JVC RX-ES1sl

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Jay S

JVC RX-ES1sl
« Reply #240 on: 6 Sep 2004, 05:38 am »
Thanks for the tip... will have to try this wonder grease out!  

I've been eagerly catching up on this thread.  I will be especially interested to hear to what extent mods are able to have a significant cost-effective impact on this little JVC.  I love the idea that JVC is using "hybrid" amplification... I would be very happy it the performance got to the point (which still being quite cheap) that I could happily replace my Joule tube preamp and Acoustic Reality digital amp.  

Hmm, the Acoustic Reality uses uses an "analog" implementation of iCEpower digital -- it takes an analog input signal and I guess you'd need an A/D converter to feed it digital.  My amp sounds very liquid and coherent and just plain musical when fed a high quality analog (e.g. great transport to TubeDac to Joule tube pre)... seems similar on paper to the little JVC!   :o   Has anyone spotted iCEpower modules beneath the hood of the JVC?  I think the circuit boards are about the size of credit cards.

geofstro

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JVC RX-ES1sl
« Reply #241 on: 6 Sep 2004, 08:36 am »
Well I've had my JVC ES1SL hooked up for a week now. I thought I'd wait 'till it had a bit of a chance to warm up before posting some impressions.

Here in Europe I found the cheapest price at a German online dealer. The receiver itself was going for Euros349; but if I bought it as part of a cine-pak which includes a DVD player, the package was only Euros299.00. Go figure!

I've seen what looks to be basically the same JVC DVD player for sale locally for Euros 199.00 by itself, so given prices on this side of the Atlantic I don't think I did too badly.

Being a Euro model all the analogue connectors are scart/peritel, apart from the DVD-Multi which are, of course, standard RCA.

I've just reached the 100 Hour mark and my impressions so far are pretty much in line with what others have said here. I find this a romantic amp, very tubey sounding, in the nicest possible ways. As it's warming up I hear the soundstage expanding in terms of depth; but not so much laterally. Mind you this is on Ed Schillings Horns and horn speakers are not exactly known for being soundstage champs, so I think the soundstage is actually very good.

Like some of you here, I find the DVD-Multi to be significantly better, overall, than the other inputs. The sound opens up and breathes more naturally through DVD-Multi. In comparison, standard DVD sounded a little constrained and coaxial digital even more so. Having said that I listened to a live radio broadcast of Chick Corea through the scart connection from my STB and the sound of this concert was awesome. This is using a cable service  which routes certain sattelite radio transmissions to subscribers in Monaco. I brought some High Quality Tech+Link scart connections and I'm going to have to listen some more through these connections. The built in FM tuner in the receiver sounds a little closed in by comparison.

I've only used the Toslink connector to connect an Apple Airport Express for streaming audio from my Mac using iTunes. I must admit, using non-compressed aiff or WAV files this sounded amazingly good. It might even be worth my while investing in one of those Glass Toslinks Chairguy's been talking about.

For hooking up either CD or my Turntable, though, it sounds like DVD-Multi is the best option. I've got my TT hooked up to it right now and I'm getting beautiful results. High quality LP's are sounding very impressive and mediocre ones are still very listenable. I think this is because you don't really hear any harshness or exaggerated sibilance through this receiver.

A session with the TT confirmed for me that this is a very enjoyable little amp. The higher the quality source you feed into it the more you hear what it can do, and probably my TT set-up is my best source.

For CD playback I used a CEC TLX2 feeding a GW labs anti-jitter device via AES/EBU to a Meitner Bidat via Coaxial. I also got some very good results here, except to say that on certain disks the end result was a bit too lush, romantic and warm. I think this could be partly because the Bidat (which has all the latest mods) also has a very rich and full sound, especially in the mid-bass and together with the JVC it can be a case of a bit too much of a good thing.

In another system I've been evaluating the little TEAC amp and been very impressed by its transarency and timbral accuracy. What I like about the TEAC was perfectly described a couple of pages back by Mudjock when he said
Quote
For a lot of music, I preferred the Panny - which is transparent to a fault, but maybe a little thin sounding. The dead silent background gives instruments a very natural sounding attack and decay - which I am finding quite addictive


I imagine the TEAC and the Panny's have a very similar sound in this respect. So far though, the TEAC has proved less than satisfactory on larger scale orchestral music. Massed strings and classical music are obviously something the JVC excels at. I don't think it has the timbral accuracy of the TEAC or the Pannys though, which is frustrating. I could find myself using one amp for one kind of music and another for other kinds, which would mean that neither would really be a complete solution.

Both amps are warming up though, so it's probably too early to tell. And then there's the mods.

Another frustration with the JVC is that to really hear it at its best you need to use DVD-Multi, for which there is only one connector.

Dmason came to the conclusion that a tube preamp is not necessary with this amp and can distract from its virtues, and I'm taking his comments into consideration; but there's no other way to have multiple sources going into the DVD-Multi connector without swapping connections. I'm going to try my Fi Y tube pre-amp for sheer practical reasons and post how it works out. I'll let the JVC reach the 200 Hours mark first though.

geoff

TheChairGuy

JVC RX-ES1sl
« Reply #242 on: 6 Sep 2004, 05:57 pm »
geofstro,

Give it another 200 hours - it'll only get better.

Glad to hear we got another convert.... :wink:

jswallac

JVC RX-ES1sl
« Reply #243 on: 6 Sep 2004, 06:49 pm »
I have to admit I have been quite underwhelmed so far by my JVC.  It only has about 50 hours on it, so perhaps that may explain it.  It is hard to imagine, however, that it will raise to the level experienced by others.  I am having serious sellers remorse over my Jolida tube integrated.  I am also worried I may have a defective unit.  It gets real hot, which I somewhat expected, but also smells a bit like something is toasting inside.  Has anybody experienced a burning odor from their amp?  I notified the store I bought this from, and they did agree to an exchange.  So I guess it is best to start the burn in process (hopefully not literally this time) again.

BTW, I noticed that samdodokh, the ebay retailer, has raised the price from $179 to $206.  They must have had some feedback that these little units are getting a following.  Since they also charge shipping, the newer unit is starting to look like a better deal.

gary

JVC RX-ES1sl
« Reply #244 on: 6 Sep 2004, 07:32 pm »
jswallac-

definitely sounds like you got a bad one. my jvc is warm to the touch, but never what i'd call hot. and there's certainly never been a burning smell coming with it. exchanging it is the right thing to do, and hopefully the new one sounds better too (i'm pretty sure it will).

gary

AphileEarlyAdopter

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JVC RX-ES1sl
« Reply #245 on: 6 Sep 2004, 11:32 pm »
The Mapleshade Silclear is a great product. Walker is getting inspired by Mapleshade a lot, the SST, is probably  something like Silclear or probably better. The Vivid itself I think incorporates the polishing aspects of Mikrosmooth. I could be wrong and Walker might be first on this.
Anyways, two more highly recommended tweaks from are 1) Herbies Grungebuster Mat 2) Walker Vivid (or probably the new Auric Illuminator. 2a) I also mark the edges and transparent parts of the CD with a black marker.

If I had a good DAC, I would try the JVC. The XR50, IMHO, is a very tranparent and a flat sounding device. It might sound a little recessed in the mids. I think this is wholly or party addressed by adding a balanced power conditioner which to some compensates for the weak power supply in the XR50. Steve @ Empirical Audio thinks that the XR45 he modded leaves Sim Audio separates in the dust when it comes to the mids and highs. He thinks the bass is woolly in comparison. But I think his reference standards are pretty high. I  am waiting to hear a JVC. Hopefully I will get to meet ChairGuy and his JVC soon.

Dmason

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JVC RX-ES1sl
« Reply #246 on: 6 Sep 2004, 11:36 pm »
jswallac,

I think it would be good just to unplug the unit and send it back. I agree with Panda/Gary that it should never get hotter than "quite warm," under operating conditions. In my experience, whether in audio or in the kitchen, if something smells like it is burning, it usually is. :lol:  Get those eBay-ers to pony up a good machine for you. Seems there have been some problems/issues with the ones coming from Costco and this online source. I recommend anyone reading this, thinking about pulling the trigger, to sport for a new unit from a bona fide retailer. Good news is the new price is already trending downward by %10 in one chunk.

If GeofStro is hearing anything  along the lines of what I and Seminarian are hearing, I would say that the JVC + Fostex combination is pretty much on top of the food chain, sonically, for such an affordable investment, I cannot imagine it getting much better. We'll see what the AlNiCo drivers do pretty soon. Madisound emailed me to say they are on the way!  :D

geofstro

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JVC RX-ES1sl
« Reply #247 on: 7 Sep 2004, 10:47 am »
I checked mine and it is also just warm to the touch after being on for a solid week. According to my English copy of the manual (which I had to download since English isn't considered an important enough language here in Europe, to include in the manual with all the other languages) it should shut down by iteslf when it overheats.

Perhaps whatever protection circuitry is meant to kick-in, isn't on the defective unit.

I'm gald to say, the only thing that's hot about mine so far is the sound!

geoff

PhilNYC

JVC RX-ES1sl
« Reply #248 on: 7 Sep 2004, 12:55 pm »
Just curious...I can't seem to find this (or the F10) on the JVC website.  Anyone have a link to a product description page for any of these digital/slimline receivers from JVC?

tvyankee

JVC RX-ES1sl
« Reply #249 on: 7 Sep 2004, 01:00 pm »
hey phil.

go to ebay an type in the model number.

or www.jandr.com and you will find it.

i think he likes it.

Jay S

JVC RX-ES1sl
« Reply #250 on: 7 Sep 2004, 01:20 pm »

tvyankee

JVC RX-ES1sl
« Reply #251 on: 7 Sep 2004, 08:05 pm »
i don't know  if this means anything to anybody but i found it today while surfing the net.

http://www.puredigitalaudio.org/home/index.shtml

might want to check it out.

tubeytubeamp

JVC RX-ES1sl
« Reply #252 on: 7 Sep 2004, 09:42 pm »
Nice site,

Check out this review;

http://www.puredigitalaudio.org/digitalamplifiers/articles/zenith_DA3520/index.shtml#HowItSounds

Look at their products page, as to what they say are pure digital amps and hybrid amps.

[/url]http://www.puredigitalaudio.org/resourcesSections.shtml[url]

Dennis

ooheadsoo

JVC RX-ES1sl
« Reply #253 on: 7 Sep 2004, 10:59 pm »
Anyone know how many amps this guy draws?  I'm thinking about a cheap line conditioner and am wondering if 5 amps would be enough.

crbaldwin

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Still humming problems
« Reply #254 on: 8 Sep 2004, 10:55 pm »
Well, crap.  I reported many pages ago that my RX-ES1SL was sending a thumping sound through my subwoofer when powering up plus significant humming audible from several feet away.  I tried an inexpensive line conditioner but it did not help.  I just exchanged it for a new one and have the same problems!

I have to turn the "volume" knob on my subwoofer way down to get the humming to reasonable levels.  But then, of course, I can't get reasonable bass out of the receiver even by turning the subwoofer level way up.

I had no problems anything like this with my previous receiver (Kenwood Sovereign).  Is anyone using a subwoofer with this receiver?  I can't imagine I got 2 bad ones in a row?

beepx3

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Re: Still humming problems
« Reply #255 on: 8 Sep 2004, 11:00 pm »
Quote from: crbaldwin
Well, crap.  I reported many pages ago that my RX-ES1SL was sending a thumping sound through my subwoofer when powering up plus significant humming audible from several feet away.  I tried an inexpensive line conditioner but it did not help.  I just exchanged it for a new one and have the same problems!

I have to turn the "volume" knob on my subwoofer way down to get the humming to reasonable levels.  But then, of course, I can't get reasonable bass out of the receiver even by turning the subwoofer level ...


Are you using Multi DVD in? If so, you need to have a subwoofer input to get sub out.

Otherwise, the sub out should just work with the other input selections.

crbaldwin

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JVC RX-ES1sl
« Reply #256 on: 8 Sep 2004, 11:05 pm »
This is with digital input and the humming doesn't seem to be affected by the subwoofer level.

ooheadsoo

JVC RX-ES1sl
« Reply #257 on: 9 Sep 2004, 12:34 am »
Sounds like a ground loop problem from my limited knowledge.  I'm using a subwoofer with no problems in dvd mode.  With analog inputs, the sub won't work without a dedicated sub in, but I have no idea what would happen with a digital input.

beepx3

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JVC RX-ES1sl
« Reply #258 on: 9 Sep 2004, 12:50 am »
Quote from: crbaldwin
This is with digital input and the humming doesn't seem to be affected by the subwoofer level.


It sounds like you have a bad ground connection to your sub. Maybe the cable to the sub is bad or the sub has a ground loop. Can you run the sub using the speaker outputs?

I doubt it's the JVC since you already replaced it. I'm using the sub out without any problems.

tubeytubeamp

JVC RX-ES1sl
« Reply #259 on: 9 Sep 2004, 01:50 am »
I have a few hundred hours on the JVC now and love the sound of the unit. However, the sound of the fan really annoys me.

Is there any way of disconnecting the fan? At low volumes the sound is clearly audible. The fan is positioned to cool off the power supply. Could the fan be disconnected and holes drilled into the top of the unit to help dissipate the heat.

Any help is greatly appreciated.

Dennis