12 ax7 for Rogue integrated

Bigfishhk · « **Reply #40 on:** 30 May 2013, 04:15 am »

Quote from: roscoeiii on 23 May 2013, 03:50 pm

Can't wait to hear how they compare to other tubes you have tried. Many thanks for posting your impressions.

After about 30 hrs burn in, some early impressions of the EH 5751 in my system.

Compared to 12 ax7 I find that there's small but perceptible improvements in all areas.. As if looking over a large vista and a light mist has lifted, I can now see more detail in the landscape, the colors are a tad more brilliant.
I am the not good with audio descriptions but I know when I like the sound- same as with wine. I suppose if I had to try and pin it down there's more transparency, air and separation of instruments. Soundstage is deep and wide. Everthing is cleaner, almost purer, yet still maintaining the nice warmth, tone and texture we value in a tube set up. I am curious how much difference the cyro treatment makes. But for pretty much the same price I would go with them over the standard EH 5751's.

How do they compare to the 12 ax7's? All I can say is that I prefer the 5751 in my system, but it's a subtle improvement, not night and day.
Of the 12ax7's I have tried the PSvane Treasure were excellent, just behind some glorious Telefunkens. I would be happy with both of those tubes as well. However the EH's are both more appealing to my ears and my wallet so I'm going with those. Of the the other 12ax7's I have tried, nos RCA's pretty sweet, but new JJ's too thick and lacking in finesse.

Rogue Tempest 2
SB Touch
Eastern Elec minimax plus dac
Salk Song Tower speakers
Rythmik 12" sub

TOm

roscoeiii · « **Reply #41 on:** 30 May 2013, 04:38 am »

How are the dynamics and bass? These are the aspects I am most concerned about.

Bigfishhk · « **Reply #42 on:** 30 May 2013, 02:48 pm »

Quote from: roscoeiii on 30 May 2013, 04:38 am

How are the dynamics and bass? These are the aspects I am most concerned about.

In comparing the excellent Psvane T 12ax7 with the EH cyro 5751, I did not hear much difference in the areas you ask about. Push comes to shove I think the Psvane 12AX7 has stronger bass output.
Note I have a Tempest 2 passive linestage int amp which I don't believe is known for its dynamics compared with an active pre amp/ amp. So my sytem may not be as revealing of these qualities.
For more details I would ask Trianglezerius as he more experience with tube. In fact I would like to hear more of his impressions too.

Also I would say that if you already have excellent 12ax7 you would not need to change over unless curiosity bites.
However if you were looking for decent well priced, easily accessible 12ax7's, this 5751 is a wonderful option in my opinion. Certainly in my Tempest.

the lower gain of the 5751 did not translate to lower volume in my set up either.

to sum up, the 5751 silky smooth and refined. Thr Psvane T 12AX7 slightly better bass possibly. Not quite as silky smooth but damn close!

best

TOm

roscoeiii · « **Reply #43 on:** 5 Jun 2013, 04:58 pm »

Any more updates folks?

Alexdad54 · « **Reply #44 on:** 5 Jun 2013, 08:15 pm »

Quote from: roscoeiii on 5 Jun 2013, 04:58 pm

Any more updates folks?

+1 on that as I just got my Rogue Cronus Magnum and am keen to try out some alternative (and hopefully low-cost ) tubes...

Freo-1 · « **Reply #45 on:** 5 Jun 2013, 08:21 pm »

Try a NOS Sylvania. Not expensive, and a excellent performer.

OzarkTom · « **Reply #46 on:** 5 Jun 2013, 09:07 pm »

Quote from: Freo-1 on 5 Jun 2013, 08:21 pm

Try a NOS Sylvania. Not expensive, and a excellent performer.

I second that.NOS Sylvania 5751 with gold pins.

Bigfishhk · « **Reply #47 on:** 6 Jun 2013, 12:57 am »

Quote from: Alexdad54 on 5 Jun 2013, 08:15 pm

+1 on that as I just got my Rogue Cronus Magnum and am keen to try out some alternative (and hopefully low-cost ) tubes...

Low cost- then the cyro treated 5751 EH is great at 30 each. See previous links.

Bigfishhk · « **Reply #48 on:** 6 Jun 2013, 01:01 am »

Quote from: Freo-1 on 5 Jun 2013, 08:21 pm

Try a NOS Sylvania. Not expensive, and a excellent performer.

I just got the rogue 99 pre amp and it sounds wonderful hooked up to the tempest 2. now i have real sense of dynamics and refined power.
It came with EH tubes and the stock Chinese tubes. S far so good. With 4 tubes it,s hard not to be cost conscious.
How about recommendations for 6sn7? At some point I will roll them.
Tom

roscoeiii · « **Reply #49 on:** 6 Jun 2013, 01:03 am »

Quote from: Alexdad54 on 5 Jun 2013, 08:15 pm

+1 on that as I just got my Rogue Cronus Magnum and am keen to try out some alternative (and hopefully low-cost ) tubes...

Congrats on finally scoring a Rogue. Hope you are enjoying it!

Alexdad54 · « **Reply #50 on:** 6 Jun 2013, 08:33 pm »

Quote from: roscoeiii on 6 Jun 2013, 01:03 am

Congrats on finally scoring a Rogue. Hope you are enjoying it!

Hi Roscoeiii,
Thanks, I'm really enjoying it, very clear, strong and full sound. I do have one issue though but I'm not sure if it's the room, the source material or what. I find on some material (MFSL Exodus CD by Bob Marley, etc.) that the highs are a bit "etched" and hard and the cymbals sound a bit blurry This is why I was thinking perhaps a change in tubes might assist. I'm quite the newbie at this so I appreciate any advice offered!

roscoeiii · « **Reply #51 on:** 6 Jun 2013, 08:39 pm »

Quote from: Alexdad54 on 6 Jun 2013, 08:33 pm

Hi Roscoeiii,
Thanks, I'm really enjoying it, very clear, strong and full sound. I do have one issue though but I'm not sure if it's the room, the source material or what. I find on some material (MFSL Exodus CD by Bob Marley, etc.) that the highs are a bit "etched" and hard and the cymbals sound a bit blurry This is why I was thinking perhaps a change in tubes might assist. I'm quite the newbie at this so I appreciate any advice offered!

Tube rolling may very well help with that.

Alexdad54 · « **Reply #52 on:** 6 Jun 2013, 09:33 pm »

Quote from: Freo-1 on 5 Jun 2013, 08:21 pm

Try a NOS Sylvania. Not expensive, and a excellent performer.

Thanks but where to source them? Every place I look (ebay, tubedepot, other audio groups, etc.) they're running at least $200 pair...

Freo-1 · « **Reply #53 on:** 6 Jun 2013, 09:37 pm »

Quote from: Alexdad54 on 6 Jun 2013, 09:33 pm

Thanks but where to source them? Every place I look (ebay, tubedepot, other audio groups, etc.) they're running at least $200 pair...

OK, here is a secret (SSHH)

Call Radio Electric Supply in FL, ask for Roy or Dale, and order some 6681. They are a mobile 12AX7. They have quite a few, they are all Sylvania, and 20.00 each. I got a pair for a buddy, and he says they smoke the EH tubes he was using.

Bigfishhk · « **Reply #54 on:** 6 Jun 2013, 09:37 pm »

Quote from: Alexdad54 on 6 Jun 2013, 08:33 pm

Hi Roscoeiii,
Thanks, I'm really enjoying it, very clear, strong and full sound. I do have one issue though but I'm not sure if it's the room, the source material or what. I find on some material (MFSL Exodus CD by Bob Marley, etc.) that the highs are a bit "etched" and hard and the cymbals sound a bit blurry This is why I was thinking perhaps a change in tubes might assist. I'm quite the newbie at this so I appreciate any advice offered!

i think you should also let the tubes settle in for a few weeks.
btw what are the tubes they sell the unit with?
tom

Alexdad54 · « **Reply #55 on:** 6 Jun 2013, 09:46 pm »

Quote from: Bigfishhk on 6 Jun 2013, 09:37 pm

i think you should also let the tubes settle in for a few weeks.
btw what are the tubes they sell the unit with?
tom

It's a used item (about a year old) so the tubes should be well burned in. Not sure what types they are other than that they are stock. I will be opening it up later to see what they are and because I'm going to change the faceplate (sliver to black).

Alexdad54 · « **Reply #56 on:** 6 Jun 2013, 09:46 pm »

Quote from: Freo-1 on 6 Jun 2013, 09:37 pm

OK, here is a secret (SSHH)
Call Radio Electric Supply in FL, ask for Roy or Dale, and order some 6681. They are a mobile 12AX7. They have quite a few, they are all Sylvania, and 20.00 each. I got a pair for a buddy, and he says they smoke the EH tubes he was using.

What's a "mobile 12AX7"?

Freo-1 · « **Reply #57 on:** 6 Jun 2013, 09:52 pm »

It's a regular 12AX7, but has been screened to operate in mobile applications. The filament can operate up to 20% over or under. It's actually a better 12AX7.

Bigfishhk · « **Reply #58 on:** 6 Jun 2013, 10:31 pm »

Quote from: Freo-1 on 6 Jun 2013, 09:52 pm

It's a regular 12AX7, but has been screened to operate in mobile applications. The filament can operate up to 20% over or under. It's actually a better 12AX7.

sounds like a great deal from what you say.

do you know any such amazing deals for 6sn7's for the 99 pre amp? I have the stock Chinese 6sn7 plus EH ones. What would you recommend?

Freo-1 · « **Reply #59 on:** 6 Jun 2013, 10:49 pm »

Alas, there is no magic bullet for the 6SN7 variant. I would again check Radio Electric Supply, or Vacuumtubes.inc for their current prices. They are reasonable, and stand behind their sale.

I can state that almost any NOS 6SN7 will be an improvement over current production. It's too bad you didn't get in on Gvt1911's sale recently.