[jostber]

I have a SET amp with two of the Shuguang 211's installed. There seems to be some different choices of 211's available now like the Psvane, Full Music, GE Electric NOS and others, and many of them are quite expensive. Has anyone any recommendations for a good value buy of these or other brands of 211's?

[wolfbane]

I've tried NOS RCA's, NOS GE's, Shuguang and Psvane 211/VT4-C tubes in my SET amps. The best sounding are the RCA's followed by the GE's. Of the two Chinese made tubes the Psvanes are a step up from the Shuguang tubes and sound very close to GE VT4-C's.

The Shuguang's I found to be reather shouty for the 100 hours or so that I used them.

Wb

[jostber]

Thanks, I might get me some GE's. The RCA ones seems to be hard to find.

[jostber]

Interesting article on the 211 tubes:

http://vinylsavor.blogspot.no/2012/07/tube-of-month-211-vt4c.html

[rollo]

  The NOS United then RCA then GE as far as sonics are concerned. If you use the GE the  input and driver tube should have a rich character as the GE is on the bright side of neutral. Opposite for RCA. The untied is the best of both worlds. Both the United and RCA are very expensive and hard to find. Expect to pay over $1000/ pair. If your lucky.
    For modern production either Pavane or Sophia. The Shuquang tubes are shouty and bright. KR offers a great tube new however over $1000 a pair.
     I use both GE and RCA. We just change the input and driver tube accordingly for each tube. Good luck.


charles

[FullRangeMan]

  The NOS United then RCA then GE as far as sonics are concerned. If you use the GE the  input and driver tube should have a rich character as the GE is on the bright side of neutral. Opposite for RCA. The untied is the best of both worlds. Both the United and RCA are very expensive and hard to find. Expect to pay over $1000/ pair. If your lucky.
    For modern production either Pavane or Sophia. The Shuquang tubes are shouty and bright. KR offers a great tube new however over $1000 a pair.
     I use both GE and RCA. We just change the input and driver tube accordingly for each tube. Good luck.


charles

Also Shuguang big Triodes are unreliable, some tubes that were made by experiencied technicians age well, other tubes that were made by noobs technicians are unpredictable.
I wonder why Shuguang made that C(as 845C) models?? with a less powerfull plate=75W, not the usual 100W.

[FullRangeMan]

Interesting article on the 211 tubes:

http://vinylsavor.blogspot.no/2012/07/tube-of-month-211-vt4c.html

Wow, the best tube stripper I had see, thanks for sharing.
This is a less extensive report about the GM70:
http://www.jacmusic.com/nos/GM70/index.htm

[wolfbane]

Interesting article on the 211 tubes:

http://vinylsavor.blogspot.no/2012/07/tube-of-month-211-vt4c.html

I actually have a pair of RCA VT4-B tubes which are early 211 tubes (March 3, 1938 is the date on mine). These are a nice step uo from the NOS GE VT4-C's.

Wb

[jostber]

I have ordered some NOS GE tubes for now, and might have a look at the Elrog's later.

[Scott F.]

  The NOS United then RCA then GE as far as sonics are concerned. If you use the GE the  input and driver tube should have a rich character as the GE is on the bright side of neutral. Opposite for RCA. <snip>
     I use both GE and RCA. We just change the input and driver tube accordingly for each tube. Good luck.


charles

Hey Charles, have you got suggestions for a 'rich' 6922 driver tube for the GE 211s? I'm running the Amperex PQs in the Cybers...I think

[rollo]

Hey Charles, have you got suggestions for a 'rich' 6922 driver tube for the GE 211s? I'm running the Amperex PQs in the Cybers...I think

   Si Senor. Using a Mullard 6DJ8 along with a RCA  or Tungsol driver. Or a Tele 6DJ8 and Tungsol. One more suggestion. If using the GE 211 then by all means use a Dueland or Audiocap Theta for the coupling caps. If using an RCA then V-cap copper is the way to go. You can tame the beast [ GE 211 ] in different ways.


charles

[Gopher]

Charles,

I came across an old post of yours speaking of the Sophia 211 tubes.  I see they're up to a MK3 version of it now but there is barely any info available.  Do your recommend the original over the GE 211 for the cost?  Is it as bright a tube?  My amp is still breaking in, but I think a power tube upgrade will be in order as I suspect the Shuguang 211s are holding me back.  I wish there was a 211 equivlent of the 845B. 

[Scott F.]

   Si Senor. Using a Mullard 6DJ8 along with a RCA  or Tungsol driver. Or a Tele 6DJ8 and Tungsol. One more suggestion. If using the GE 211 then by all means use a Dueland or Audiocap Theta for the coupling caps. If using an RCA then V-cap copper is the way to go. You can tame the beast [ GE 211 ] in different ways.


charles

Cool, I've got the Tungsol 5687 so I'll search out the Mullard or Tele. I've got the AmpOhm Tin Foil and Oil coupling caps (if I remember correctly) Mine are Mike Galusha's old cybers.

[Gopher]

I just did some digging and discovered there was a very limited production run of 211-B tubes from Shuguang which are Amperex clones and the 211 equivalent of the excellent 845B.  I ordered a pair last night and will report back soon, but I'm pretty optimistic they will be good.  The 845B mopped the floor with the Psvane 845-T and I suspect the 211-B will be similar.

I don't know if they'll be as good as the GEs but for the price they're probably worth checking out:  http://www.ebay.ca/itm/TUBES-211B-211-B-SHUGUANG-LIMITED-EDITION-NEW-BOX-Vendus-par-paire-/230839604056

[FullRangeMan]

I just did some digging and discovered there was a very limited production run of 211-B tubes from Shuguang which are Amperex clones and the 211 equivalent of the excellent 845B.  I ordered a pair last night and will report back soon, but I'm pretty optimistic they will be good.  The 845B mopped the floor with the Psvane 845-T and I suspect the 211-B will be similar.

I don't know if they'll be as good as the GEs but for the price they're probably worth checking out:  http://www.ebay.ca/itm/TUBES-211B-211-B-SHUGUANG-LIMITED-EDITION-NEW-BOX-Vendus-par-paire-/230839604056

This 211B tube had the usual 100W plate dissipation or only 75W as the 845C??

Most 211 amps are intend to use only the 100W plate dissipation... in this case a 75W plate can be dangerous.

[Gopher]

My understanding is it employs the standard 100W.  This is supposed to be basically a copy of the 845B not the 845C...  Also further research shows there is a separate 211C tube as well.

[FullRangeMan]

My understanding is it employs the standard 100W.  This is supposed to be basically a copy of the 845B not the 845C.

Iam in doubt as the usual gain for the NOS 211 is 12, and for the NOS 845 is gain=5.
This Amperex 211B datasheet show gain=12 and dissipation=100W:
http://www.mif.pg.gda.pl/homepages/frank/sheets/084/h/HF120.pdf

This factory Shuguang 845B datashet inform the plate dissiparion is 75W and gain=5.
http://www.tube.com.cn/en/product/productview.asp?id=69

I not found the Shuguang 211B datasheet, but this Shuguang GL211 datasheet show gain=12 and 100W:
http://www.tube.com.cn/en/product/productview.asp?id=64

Propably you will receive the tube datasheet inside the box, what will clarify it.

[woofersus]

I'm curious the difference between the Psvane tubes now vs. when Shuguang was manufacturing them on contract. (and potentially which version you tried)  I would assume, based on the brand's history, that one of the Shuguang 845 designs was the starting point for development of the new upscale line, but It's possible they attempted to model after a particular vintage tube as well.  Either way, it's interesting that you preferred the 845b so much over the Psvane given their likely origin.

Also, aren't the Sophia 211's probably the same as TJ Full Music?  I know some of their tubes are shared designs. (even though a few use different shaped glass)

[Gopher]

The Psvane 845-T tubes I tried and hated were from Grant Fidelity.  They were garbage IMO... significantly worse then the 845Bs at a much higher cost.

I got my Shuguang 211B tubes today and they are superb!  A terrific upgrade from the stock 211As and I'm very glad I picked them up.  Its 1:15AM and I haven't slept well in days, but I don't want this listening session to end.  It really brought things together nicely.

Keep an eye on GE 211s.  I bought a pair tonight at a good price....  time will tell if they become my primaries or the backups to my Shuguang 211Bs. 

[Gopher]

   Si Senor. Using a Mullard 6DJ8 along with a RCA  or Tungsol driver. Or a Tele 6DJ8 and Tungsol. One more suggestion. If using the GE 211 then by all means use a Dueland or Audiocap Theta for the coupling caps. If using an RCA then V-cap copper is the way to go. You can tame the beast [ GE 211 ] in different ways.


charles

Charles,

I just won an eBay auction on a pair of GE 211s (should be delivered tomorrow) which I'm excited to compare to my Shuguang 211Bs.  Any suggestions on a good 12ax7 to go with it?  I think I have Amperex orange, Telefunken, GE  and Slyvania (Balwin Organ pull predacessors) on hand to try...   The teles were a little crunchy on top before, but I'm wondering if they'd be more appropriate with the brighter GE 211s.

Fred