[htradtk]

All,

As per Patrick's request, I decided to start a new thread on the Stillpoints. Thanks to Harve and John Lee for their responses. Yes Harve I agree with you, your Stillpoints would be a bit overkill on my Anni's. Maybe some other Anni owners out there or even Albert can chime in on this subject and explain their experiences and give a model to recommend to use.

Happy listening,
Henry

[fplanner2000]

I've put up pics on the VR-7 thread.  Here they are as well:

[Delacroix]

Harve

Being unfamiliar with the Stillpoints, can you tell me if the modules sit still and stable here or if they can move back and forth/sideways if the module is pushed? Am feeling inspired here to dig out some Aurios and try again with my VR5SEs.

thanks

[htradtk]

Harve,

Nice pics! Love the look, seems to add more elligance to what is all ready a great looking speaker system. Like Patrick, my concern is how stable are they? Being disabled, I tend to lean against my speaker when I load a CD.

Henry

[fplanner2000]

The top modules, as you probably know, are pretty heavy, so gravity pretty much keeps them in place.  However, they will slide a bit if you lean on them, as I accidentally discovered, so you DO need to be careful.  Henry - I would either lean against the bottom cabinet, or maybe find a way to reduce the sliding factor maybe by using Blue Tack, for example,, to adhere the Stillpoints to each surface.  Or you can even screw them in to one side(as Albert has done with a pair of 9's) and blue tack the other side.

IF the concept works for you, there are always ways to make things more secure.  Maybe Albert will even come out with some sort of kit? 

[gammajo]

Poor man's Stillpoints? I use Herbie's Audio Labs Von Schweikert custom kit of big fat dots (87 bucks) between the modules of my VR5 Anniversary MK2's and before that my VR4SR's. Myself and several other listeners find with the dots versus the standard spikes that the speakers are even more of one sound, more coherent from top to bottom, and several other nice enhancements to the sound including slightly better definition in the mid and bass without changing the speakers basic character. The dots are absolutely stable. I have heard some people with Stillpoints used under some equipment complain of a change in the character of sound that they did not appreciate.

[fplanner2000]

Stillpoints under equipment versus the Ultra 5 application here couldn't be more different, from both a physics as well as a practical correlation.  You are making a generalization that in no way applies to the job the Ultra 5's are doing regarding isolation between the 2 modules of my speakers.  There is no change in the character of the sound, just better detail, imaging, extended midrange and treble, as well as tighter bass.  At least, that has been my experience, and Albert's as well, according to our discussions.

[htradtk]

Harve,

Thanks for your input! I do not put all my weight when leaning on the speaker, it's just there as a security thing, enough said, I do not want to bore other people with other people's situations. I will be looking around for a good set of Stillpoints. Looking at your pics, your setup looks similar to mine. I have a combination home theater 2-channel setup, most of my listening is in 2 channel and a good concert Blu-ray in surround. Life is good!

Happy listening,
Henry

[jackman]

Are you guys really using Stillpoints Ultra 5's under your speakers?  Four per speaker at $699 each?  If so, have you ever compared them to regular sorbothane half balls or something from Herbies? 

I use four sorbothane spheres (the 2" half balls) between my monitors and subwoofer modules and they work great.  They are $6 per unit and I'm happy with the results. Previously I tried cork/rubber isolators, sheets of sorbothane and spikes, and the half spheres work best.  I use them with the flat side resting on the subwoofer base and the round section facing the monitors.  For fun, I placed a small bowl of water on top of each speaker and played bass heavy music.  With the plain sheet of sorbothane, cork/rubber squares, and spikes, the waves in the water were clearly visible.  With the half spheres, the water was still and you could not feel vibration (from bass cabinet) coming through the monitors.   

It's possible the Stillpoints isolate the monitors better, but they are way more expensive and I'm not sure the difference is worth the price.  Either way, I can't imagine shelling out over $4k when there may be a less expensive, comparable option.  Are there less expensive Stillpoints available?

[fplanner2000]

I don't pretend to have all the answers.  I just know what works in my system, with my speakers, and within my budget.  I'm pretty sure we probably have different budgets as well as vastly different systems.  I am happy you are getting good results using your rubber balls and I'm sure many others will try this as well as a number of other available solutions.  There is no "right" answer - it really depends on the speaker and the system, plus goals you are after. 

I listened to what Albert did with similar speakers to mine and he knows the makeup of my system, the level I "play" at, and the quality of my gear, having heard my system before.  Otherwise, he probably wouldn't have even talked to me about the Stillpoints, which work very well in my SOTA system.  I encourage others to experiment with their own systems, the point being that it is possible to make improvements by better decoupling the top and bottom modules of some VSA speakers.  I know the Stillpoints work very well with the 7's and 9's, which have very heavy top modules.  That's all.

Also, btw, I would never pay $699. each either. 

[jackman]

First of all, I'm not using or advocating the use of rubber balls.  Sorbothane half spheres are not bouncy like rubber.  They are compliant do a great job absorbing vibration, IMO, and they are very inexpensive.  The material is commonly used in industrial applications to dampen vibration.

Someday I'll probably try Stillpoints or something similar, but I would have to actually hear (with my own ears) a legitimate improvement in sound quality before shelling out >$5k, when there is a $50 alternative that might sound as good.  Of course, "rubber balls" would not give you the audio-bling bragging rights $5k magic pucks would give you, if you are into that kind if thing.

Cheers

Jack

[gammajo]

Jackman - I hear you.  As mentioned above I use Herbie's Audio Labs Von Schweikert custom kit of big fat dots  which are a fairly complex material (87 bucks) between the modules of my VR5 Anniversary MK2's to good effect. The Ultras may indeed be better but I also need to hear and compare to spending the same on, for example the Masterbuilt sig power cords, given a currently limited budget. I am not downing the use of the best (I have crazy expensive tubes in my Ayon Cd5s, for example) just offering an alternative if a person cant swing the Ultra's that does improve things over stock.

[jackman]

Hi Gammajo,

I think your suggestion is very reasonable.  Also, even if the alternate suggestion was a couple hundred bucks, I'd probably get it without doing extensive testing.  $5k is a different story.  I'd have to try an alternative and do some evaluations (including blind testing) to make sure the more expensive solution actually sounds better. 

Also, I understand we all have different preferences and my approach may not be ideal for everyone.  It's just hard to justify an expensive/complex solution to a problem without at least trying a simple inexpensive alternative first.

[Delacroix]

That's why the thread is here....it's reminding me to do some (re)trials. I use the HAL big fat dots between the modules on my VR5-SEs and I think  I want to revisit the original footers that came with the speakers just to remind myself (it's been years) what the differences are. Then I want to dig out my Aurios again, they tend to work well under anything I've put them with but they do wobble if you brush against them. My memory of those was they really were the best I'd tried but memory is unreliable here. Anyone try vibrapods as a cheap solution? I suspect Herbie's got some other footers that would work, those 'big fat dots' are not very big or fat, so perhaps some of the tenderfeet might work? The more options, the better! Let's hear from folks who've tried them.

[gammajo]

Delacroix. I did what you suggest. Had the stock separators for years, then Herbies for at least a year, then went back to stock and within a few weeks changed back to Herbies because the improvement was clear. It is a good way to test, particularly if there have been other significant changes in the system in the meantime.

[fplanner2000]

Jack - I don't need bragging rights, and if you knew me at all, you would know better than to make such a rude comment.  As far as justifying why I do what I do, again, not your place AT ALL to judge, or even to comment on.  I found something that works for me, and in the spirit of sharing, my little blurb sparked a pretty good discussion, which was my intent. 

Are there other less expensive products that also decouple cabinets from each other?  Of course.  Are they in the same league as the Stillpoints?  Of course not (use a little common sense, and/or call Music Direct and ask them).  On 7's and 9's will the Stillpoints work better than anything else currently available for less money, especially the products already named above?  I think so, and obviously so does Albert.  Everyone's budget, systems and goals are different.  You don't put Walmart tires om a Ferrari..... at least I don't.

[jackman]

I think your arrogant, condescending comments do not warrant a response...but I'll provide one anyway.  If Wal Mart tires worked better on a Ferrari, I would not be opposed to using them.  Stillpoints may work better than "rubber balls" as you so eloquently stated.  I'm just not sure if anyone can actually hear the difference, and I do question how anyone in their right mind would spend $5k for such a minor difference without doing any actual testing.

Lastly, I have no doubt Music Direct would rather sell you $5k audio-bling than a set of $50 sorbothane spheres (see, we agree on something).  Perhaps the person who spends $5k on a device that appears to do the same thing as a $50 device can spare everyone the lecture about common sense. 

Cheers

Jack

[fplanner2000]

My prior comments were in no way arrogant or condescending.  Your annoying attitude and insistence that you know better, when you obviously don't is getting tiresome, however.

You are correct - you are not sure about anything, yet you claim there is a minor difference that you're not even sure anyone can hear.  Maybe not in your system, which is obviously smaller and not very resolving with smaller speakers, etc.  A major difference CAN be heard in mine and was verified by several Audiophiles who have very good ears.  I have a very resolving system.  If you were ever to come to my house to listen (not a chance, btw), the difference would shut you up in 5 seconds.

I relied on the advice and suggestions of Albert, whose opinion I value highly, and the research HE DID.  That is good enough for me, but obviously not for you.
  I also don't question whether Albert or anyone else is in his "right mind", for spending big money to improve a system

Music Direct has a 30 day money back return policy, which I'm sure you didn't know about when you shot your mouth off before, or you wouldn't have said the things you did.  Ooops

I'm tired of repeating myself - good luck. And keep your misguided hostility to yourself.

[violetmachan]

hello harve

I have lived for a long time with the VSA Vr7se speakers..... since early2007 which with time was upgraded to the mark2  and customised to my room in 2009 and the single most effective upgrade i did for the "speaker" as a whole (apart from the upgrade)........was the introduction of adjustable speaker spikes..."trackaudio" to the woofermodules.
I also had dialled in a forward incline to the speaker assembly...adjustable spikes........This made the low freq very detailed, punchy and fast which contributed to a very wholesome sound and made the multiple speaker array sound nearly as a coherent single sound source......coming into my listening spot........was beautiful sound.

This is just my spikey tweaks that made my listening very musical .......enjoy your music harve......I am sure it must be stunning






happy soundsurfing from a not so passive(speaker terms only) violet........moved on to being active!!

[jackman]

Lets just agree to disagree.  You can continue to blindly throwing money at expensive tweaks without testing much less expensive alternatives and continue to blather about how great they work.  The audio industry loves people like you and I wish you the best. 

I would love to see a blind comparison of an expensive "solution" like Stillpoints versus a more reasonably priced alternative like the Herbie's products.  Of course, "rubber balls" don't quite have the cache and audiofool bragging rights some people hope to achieve with $5k solutions to $100 problems. 

Cheers

Jack