returned. And a box that'll laugh at a forklift... Might be heavy.

I can't even imagine the art shipping thing... Would they ash their cigs on the Mona Lisa?




Q3Di

Re: Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!
« Reply #46 on: 21 Aug 2015, 02:20 am »
I sold my speakers on Audiogon and ship them via FedEx Ground. Before I shipped them, I took several pictures of the items and the original shipping carton (double boxes). I brought them to FedEx Store to ship them with the insurance amount same as the agreed upon amount to include shipping.
When the speakers arrived in Southern CA from the East Coast. The outer boxes were damaged but the recipient still signed to accept the packages.
He opened and inspected the speakers after the driver left. The inner and outer boxes were damaged, the cabinet of both speakers were damaged, the drivers of one speaker fell off. The buyer contacted me and asked how I gonna reimburse him for the repair or refund. I asked the buyer to hold on to the items and take the pictures of the items and boxes. I also asked the buyer to allow me time to straight things out with FedEx.

I called FedEx to file a claim. The service rep emailed me the claim form with the FedEx Store as shipper (I am not the shipper because they were not shipped with my FedEx account which I don't have one). They required supporting information for the claim amount and the proof of damages. I submitted the claim form with my supporting documents to include the sale agreement from Audiogon (ad and PM), the PayPal receipt, the pictures before and after, and the manufacture service department contact info for parts/services.

I emailed and called FedEx to check the status of the claim. They said that they will send somebody to inspect the items, they won't reimburse me to repair more than the insured amount. But they would pickup the items and pay me the insured amount, assuming they purchase them from me that I never agreed to sell to FedEx in the first place and the buyer wished to keep the items plus cash. Two weeks later FedEx sent me the check for the insured amount and they never contacted the recipient to inspect or pick up the items. The buyer received his full refund and kept the speakers.

I suggest to ask the buyer for patient and not to ship the item anywhere for repair or estimate. Ask the manufacture or the authorized service center for the quote to repair or rebuild the unit. Declare "totaled" if it is reasonable to believe that the repair costs are more than the market value or the sale price.

Good luck!

agdev01

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Re: Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!
« Reply #47 on: 21 Aug 2015, 02:22 am »
My workplace ships a lot of expensive artwork with FedEx. However, we only use them when time pressures are so urgent a gallery can't wait for an art shipper service or when we're shipping flat, unframed prints. Everything gets shipped encased in custom built plywood containers or crates, we never use cardboard boxes to ship anything, ever. Even then, FedEx manages to mangle and multilate shipments occasionally. It's not the falling off the conveyor belts in the warehouse that does our stuff in, it's the FedEx gorillas that have the keys to the forklifts that do the damage! There's no packaging on earth that withstand the assault of a runaway forklift blade :cry: We once had to re-fabricate and replace a $50,000 sculpture that took a direct forklift blade hit to the center of a crate in FEdEx's NYC airport terminal facility. (Replacement fabrication was done on our dime, FedEx won't insure Fine Art shipments for more than $500.00)

You are absolutely correct about forklifts being a danger.  I lost a Mac 7270 from the blade of a forklift going through the box and crushing the right front of the amp.

mresseguie

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Re: Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!
« Reply #48 on: 23 Aug 2015, 07:23 am »
Here's an update as of Friday morning (life's been keeping me extra busy, so I'm only now posting this).

The Sim Audio Engineer I spoke with emailed me Friday morning (Kudos to him for speedy reply!). Based on the pictures taken by the buyer, the best guess estimate for repairs came out to $1700 for a 'best case' scenario of no damage to the IC board. If the IC board is damaged, a new Amplifier costing $5800 would be required because there are no more of the IC boards available for this amp.

I sent this info to Agon right after I read the email. I'm hoping for some news by Monday. Presumably, the insurance company will declare it 'totaled' because the least expensive repair is greater than the amp's value (but I'm not in the insurance industry, so who knows?).

mresseguie

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Re: Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!
« Reply #49 on: 13 Oct 2015, 02:15 pm »
I wanted to update this thread because I just received my refund from the insurance company. My amp was insured for $1500 and that is exactly what I was refunded today.

The moral(s) of this story is/are DOUBLE BOX all equipment that you plan to ship, and do insure it especially if it is a high value item. I still do not know the name of the insurance company as everything was handled through Audiogon's rep. I was told it would take approximately 30 days and that was pretty close to the actual time. I was given the option of taking the refund via Paypal instead of snail mail, so I opted for Paypal. (It's already in my account.)

Closure....

Hugh

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Re: Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!
« Reply #50 on: 13 Oct 2015, 02:34 pm »
Glad to hear Mike.
I wanted to update this thread because I just received my refund from the insurance company. My amp was insured for $1500 and that is exactly what I was refunded today.

The moral(s) of this story is/are DOUBLE BOX all equipment that you plan to ship, and do insure it especially if it is a high value item. I still do not know the name of the insurance company as everything was handled through Audiogon's rep. I was told it would take approximately 30 days and that was pretty close to the actual time. I was given the option of taking the refund via Paypal instead of snail mail, so I opted for Paypal. (It's already in my account.)

Closure....

Tomy2Tone

Re: Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!
« Reply #51 on: 13 Oct 2015, 03:27 pm »
Wow, that's great Michael! Good for you!

My only gripe with FedEx right now is I've had two packages within the last month that have come from the other side of the country to arrive in Phoenix in less than 48 hrs but because they're 3 to 4 days ahead of the "estimated day of delivery" they choose to sit on the package until the expected day has come.  :|  But at least nothing has been damaged, (knock on wood).

RDavidson

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Re: Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!
« Reply #52 on: 13 Oct 2015, 04:36 pm »
+1. That IS great.
It's good to see Audiogon pulling through for you. I've never really dealt with this type of thing before, but if I ever need to sell something on Agon, your story is reassuring to me and others here. :thumb:

bacobits1

Re: Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!
« Reply #53 on: 13 Oct 2015, 07:22 pm »
Yea!!!! That's great!
I always dealt with Fed Ex from my end when I ship not through Audiogn.

mcgsxr

Re: Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!
« Reply #54 on: 13 Oct 2015, 08:14 pm »
Glad to hear about your "happy ending".

I shipped some Maggie MMG's recently, and they arrived damaged.  Because I packed them, UPS would cover loss only.  International shipping did not leave me many choices.

I ended up working out partial payment to the buyer, on terms we agreed on.  He was good about it, and I was realistic.

I lost $ on the deal by about 50% vs selling them locally, but life happens.

aldcoll

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Re: Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!
« Reply #55 on: 13 Oct 2015, 09:01 pm »
Glad the hear that it is settled.  Not the type of thing you want hanging over your head when you are half way around the world.

SteveFord

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Re: Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!
« Reply #56 on: 13 Oct 2015, 11:14 pm »
I was wondering what happened and I'm glad to hear a happy ending.

a.wayne

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Re: Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!
« Reply #57 on: 26 Oct 2015, 09:00 pm »
Words of advice re FedEx.

We recently shipped a box through them and it arrived undamaged on the outside but the item was shattered beyond repair.
We honestly didn't know how it could happen since we took extra measures to ensure they were packaged extremely well.

Anyway, we asked the customer to take pictures as well as filing a claim with FedEx.
The first automatic response from FedEx was we didn't pack it good enough and the claim was denied.
The customer then asked FedEx how can you denied a claim without seeing the pictures of the damaged item.
FedEx then admitted they were rushed to conclusion and asked for pictures.
The customer never heard back from them so I had to call FedEx myself and pointed out to them, from the pictures, that there is a visible dent right in the middle of the box which was not there when we handed the box over to FedEx.

To make a long story short, all we got was Claim Denied.
We resolved to take them to Small Claim Court and they settled out of court prior to court date.

By the way, FedEx never sent anybody to inspect the item.


Yep..... they are Federal alright , aside note , Fed-ex does not insure packages nor do they use the term insurance when they take your money,  .....  :evil:

a.wayne

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Re: Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!
« Reply #58 on: 26 Oct 2015, 09:14 pm »
I wanted to update this thread because I just received my refund from the insurance company. My amp was insured for $1500 and that is exactly what I was refunded today.

The moral(s) of this story is/are DOUBLE BOX all equipment that you plan to ship, and do insure it especially if it is a high value item. I still do not know the name of the insurance company as everything was handled through Audiogon's rep. I was told it would take approximately 30 days and that was pretty close to the actual time. I was given the option of taking the refund via Paypal instead of snail mail, so I opted for Paypal. (It's already in my account.)

Closure....

When did the buyer get refunded ..?

mresseguie

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Re: Damaged amplifier advice needed...Fedex delivery gone wrong!
« Reply #59 on: 27 Oct 2015, 04:36 am »
Hi. I refunded the buyer approximately one week after he received the amp. The only reason it took that long was because I needed 'permission' from the Agon rep to do so. He told me the insurance company's policy is for the refund to be made only after the refund (to me) has been approved.

I refunded the buyer the sale price and shipping to and from his location. The amp is in storage until I return to the States. Then, I will ship it to Sim Audio for repairs. Then, hopefully, I will sell it CAREFULLY.