Behringer Feedback Destroyer with Larger Subs = :-)

zybar · « **on:** 30 May 2004, 08:58 pm »

Well I finally got around to putting the Behringer Feedback Destroyer into the system. For those not familiar, the BFD, can be used as a parametric equalizer (you can set a total of 12 filters). To read more on the BFD, click HERE

After many hours of experimenting, I finally settled on a total of 6 filters. These filters allowed me to get "mostly" flat response from 16-70Hz. The only exception is that I have 7db suckout at 31Hz. Rather than use the tool incorrectly and try to boost, I will live with it.

Below is the graph that shows before eq and after.

For testing purposes I had only the subs on and the volume on my pre/pro was at 23 (it gets louder as your approach zero). The crossover for the subs is at 60Hz (I like it better than the 40Hz setting) and is done via the pre/pro.

After I was done with the filters I put on U-571 and played the depth charge scene. With the BFD, I was able to get a high of 116db with the volume set to 5 on the pre/pro. While being extremely loud (and literally making my shirt flap from about 18' away), the sounds weren't breaking up and I couldn't detect any distortion.

When I take the BFD out (by implementing it's bypass feature), I can't play as loud as with it in place. At 106db, the sound is bloated and not clear. I am not saying that I couldn't play it louder, just that the sound gets worse.

The really scary part of this is that I think the limiting factor on the subs is the fact that I have "only" 1 Crown K2 amp driving both subs. If each sub had its own amp, I am confident the Largers could go produce even more db's!!

Overall I think that the BFD is doing exactly what I wanted it to do and at a cost (under $75 used or $120 new) that everybody can afford. Yes, I realize that it is another piece in the chain, but since it is only touching things in such a limited range, I am confident that the pluses clearly outweigh any potential minuses.

As always, I encourage people to try things in their own system.

No to put those ear plugs back in and try a few other tests.

George

Rob Babcock · « **Reply #1 on:** 30 May 2004, 09:04 pm »

Pretty much the same results I've acheived with my pair of HSU subs. Much flatter deep bass with no bloat, the EQ makes the bass sound tauter & more extended. Sure, you probably wouldn't want to use it full range, but if you're willing to do the work to properly harness it's powers the BFD can do amazing things. Especially considering most guys spend more on a single pair of ICs.

mcrespo71 · « **Reply #2 on:** 30 May 2004, 09:20 pm »

I've been playing with a Behringer 8024 Digital EQ in my system and I have to agree that whatever small artifacts it may add by being in the chain is overwhelmed by the improvement it brings to my room problems-huge midbass and midrange humps are smoothed out and everything definitely sounds better when your room is not overloading.

Michael

Rob Babcock · « **Reply #3 on:** 30 May 2004, 09:27 pm »

Whoever wrote the instructions, though, oughta be beaten severely around the head and shoulders.

The thing's pretty simple once you get the hang of it, but I didn't find the manual to be very helpful.

mcrespo71 · « **Reply #4 on:** 30 May 2004, 09:31 pm »

WORD- The instructions blow!!! Thank God it's not that hard to figure stuff out.

Michael

zybar · « **Reply #5 on:** 30 May 2004, 09:53 pm »

I didn't even open up the manual.

I followed the instructions from this webpage:

http://www.snapbug.ws/bfd.htm

These instructions are excellent and take you step by step in a clear, concise manner.

With the results I witnessed here, it really makes me think about trying to get my hands on a TACT preamp.

What do you guys think about trying a BFD up to say 200Hz? Too high?

George

bubba966 · « **Reply #6 on:** 30 May 2004, 10:55 pm »

Hmmmm, well I bought a modded BFD Pro from MikeG a few months back and haven't yet tried hooking it up. Looked at the destructions real quick and didn't feel like trying to decode them at the time.

I'll have to read the page George linked to and setup my subs maybe today or tomorrow. Got company coming tomorrow, so it wouldn't be a bad idea to tweak the setup a bit before we watch something...

mcrespo71 · « **Reply #7 on:** 30 May 2004, 11:03 pm »

Quote

What do you guys think about trying a BFD up to say 200Hz? Too high?

I have one setting that I keep that just works on the bass from 200HZ down. If there is a loss in resolution, I have to strain to hear it. I get some steely coloration when I use the 8024 full range, but according to csero, it's because I'm not using it's full resolution because I'm running it off the tape loops.

Michael

zybar · « **Reply #8 on:** 30 May 2004, 11:11 pm »

Mike,

Can you explain how you have it hooked up?

Why are you using the tape loop?

George

mcrespo71 · « **Reply #9 on:** 31 May 2004, 12:23 am »

Well, the Behringer needs 20volts to see full resolution and if I stick it in between the preamp and amp, I don't give it enough voltage just listening at my main volume settings, so the tape loop actually gives it more volts, though not enough for full resolution. I am going to have csero mod the Behringer for me, so it will give me full resolution in the tape loops. I also need to have a special digital cable built with a resistor soldered in to deal with the small voltage my transport sends to the Digital In- Again, this thing is made for proaudio so the normal output levels my consumer gear sends, just won't cut it. It's cheap, but needs some mods to use with regular high end gear. Also, I always like putting EQ/processors in the tape loop, as I can listen to them in the path or out with the flick of a switch.

Michael

zybar · « **Reply #10 on:** 31 May 2004, 12:42 am »

Mike,

Which model do you have?

George

mcrespo71 · « **Reply #11 on:** 31 May 2004, 12:50 am »

I have the Behringer ULTRACURVE 8024 Digital EQ/RTA with the digital in/output option and the measurement microphone. Even just using it for doing room measurements, is invaluable.

Michael

zybar · « **Reply #12 on:** 31 May 2004, 01:06 am »

Mike,

I am thinking of trying this:

http://www.behringer.com/DCX2496/index.cfm?lang=ENG

This would be an EQ and Crossover for my dual larger subs.

I have also been thinking about getting the model you have or the 2496.

George

JoshK · « **Reply #13 on:** 31 May 2004, 02:27 am »

csero is the coolest thing to happen to our NY audio rave. I wish he would post more!

If you are going to play music (bass) really loud, make sure you have a lot of juice if your using an EQ. EQ sucks juice.

zybar · « **Reply #14 on:** 31 May 2004, 02:52 am »

Josh,

Already shot a PM to Frank to pick his brain.

Since I am newbie in this area, why does an EQ suck up a lot of juice? I am just cutting things, not adding.

George

mcrespo71 · « **Reply #15 on:** 31 May 2004, 03:00 am »

George,

Yeah, just contact Frank on this EQ stuff. All I know is that guy gets amazing sound from this EQ, so any ?'s you have, ask him. He's done some pretty amazing things to trick the EQ into seeing proper output levels, etc.

Right now, I use the ultracurve 8024 for measuring the room, which is just really cool and helps me with setting the subwoofer and placing the speakers in an optimum position. I think the 2496 is the replacement for the 8024, right? I got the 8024 b/c I heard Frank's and figured if I had any problems, he knows the internal workings so well he could help me out. Frank ROCKS!

Michael

PLMONROE · « **Reply #16 on:** 31 May 2004, 03:59 am »

PLease, who does modifications on these? I have been looking for a source in vein for weeks! Thanks

Paul

ooheadsoo · « **Reply #17 on:** 31 May 2004, 04:06 am »

There's a review over on head-fi on the deq2496. The gentleman using it loved it and said that it was a breeze to use compared to the 8024. It's also all digital so you could send the data into it via digital and output it digital as well. It also has analog ins and outs, and the dac inside is reportedly not bad at all.

zybar · « **Reply #18 on:** 31 May 2004, 01:53 pm »

Do you have the link?

I can't find anything over there.

George

ooheadsoo · « **Reply #19 on:** 31 May 2004, 05:22 pm »

Here are the initial impressions: http://www5.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=41510&highlight=deq2496

Here's the followup: http://www5.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=43887&highlight=deq2496