Re: Just saying hi => Omega questions => Super 7 XRS on the way! => Now Here!!

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beowulf

Thanks Jorgen, I don't know how much real world difference there is between the 95 and 93db.  I haven't noticed any change in volume settings when I've switched drivers.  But then, I wasn't looking for any at the time.

Progress report.......

Had been running KT150 power tubes in my Inspire amp for 10wpc.  Also at 10wpc I've tried Winged C EL34, Ei KT90/KT99 and Tung-Sol 6550.  Nothing special experienced with the KT90 and 6550.  The EL34 had exceptional bass.  Went back to KT150's and felt this was still the most natural over all.  But.......

Then I tried the Pope 6V6's for 5wpc and,  , everything has changed.  I hope I don't eat my words later, but this sound was amazing.  I'm still getting confident about the lower power.  I feel vulnerability about the possibility of distortion or breakup, but I think it is psychological since I've never run with less than 10wpc before these.  They compete very well with the EL34's in bass, but out do them everywhere else.  The proverbial hearing things I haven't heard before in familiar recordings while managing to come off smoother and less fatiguing than anything I've had yet.  The Omegas shine all the more when fed a signal like this!  I think this is now the tube to beat (for me).

.......Peter

P.S. - @beowolf,   We watched a show last night (New Girl, if it matters).  As I've said, I have a pre/pro in front of the Inspire amp when watching video and cross over at 70-90db to subs to lessen the demand on the Omegas (2 channel music the Omegas run full range with subs to supplement).  The Omegas did fine with the 5wpc in this setup.  I don't know how it would be running them full range for video though.  And this was with a sitcom type show.  I should try a movie with loud effects to really see how it does.

Thanks for the update Peter.  When I use the Decware Taboo for music the loudness was fine, but for some reason movies especially quiet dialog scenes (which seems strange, but for some reason explosions and action sequences seemed more ok...?) the Taboo just did not have enough juice and that's with the RS7V's @ 95dB.  The Decware Taboo needs 2.5v for maximum output and my source (Rega DAC) was shy of that at 2.1v.  Now that I have a Preamp in front of the Taboo with a gain of exactly 2.5v the Taboo really opened up and I have a lot of headroom for all my volume needs.  So much so that I can't help wondering if I have enough juice to run the Alnico's now and how they would sound :icon_twisted:, but of course there's always that thought in the back of my head that is saying it was frustrating not having enough headroom as before so I should stick with the ferrites.

I'm patiently waiting for more info on the Paramounts and maybe one day (if budget allows) I will be able to upgrade to a 2.1 Paramount setup.  One thing for sure is that no matter what Omega driver one is using you can expect amazing sound quality and no doubt one of the best bang for the buck speakers out there!

pstrisik

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Roger that!


FireGuy

"One thing for sure is that no matter what Omega driver one is using you can expect amazing sound quality and no doubt one of the best bang for the buck speakers out there!"

I so emphatically agree!

Guy 13

"One thing for sure is that no matter what Omega driver one is using you can expect amazing sound quality and no doubt one of the best bang for the buck speakers out there!"

I so emphatically agree!

 :thumb:

Guy 13

Hi all.
A lot of audiophiles wont buy or even try to listen to point source, extended range, crossover less drivers mainly because most of them have a pronounce peak around 2-5KHz, but I can say that Louis took care of that problem with his drivers, to a point that it's almost non-existent.
If I went with the open baffle dipole arrangement with Louis driver, it's because it was inexpensive to evaluate his drivers and I like the open baffle arrangement.
His bookshelves units are inexpensive (500 USD) if you want to try the point source driver and in the eventuality that you don't like them, (Which could happen, but I dought) you can always re-sell it at almost the same price you have paid.   
Stop looking for the best of the best and try them.

Guy 13


DaveC113

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Thanks Jorgen, I don't know how much real world difference there is between the 95 and 93db.  I haven't noticed any change in volume settings when I've switched drivers.  But then, I wasn't looking for any at the time.

Progress report.......

Had been running KT150 power tubes in my Inspire amp for 10wpc.  Also at 10wpc I've tried Winged C EL34, Ei KT90/KT99 and Tung-Sol 6550.  Nothing special experienced with the KT90 and 6550.  The EL34 had exceptional bass.  Went back to KT150's and felt this was still the most natural over all.  But.......

Then I tried the Pope 6V6's for 5wpc and,  , everything has changed.  I hope I don't eat my words later, but this sound was amazing.  I'm still getting confident about the lower power.  I feel vulnerability about the possibility of distortion or breakup, but I think it is psychological since I've never run with less than 10wpc before these.  They compete very well with the EL34's in bass, but out do them everywhere else.  The proverbial hearing things I haven't heard before in familiar recordings while managing to come off smoother and less fatiguing than anything I've had yet.  The Omegas shine all the more when fed a signal like this!  I think this is now the tube to beat (for me).

.......Peter


Cool, thanks. I have not tried the 6V6 yet either, I think my amp runs too hot for them but I could use them with a minor change or two.

I take it your amp runs in UL mode? Can you switch it to triode mode? If so I would encourage you to try it, triode mode is more natural sounding imo. Even if there is no switch it could be done internally pretty easily.

The extra power in UL mode is nice, but not strictly necessary, 5 w seems to run the RS5 close to it's limits and I'd guess the 7 can't handle too much more but IDK, it is best Louis doesn't give away too much info as his drivers are world class AND relatively inexpensive. You could put his drivers in fancy boxes and sell them for 5 figures easy.


pstrisik

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Cool, thanks. I have not tried the 6V6 yet either, I think my amp runs too hot for them but I could use them with a minor change or two.

I take it your amp runs in UL mode? Can you switch it to triode mode? If so I would encourage you to try it, triode mode is more natural sounding imo. Even if there is no switch it could be done internally pretty easily.

The extra power in UL mode is nice, but not strictly necessary, 5 w seems to run the RS5 close to it's limits and I'd guess the 7 can't handle too much more but IDK, it is best Louis doesn't give away too much info as his drivers are world class AND relatively inexpensive. You could put his drivers in fancy boxes and sell them for 5 figures easy.

There's a lot of technicals that I am not versed in.  UL vs. triode mode, for example, I associate with push pull amps - is that true?  Mine is a single ended pentode design.  No switch, no biasing despite the wide range of tubes it can use.

.........Peter

DaveC113

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Ok, that makes sense.... so your amp is a SEP (Single Ended Pentode) and not a SET (SE Triode). Basically, pentodes have 2 additional "grids", more info if you care:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentode

So you get double the power using the tube as a pentode vs triode, UL operation accomplishes increasing the power to similar levels as pentode operation using positive feedback from the OPTs to the control screen.

It may be possible to operate your amp in triode mode too, but it is less likely than if it was a UL amp.



pstrisik

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Ok, that makes sense.... so your amp is a SEP (Single Ended Pentode) and not a SET (SE Triode). Basically, pentodes have 2 additional "grids", more info if you care:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentode

So you get double the power using the tube as a pentode vs triode, UL operation accomplishes increasing the power to similar levels as pentode operation using positive feedback from the OPTs to the control screen.

It may be possible to operate your amp in triode mode too, but it is less likely than if it was a UL amp.

I'm not going to mess with Dennis Had's design.  He is one of the masters in tube amp design and I trust his expertise.  It does give me the freedom to roll with a very, very wide range of tubes though, so experimentation is underway in that regard! 


DaveC113

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For sure, I would not mess with it unless Dennis gives his blessing. On some amps you can switch between operating modes with the flip of a switch, but pentode mode requires a bit more complexity than UL mode and it is likely the amp was designed only for pentode operation. In any case, it sounds like a very nice amp.  :thumb:



jorgen

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Hi all
Got a question for you. A friend of mine got a Audiomat prelude amp. (Please read up for more info)
What would you recommend for speakers in a semi large room.  I guess they would explain they're listening habits as every day use. Not intensive listening

Canada Rob

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Hello jorgen,

The Prelude uses EL34 tubes.  My experience with EL34s is they are warmer and more laid back than the other octal based tubes I have heard.
In a semi large room I would recommend the Super 7XRS with RS7 (ferrite).  If the amp can roll tubes and he can go to 6550, 6L6, 6N3CE, etc. then I would look at the same speaker but with the RS7A (alnico) driver.  If the listening was more intensive, I would go to the Alnico XRS.

Roger A. Modjeski

Ok, that makes sense.... so your amp is a SEP (Single Ended Pentode) and not a SET (SE Triode). Basically, pentodes have 2 additional "grids", more info if you care:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentode

So you get double the power using the tube as a pentode vs triode, UL operation accomplishes increasing the power to similar levels as pentode operation using positive feedback from the OPTs to the control screen.

It may be possible to operate your amp in triode mode too, but it is less likely than if it was a UL amp.

UltraLinear (UL) operation uses negative not positive feedback from the output transformer to feed the screen grid. The advantage is lower output impedance and better linearity than either a triode or pentode. Output power is closer to the pentode than the triode mode depending on the  percentage of the tap which is typically 40%. The Music Reference RM-9 is ultralinear.

kbuzz3

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The latest and greatest from Louis will be 12" subwoofers and his Paramount line.  He is one of the very few speaker manufacturers that has his own drivers.

Not to hijack but would someone be kind enough to post a link to a thread for info on what the new paramount line is.  Id also be curious to know if the recent thread with the built in subwoofer is a custom one off, or is going into production…..


thanks

Canada Rob

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Not to hijack but would someone be kind enough to post a link to a thread for info on what the new paramount line is.  Id also be curious to know if the recent thread with the built in subwoofer is a custom one off, or is going into production…..


thanks
Hello kbuzz3,
When we are closer to finalizing the Paramount line, there will information about it.  It will be Omega's top of the line.  The info about the combi speaker is on this thread: http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=126921.0

jorgen

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Pstrisik wrote
I don't know the volume of my cabinet.  It is 32 x 14 x 9 ½, so could be calculated if you can convert cubic inches to liters.  :o  You could compare measurements at least.  Edit:  Ok, I tried it.  4256 cubic inches = 69.7433 liters according to an online conversion calculator. 

Uhm, no there must something wrong somewhereI think, difference between our speakers are that yours are 3" wider and mine 3"taller I think, and I don't think that would make the volume of your speakers so much bigger as 37 liters, mine are "only"32. Could be Louis are referring to the net to volume or something.

I am now also curious about the newer version of the RS7A as it seems we are in the same situation with the Super 7 XRS and same Alnico driver.

........Peter

[/quote]

Sure would like to at least hear what differneces would be between the two versions of the 7"alnico when they are done. If Louis believe it will be noticeable and worth some sort of trade in or , as he says, swap of course I will do that.

pstrisik

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Quote
Pstrisik wrote
I don't know the volume of my cabinet.  It is 32 x 14 x 9 ½, so could be calculated if you can convert cubic inches to liters.  :o  You could compare measurements at least.  Edit:  Ok, I tried it.  4256 cubic inches = 69.7433 liters according to an online conversion calculator. 

Uhm, no there must something wrong somewhere I think, difference between our speakers are that yours are 3" wider and mine 3"taller I think, and I don't think that would make the volume of your speakers so much bigger as 37 liters, mine are "only"32. Could be Louis are referring to the net to volume or something.

Quote
I am now also curious about the newer version of the RS7A as it seems we are in the same situation with the Super 7 XRS and same Alnico driver.

........Peter


Sure would like to at least hear what differences would be between the two versions of the 7"alnico when they are done. If Louis believe it will be noticeable and worth some sort of trade in or , as he says, swap of course I will do that.

Hi Jorgen,

I'm not sure what you mean by the differences in the alnico drivers.  Now that we've sorted out what's what, do you mean the difference between the RS7A and the 6" Hempcone Alnico?  If so, I don't think they are interchangeable without cabinet modification given the difference size and bolt pattern.  Otherwise, I think we established that the 7A and RS7A are the same driver (that is, we have the RS7A).

Regarding the cab volume..  I redid my calculations and got the same thing, so maybe I'm doing something wrong.  Anyone know what the volume in liters is for 32" x 14" x 9.5"?  I just multiplied the dimensions for 4256 cubic inches and converted to liters with an online calculator.  Even if we are talking inside dimensions instead of outside, I wouldn't think the difference would be almost double.

And completely off topic.....  We just aborted watching the TV series Lillyhammer as it got a bit too negative.  It was fun while it lasted.  Fun watching Springsteen's guitarist excel in acting.  Unfortunately though, it seemed to portray Norwegians in a bad light.  How has it been received over there?

.........Peter



« Last Edit: 4 Jul 2014, 10:23 pm by pstrisik »

seikosha

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When you calculating cabinet volume you need to subtract the space used for bracing, and in the case of some of Louis' designs, the sand that he uses.  Also, you need to know the thickness of the walls.  Unless you open up your speakers and really take a look at what's inside, you won't truly be able to calculate the volume accurately.

pstrisik

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When you calculating cabinet volume you need to subtract the space used for bracing, and in the case of some of Louis' designs, the sand that he uses.  Also, you need to know the thickness of the walls.  Unless you open up your speakers and really take a look at what's inside, you won't truly be able to calculate the volume accurately.

Thanks.  That's what I started to realize.  Still surprising that calculating with the outside dimensions makes such a big difference - something like 69 vs. 37 liters.

......Peter

jorgen

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Hi Peter
Regarding the issue with drivers; i read Louis's earlier post in this thread that he was working on a 7"alnico driver, and that he offered a swap with the drivers I have. Of course I may have misunderstood his post and intensions but I think he is working on something. Then, if so, of course I am interested in that product. I believe we , at the moment , have the same kind of 7"drivers. Curios if you have been trying out the ferrite based drivers more. I believe your initial impressions favored those, but then leaned to the alnicos . Big difference?

Regarding the differences in cabinets, yours are a bit bigger, maybe a little more soundstage and maybe a little more bass? Size matters....

Listening to: Grant Lee Buffalo , a band I loved being twenty and a promising young lad... Later: Wes Montgomery, being a older and laid back grown up..