[sts9fan]

I am currently running a actively crossed and biamped system.
I am using a MiniDSP and am wondering if I can do better.   I think I like the idea of the DEQX acting as the DAC. That way I will limit the redundant conversions.
I am also not digging the 0.9v output of the Mini. Maybe I need to switch to a balanced Mini?
If one was wanting to do a computer setup with room correction and 8 analog outputs what is necessary?  What are the main parts? Can my vinyl be corrected also? Will $1500 get me there?
I am very happy with the sound of my current setup. Just looking to explore options.

[lowtech]

Maybe try to get your hands on a Hypex DLCP?  I've been told by a miniDsp owner that they are very good.

[sts9fan]

Seems cool but is it available? Also, I am just figuring out filters and is IIR lesser then FIR?  Honestly the filter theory is above my head but I am ok at implementing.

[lowtech]

Word is that it's going to be available shortly.  It uses IIR filters; Hypex claims they sound better than FIR.  YMMV.

[JohnR]

If one was wanting to do a computer setup with room correction and 8 analog outputs what is necessary?

You may even want to look into doing it all in-computer. My system is like that now. In theory I can run analog through it although haven't actually tried it yet. I'm not sure what the software is on Windows but randytsuch was looking into, there's a thread further down the page.

[sts9fan]

I think I am cooling to the idea of using a computer for everything. I am not sure I want to boot up every time I want to listen. Plus my wife uses the system daily and she already complains about having to turn on four boxes.

[Davey]

I have a Hypex DLCP up and running in my system.  It's a pretty neat unit with some advantages and disadvantages compared with the DCX2496 and miniDSP.

Only six outputs though. 

Cheers,

Dave.

[TomS]

I have a Hypex DLCP up and running in my system.  It's a pretty neat unit with some advantages and disadvantages compared with the DCX2496 and miniDSP.

Only six outputs though. 

Cheers,

Dave.

Dave,

Six is ok for me, though 8 would be better for bi-amped 2 ways plus 4 independent subs. Can you please briefly elaborate on those advantage/disadvantages vs the DCX?

Tom

[sts9fan]

Can you also discuss implementation?  Is it a stand alone item?  What's the software?

[Davey]

Tom,

The DLCP signal levels are more commensurate (lower) with home audio work.

Also the output signal levels are much better matched channel-to-channel versus the DCX.  The DCX is fine if you utilize the outputs in balanced mode, but if you use an XLR/RCA converter for unbalanced outputs you lose matching because of poor component tolerances.

The noise and distortion of the DLCP outputs are lower than the DCX.

I like the GUI interface (and control) of the DLCP a bit better.  The DLCP has more inputs...four analog and also a USB input.

The DLCP doesn't have an EQ block available ahead of the crossover section.  The DCX does have that capability and it's pretty handy.

The DLCP is much more advanced in its capability for "room correction."  You can import SPL response files and match the "correction" on the programming screen.  Of course, I think the concept of "room correction" is flawed to begin with, but anyways, the capability is there. 

There are no front panel indicators on the DLCP so you don't have a visual indication of clipping or other possible issues that might be occurring.  The DCX is excellent in this aspect.

Of course, we don't know if the DLCP will ever see the light of day or how much it will cost if it does.  It appears they've delayed/stopped development of the unit.

You can download the Hypex Filter Designer software (for their other DSP units) so you can get a feel of how it works.  The version for the DLCP is a beta and a bit different, but generally the same.

As lowtech mentioned, this is not a FIR-based gadget.  No linear-phase crossovers are possible, so if that's a show-stopper for you look elsewhere. 

Cheers,

Dave.

[milosz]

DCX2496, MiniDSP modules are all great. I've used them.  HOWEVER what they lack is the DEQX analysis and filter-creation software.  The DEQX software does more than just measure FR- the the DEQX does more than just crossing over and FR correction.

The DEQX software also permits much steeper slopes (up to 300 dB per octave) and supports a linear-phase crossover topology, which none of the other products mentioned offer.

DEQX corrects not just for frequency-domain errors from the speaker- it also does quite a lot of TIME domain correction as well : group delay, phase and step response are all things that the DEQX algorithm provides correction solutions for.

I've used a DEQX for five or six years, would not want to part with it.

[jk@home]

delete

[playntheblues]

I have tried the Mini DSP as well as the new version of the DEQX.  Both are good units with strong and weak points.  The DEQX has the best built in measurement software etc. however IMHO lacks on the DAC side of things.  Now I know some will disagree and that's ok, it does enough stuff very well to accept the DAC limitations.

You might want to give Clayton Shaw a call he has been at this for a while now and has a very good working experience of this gear.  He has chosen the Prism gear, great DAC's and Preamp.  Of course then you need to add the software for room correction etc.  Metric Halo goes a great job as well, I thing you can get everything you want without breaking the bank.

[randytsuch]

You may even want to look into doing it all in-computer. My system is like that now. In theory I can run analog through it although haven't actually tried it yet. I'm not sure what the software is on Windows but randytsuch was looking into, there's a thread further down the page.

That was a few years ago, and was another project that was not completed, like many others.

I don't remember all the details anymore, but I was planning to use a moto 828.  I had to talk firewire to that guy, and he has multiple dacs to split up the signal.  I remember buying some software (forget the name) to handle the crossover duties, and I think it also split up the signal into multiple channels.  I think it was going to take a couple pieces of software to implement, jriver and this other software.  Jriver can do it, but back then it had limited capability for the crossover part, not sure if it's better now or not.

Back then, I didn't have a dedicated audio PC, I was going to use my laptop.  I decided it was going to be too much trouble to set up my PC for this anytime I wanted to listen to music, so I shelved the whole thing.

But, by coincidence, I just bought a balanced minidsp 2x4.  I'm going to use it to create a subwoofer output signal for my LGK speakers.  To support this, I did a pretty hard DIY mod to my DAC to split off a channel for the subwoofer.  I have a ES9018 dac that has 8 channels, but it is configured for stereo so 4 channels are tied together for left, and the other four for right.  I cut and jumpered the board to take one left and one right channel to feed to the minidsp, to create the subwoofer signal.

One other thing I was looking at are the crown and behringer commercial amps that have built in DSP's.  These are made to support an active crossover function.  I thought about it, but an minidsp and older crown amp cost about the same, and gives more functionality.  And in my case, since it's just for the sub, I wasn't was worried about signal quality.

Randy

[richidoo]

I am currently running a actively crossed and biamped system.
I am using a MiniDSP and am wondering if I can do better.   I think I like the idea of the DEQX acting as the DAC. That way I will limit the redundant conversions.
I am also not digging the 0.9v output of the Mini. Maybe I need to switch to a balanced Mini?
If one was wanting to do a computer setup with room correction and 8 analog outputs what is necessary?  What are the main parts? Can my vinyl be corrected also? Will $1500 get me there?
I am very happy with the sound of my current setup. Just looking to explore options.

DEQX is an excellent machine. It can sound really awesome when it is set up correctly. But it is not intuitive when you first start using it, and there is a thick manual to read and learn, then practice. But DEQX can help by email, or you can hire them to setup your system using your recorded measurements. The sound quality of the hardware is good enough for any system.

If you connect a balanced miniDSP output to a SE amp with standard cables you will only be using one leg of the balanced signal, and the other leg is shorted to ground. You will have to modify the cables or make your own to add both legs together in a SE signal. One leg of the balanced output stage might be louder than the SE output stage anyway, as they are different circuits.

The basic parts are PC, software, and audio interface. You already have the rest. I am now using JRiver20 in a retired Dell Pentium4/XP/1GB with Presonus Firepod. It works great. I am using balanced line outs with SE cables, it is still very hot. A new silent computer can be had for a few hundred. The new version of the interface I have costs $425 new, it is usb instead of firewire like my old one. JRiver has all the software part covered, volume control, crossovers, EQ, player, library, streaming. The nice thing about using a good conputer audio interface vs a speaker management box like DCX, is having excellent quality analog (mic) inputs. the DCX analog inputs are a total joke. The Presonus inputs are class A discreet amplifiers that sound fantastic, even better than the outputs. So you can pipe your analog sources in without ruining the signal. You could even use the 64dB mic preamp instead of a phono preamp, then apply RIAA EQ in software.

Another option is to use analog active crossovers. Some companies make these, like Bryston, Marchand, but you can DIY the crossovers very inexpensively using PCB from Rod elliot, or preassembled modules from Marchand. With this method you use one stereo DAC before the crossovers, so you can use a high end DAC for the best possible SQ. The crossover stuff would ocme after your preamp, so you can pipe your analog sources through it. If you use good quality parts and choose opamps wisely you can have better sound than most budget pro audio audio interfaces, no computer, one switch turns it on. The benefit of a digital crossover is the ease of changing settings. Since you already know your crossover parameters with your miniDSP, it would be easy to duplicate that in analog circuits. Mild tweaking of freq is possible but big changes like filter order would require a different circuit. I build Elliot 24dB analog crossovers once with LM833 opamps, Dale resistors and vishay polyester films, it sounded fantastic. Baffle step correction, contour filters, notches, linkwitz transform, anything you can do in digital is possible in analog, except FIR phase linear filters, and time delay, super steep slopes, etc. But for basic system, it does nice job and sounds great.

[Pneumonic]

The nice thing about using a good conputer audio interface vs a speaker management box like DCX, is having excellent quality analog (mic) inputs. the DCX analog inputs are a total joke.

I run DCX2496 in my Sanders setup. Just for kicks, I measured its performance using its analog inputs.

My SA showed THD of 0.00069% with all harmonics so far down (-120dB) they are in the noise floor.   

Objectively, this is spectacular performance.

[Davey]

I run DCX2496 in my Sanders setup. Just for kicks, I measured its performance using its analog inputs.

My SA showed THD of 0.00069% with all harmonics so far down (-120dB) they are in the noise floor.   

Objectively, this is spectacular performance.

That seems a little too spectacular to me.    I'd like to know more about your measuring setup.

You were measuring all the way through the system to the analog outputs with the DCX configured without xover/EQ/etc/etc?

Dave.

[Pneumonic]

Hi, Dave.

Yeah, test signals inputted to DCX analog ins and measured via DCX analog outs. Adjustments for timing along with midrange and deep bass EQ was engaged (stock settings in my case). Essentially, the DCX's A/D/A is performing flawlessly (ie no audible distortion, noise, or frequency response error). 

[roscoeiii]

I have tried the Mini DSP as well as the new version of the DEQX.  Both are good units with strong and weak points.  The DEQX has the best built in measurement software etc. however IMHO lacks on the DAC side of things.  Now I know some will disagree and that's ok, it does enough stuff very well to accept the DAC limitations.

You might want to give Clayton Shaw a call he has been at this for a while now and has a very good working experience of this gear.  He has chosen the Prism gear, great DAC's and Preamp.  Of course then you need to add the software for room correction etc.  Metric Halo goes a great job as well, I thing you can get everything you want without breaking the bank.

Which DEQX model was it that you listened to?