Living with the X-Statik's once again...

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Chops

Living with the X-Statik's once again...
« on: 1 Jul 2013, 02:20 am »
So as many of you know, I swapped some ideas around, then ended up swapping some speakers around and ended up putting my X-Statik's back in action. Over the weekend, listening to plenty of music of all types, reading many threads in this very forum about the X-Statik's, OB-5's, OB-7's and even planar and electrostat types, I've taken all of it in as far as speaker placement is concerned, as well as what Danny has told me.

Just a few days ago in another thread, I swore I had these speakers in the perfect spot because of the results I was getting. Well, through most of the day today I have been tweaking speaker placement a little bit at a time. They are now exactly 8' apart from the inner edges of the baffles, 10' 4" to my ears, toed in just a couple of degrees, and exactly 36" from the front wall to the backs of the midrange magnets. I did not make measurements as I was adjusting the positions. I just took those measurements now as I'm typing this.

What this has done to the sound is improve it way past what it was just a couple days ago when I thought it sounded great then. The phantom center image is locked in place and nearly life-sized. There's more space and air around the speakers and instruments. The sound stage has grown deeper and wider, pushing the front wall back another 5' or so it seems as well as spanning out 4' - 5' beyond the outside edges of the speakers.

Midrange and treble performance has become more unified and neutral. Then again, they are OB's, so they should be to start with, but the speaker placement has helped, getting those rear reflections a little later to the listening position so they're not smearing the original signal from the front wave. It's amazing what only a few inches of adjustment can do. There was also a little upper bass hump (maybe somewhere around 80-100Hz) that has now flattened out pretty much level with the rest of the bass range. Most likely from pulling the right speaker out of the corner since the left channel is right by the hallway.

Speaking of bass, I think the X-Statik's are a perfect match to my little Monarchy Audio SM-70 Pro amp. This amp only puts out 25 watts of Class A power, but it has the ability to grab the X-Statik's drivers by the balls and take total control of them no matter what the music playing through them calls for. Typically, this type of control causes a leanness in the bass, but not so with this amp/speaker combo. In fact, I don't ever recall these speakers digging this low in the bass register before, and definitely not this cleanly. Pipe organ sounds really good on them now. There's just a large amount of agility and articulation going on that makes for a very tuneful, natural, realistic bass with plenty of detail. It's a fast and vibrant bass with zest and power.

Everything I have listened to today from an upright bass (which I used to play) to drums to baritone vocals to pipe organ, all clearly exhibit the natural textures, body and weight of the instrument or voice. Plucked and slapped bass strings deliver that immediate percussive "pop". The impact of the mallet striking the skin of a drum delivers the same, only with the added texture of the skin. Of course, there's the upper bass impact and detail in spades that the X-Statik's have been known for since day one.

Now mind you, this is all with 5 year old, bone stock X-Statik's at low to moderate volume levels that you can only safely get by with in an apartment. I've powered these speakers with this amp before, but all of my gear was using their stock power cables and I was using a cheaper quality power conditioner for the system. I imagine having all of these somewhat recent upgrades upstream of the X-Statik's have drastically helped improve their overall performance. However, after all of the speaker placement tweaking that went on all day today certainly played a major roll in these improvements I've heard as well. All of those power cable upgrades provide a deeper, blacker background for the speakers and music to work off of, improving their performance that much more.

After finally beginning to hear what these speakers are capable of after all these years, I'm definitely going to add crossover upgrades and No-Rez to the list of things to do to these X-Statik's to take things up a notch or two.  :thumb: :thumb:

Danny Richie

Re: Living with the X-Statik's once again...
« Reply #1 on: 1 Jul 2013, 02:37 am »
Congratulations. Listening is learning. I always tell people not to be afraid to move the speakers around and get them out into the room. Even if they are further out than you can leave them. Move them out there anyway and listen to them. Learn what is possible.

Good job Chops.

poseidonsvoice

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Re: Living with the X-Statik's once again...
« Reply #2 on: 1 Jul 2013, 02:48 am »
Some nice pointers. Great write up Chops!

Best,
Anand.

Chops

Re: Living with the X-Statik's once again...
« Reply #3 on: 1 Jul 2013, 02:51 am »
Thanks Danny!

I'm definitely not afraid to try moving things around and simply try new techniques. The first time I moved them, I just moved them too much and it didn't sound right. The right channel was too close to the love seat, causing an unbalanced sound. But the number of subtle changes I made throughout the day today paid off. I can only imagine what those upgrades are going to do.

And who knows, depending on funds at the time and the complexity of it all, maybe tweaking the crossovers to accept those new M165NQ drivers could be a possibility and/or worthwhile thing to do. I know you already told me they are a little different than what's in the X-Statik's now. One can dream, can't he?  :dunno:  :green:

Chops

Re: Living with the X-Statik's once again...
« Reply #4 on: 1 Jul 2013, 02:53 am »
Some nice pointers. Great write up Chops!

Best,
Anand.

Thank you Anand!

I think you have a pair of X-Statik's, don't you? If so, maybe my findings will be of some help.  :wink:

SoCalWJS

Re: Living with the X-Statik's once again...
« Reply #5 on: 1 Jul 2013, 03:15 am »
Nice write up!

Now throw some absorbers in the front corners and diffusers elsewhere, upgrade the power cords (etc)........

Welcome to the world of maximizing your performance. The X-Statiks are great speakers and once you get them dialed in.... :thumb:

Which crossover upgrade you looking at? Ninja does good work.


Captainhemo

Re: Living with the X-Statik's once again...
« Reply #6 on: 1 Jul 2013, 05:27 am »
Great write up   :)   Sounds like you had  a fun   weekend and a  very worthwhile  one too  .
Wondering how close   you  have  the speakers to the side  wall  ( or speaker as  I think you mentioned one  had a hallway beside it ?

If you  haven't done so yet you  should  listen  to   the  "Amused To Death" cd  with your speakers in  their new positions,  some amazing imaging.  I noticed quite a difference  when  I switched to the OB7's  , very cool

-jay
« Last Edit: 1 Jul 2013, 06:39 am by Captainhemo »

Chops

Re: Living with the X-Statik's once again...
« Reply #7 on: 1 Jul 2013, 12:24 pm »
Nice write up!

Now throw some absorbers in the front corners and diffusers elsewhere, upgrade the power cords (etc)........

Welcome to the world of maximizing your performance. The X-Statiks are great speakers and once you get them dialed in.... :thumb:

Which crossover upgrade you looking at? Ninja does good work.


Now mind you, this is all with 5 year old, bone stock X-Statik's at low to moderate volume levels that you can only safely get by with in an apartment. I've powered these speakers with this amp before, but all of my gear was using their stock power cables and I was using a cheaper quality power conditioner for the system. I imagine having all of these somewhat recent upgrades upstream of the X-Statik's have drastically helped improve their overall performance. However, after all of the speaker placement tweaking that went on all day today certainly played a major roll in these improvements I've heard as well. All of those power cable upgrades provide a deeper, blacker background for the speakers and music to work off of, improving their performance that much more.

 :wink:

As for crossover upgrades, it'll just be the caps and resistors that I'll order from Danny along with the No-Rez.

Chops

Re: Living with the X-Statik's once again...
« Reply #8 on: 1 Jul 2013, 12:28 pm »
Great write up   :)   Sounds like you had  a fun   weekend and a  very worthwhile  one too  .
Wondering how close   you  have  the speakers to the side  wall  ( or speaker as  I think you mentioned one  had a hallway beside it ?

If you  haven't done so yet you  should  listen  to   the  "Amused To Death" cd  with your speakers in  their new positions,  some amazing imaging.  I noticed quite a difference  when  I switched to the OB7's  , very cool

-jay

The right speaker is roughly 24" from the side wall. The left speaker is about 36" away from a partial wall where the hallway joins into the bar top of the kitchen.

I never heard of that CD. I might have to check it out.

Thanks everyone!

SoCalWJS

Re: Living with the X-Statik's once again...
« Reply #9 on: 1 Jul 2013, 02:14 pm »
The right speaker is roughly 24" from the side wall. The left speaker is about 36" away from a partial wall where the hallway joins into the bar top of the kitchen.

I never heard of that CD. I might have to check it out.

Thanks everyone!

Roger Waters playing with "Q Sound". Some interesting effects. Some good cuts. Some mediocre ones.

The dog has the best part.  :green: (The Genie can be fun too)

Chops

Re: Living with the X-Statik's once again...
« Reply #10 on: 3 Jul 2013, 03:02 am »
Roger Waters playing with "Q Sound". Some interesting effects. Some good cuts. Some mediocre ones.

The dog has the best part.  :green: (The Genie can be fun too)

Yeah, I'll definitely check that disc out for sure. I need to get some Roger Waters material anyway as well as more David Gilmore. I have one of his albums, but that's it.


On a side note, tonight I've been listening to "Chilltrax" on V-Tuner via my Onkyo a/v receiver. Granted, the sound quality isn't as good as CD, but it's close, and the music that's been playing not only makes the speakers totally disappear, but also the entire front half of the room. In a very dimly lit room and my eyes closed, it's surreal. Huge sound stage, very deep, tight bass, smooth and very detailed treble, warm vocals. It's just fun, relaxing music to wind down to. And I need to wind down after this morning's fiasco with the bank and identity theft, but that's a whole nutta' story.  :roll:

Chops

Re: Living with the X-Statik's once again...
« Reply #11 on: 4 Jul 2013, 01:21 am »
Some picture updates...











Yeah, I missed a spot while dusting... LOL

S Clark

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Re: Living with the X-Statik's once again...
« Reply #12 on: 4 Jul 2013, 04:03 am »
I remember being at Danny's one day listening to the LS6 and comparing to the LS9 ( and making the decision to build the 9's).  After all was done, we set up his prototype of the X-Statik.  Danny was convinced that it was going to sweep the competition in the $600 price range... and after hearing it, I almost cancelled my order for the LS9. It was that good.  Years later, I have no plans to switch out my 9's ( they just do classical orchestral soooooo well), but I've never forgotten how those X Statiks compared so well and were incredible for their price. So as far as "Living with X-Statik's once again...",  that's certainly not a terrible sacrifice. 

Scott

Chops

Re: Living with the X-Statik's once again...
« Reply #13 on: 4 Jul 2013, 02:19 pm »
I remember being at Danny's one day listening to the LS6 and comparing to the LS9 ( and making the decision to build the 9's).  After all was done, we set up his prototype of the X-Statik.  Danny was convinced that it was going to sweep the competition in the $600 price range... and after hearing it, I almost cancelled my order for the LS9. It was that good.  Years later, I have no plans to switch out my 9's ( they just do classical orchestral soooooo well), but I've never forgotten how those X Statiks compared so well and were incredible for their price. So as far as "Living with X-Statik's once again...",  that's certainly not a terrible sacrifice. 

Scott

Hello Scott,

After hearing the difference between the X-Statik's and NHT's, there's no sacrifice at all. Well, maybe in that last half octave or so.

So tell me, if you remember, how did the X-Statik's compare to the LS6/9's? I'm curious to know. And I wonder how those prototypes compared to the production ones like mine.

Danny Richie

Re: Living with the X-Statik's once again...
« Reply #14 on: 4 Jul 2013, 07:39 pm »
Hello Scott,

After hearing the difference between the X-Statik's and NHT's, there's no sacrifice at all. Well, maybe in that last half octave or so.

So tell me, if you remember, how did the X-Statik's compare to the LS6/9's? I'm curious to know. And I wonder how those prototypes compared to the production ones like mine.

The X-Statiks have an edge in mid-range transparency due to the open baffle design. But they need to be set up properly for that attribute to really shine and excel over the LS-6 or LS-9. The LS's pretty much beat them up everywhere else.

Those prototypes Scott heard may have had a few Sonicaps in them. Other than that they were factory samples.

Chops

Re: Living with the X-Statik's once again...
« Reply #15 on: 4 Jul 2013, 11:00 pm »
The X-Statiks have an edge in mid-range transparency due to the open baffle design. But they need to be set up properly for that attribute to really shine and excel over the LS-6 or LS-9. The LS's pretty much beat them up everywhere else.

Those prototypes Scott heard may have had a few Sonicaps in them. Other than that they were factory samples.

Speaking of setup, not only did I mess with position all day Sunday, but also a good part of the day yesterday and about another hour or so today. I now have them 39" out from the front wall (measured to the backs of the magnets), 7' 3" apart from the inside baffle edges, and toed-in about 4 degrees, putting them 9' 9" to my head.

With this final positioning and the upper grills removed, I can't imagine them getting any better than this as far as sounds stage and imaging goes. Before when I first started this thread, they would sound great with some music and not so much with others. Now they're sounding damn good with pretty much anything I throw at them whether it be live, acoustic or studio. Very open and spacious. Also, just like I discovered 5 years ago, there was a vast improvement in sound when I removed the top grills. I discovered the same results yet again yesterday when I decided to remove them again.

corndog71

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Re: Living with the X-Statik's once again...
« Reply #16 on: 4 Jul 2013, 11:01 pm »
The first time I heard the X-Statiks was at an AV123 get-together.  They were set up in a basement that was still under construction along with 4 MFW-15 subs and using mostly Outlaw electronics.  I saw a sign on one that said $699 and thought "each?...seems about right".  And then I found out out that it was for the pair and I was totally surprised.  They did a number of movie scene demos which were awesome but when things settled down a bit I asked that the subs be turned off so I could hear them alone. 

That was when I was floored by the HUGE soundstage they threw.  I knew one day I would own a pair because for the money they smoked every speaker I was familiar with under a grand!

At the recent high end audio show in Chicago I heard lots of speakers that bettered the Statiks but they all cost over $3000/pr.  I'm still pretty happy with mine.  :thumb:
« Last Edit: 5 Jul 2013, 11:18 pm by corndog71 »

persisting1

Re: Living with the X-Statik's once again...
« Reply #17 on: 5 Jul 2013, 10:56 pm »
I've said this many times, but I really miss my X-Statiks. I would not hesitate recommending them to someone. I've always wanted to hear the OB-5/7s.

Danny, is there any way to convert an X-Statik to an OB-5? Of course the baffle would have to be altered for the Neo 3 and the crossovers swapped out.

Jonathon Janusz

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Re: Living with the X-Statik's once again...
« Reply #18 on: 5 Jul 2013, 11:53 pm »
Wouldn't the baffle have to be completely changed?  I thought the OB5/7 used M130 woofers while the x-statik used M165?  Would mean you would be trying to put the smaller woofer in the bigger one's cutout?

persisting1

Re: Living with the X-Statik's once again...
« Reply #19 on: 6 Jul 2013, 12:00 am »
Wouldn't the baffle have to be completely changed?  I thought the OB5/7 used M130 woofers while the x-statik used M165?  Would mean you would be trying to put the smaller woofer in the bigger one's cutout?

You're right :duh: Wasn't aware the OB-5 used the M130.