[JLM]

Why swap out the PMC AML-1's with any of these?  Seems like a sideways step at best to me.   

Is your system too simple for audiophile tastes?  Is the hunter instinct kicking in?

(I'm a big believer in active designs.)

[jtwrace]

anyone know why the Selah are $1000 for an upgraded veneer?  I don't even think the Salk floorstanders are that much with double the surface area and I would imagine their work is probably considered the best of the three also.

[eclein]

Oh Nice......LOL....How about a pair of each?? ....LOL....what an interesting shootout it would be!!! Good luck however you choose and Welcome aboard

[ricardojoa]

Hard to say Whether the tempesta are better or the cirrus. Both have their qualities. But i gotta say i love the looks of the cirrus. Also, if there were standard in measuring sensitivity, the cirrus has some advantage being 3 db more sensitive. The cirrus also dig deeper within  its -3db. The woofer from AT is made of polypropylen , not sure how they compared to scanspeak aluminum cone in terms of detail.

[vettett15]

One thing that was drawing me to the Tempestas is the fact you can buy it as a kit and save some money.  Not sure how much the cabinets are now, but it seems that you could have a pair of tempestas for less than 3k.

[vortrex]

oh I get it, you're trying to be funny.  so cute!

well, it's a legitimate question and I'm not criticizing Selah.  I'm seriously considering the Tempesta, but I don't want a standard finish and the only thing stopping me is the 30% addition to the cost for an upgrade.

[wilsynet]

well, it's a legitimate question and I'm not criticizing Selah.  I'm seriously considering the Tempesta, but I don't want a standard finish and the only thing stopping me is the 30% addition to the cost for an upgrade.

Does it matter if it's 30% more if the final price still represents good value?

My guess is that Vapor's final price with upgraded veneer is only marginally more money because Vapor is building the cabinet by hand and it is only marginally more dollars to pick a different veneer versus a standard veneer.  Same amount of work, just different material.

I believe the Selah Tempesta cabinet is a Dayton cabinet, also sold by Parts Express.  The Dayton cabinet comes in cherry, maple, gloss piano black, etc.  In fact, the standard veneers offered by Selah.  Where the standard veneers are applied at a lower cost geographic location, a custom veneer may have the additional cost of stripping the cabinet of its original veneer and then applying the custom veneer.  So it's sort of double work.

So the Tempesta has 3 drivers versus the Vapor Cirrus and its 2 drivers.  The 3 drivers make the Tempesta more expensive than the Cirrus, but the Cirrus's bespoke cabinet makes it more expensive than the Tempesta, unless you want a custom veneer for the Tempesta, in which case things start to equalize.

Value for dollars?  Couldn't say.  Would have to listen to both speakers which it seems no one has actually done as of yet.

[Carl V]

Hard to say Whether the tempesta are better or the cirrus. Both have their qualities. But i gotta say i love the looks of the cirrus. Also, if there were standard in measuring sensitivity, the cirrus has some advantage being 3 db more sensitive. The cirrus also dig deeper within  its -3db. The woofer from AT is made of polypropylen , not sure how they compared to scanspeak aluminum cone in terms of detail.

Speaker designers all have a preferences, altho' they seek neutrality
if such a thing really exisited.
Speaker drivers are all unique....and it's mostly a matter of taste,
not always "best". And there has always been the Flavor of the
month, year or season with respect to drivers i.e.,tweeters, mids or
Woofers...we all seem to suffer audio-nervosa at times.
 Back in the day Ryan had considered the SS
Illuminator, he showed it at RMAF.  Salk sound has stuck with SEAS
mostly, with some variations, albeit never SS drivers.  Selah has
used all those drivers & yet only occasionally used the AT driver.
Ryan could use anything he wants & yet has stuck with AT for the
most part.  Curious if he ever thought about a Dannish speaker/
driver company Raidho. Ceramic mid-woofer & wonderful planar magnetic
tweeter.  And their Cabinetry is incredible. Their sound is killer. imho
It's much like Choosing strings, tone wood, reeds, bows or Piano styles.
We all have preferences.

[vortrex]

Does it matter if it's 30% more if the final price still represents good value?

Where the standard veneers are applied at a lower cost geographic location, a custom veneer may have the additional cost of stripping the cabinet of its original veneer and then applying the custom veneer.  So it's sort of double work.

of course it does, unless you don't mind paying 30% more just because it is still a decent price.

I guess I can understand the double work argument, but if it costs that much to strip the stock veneer it seems like it would be a LOT cheaper to just build a new enclosure.

[Tyson]

of course it does, unless you don't mind paying 30% more just because it is still a decent price.

I guess I can understand the double work argument, but if it costs that much to strip the stock veneer it seems like it would be a LOT cheaper to just build a new enclosure.

You have obviously NEVER built an enclosure from scratch.  I have.  30% is faaaaaarrrrrr less that I would charge to build it.  And stripping the existing veneer is NOT a good option. 

Or, you could save ALL that money by building the cabinets yourself and you can see for yourself what exactly is involved.  Seems simple and easy.  It's not.

[wilsynet]

Just wondering about your Zu Soul Superfly speakers. Have you, or are you planning on moving on from this model?

Yes, I'm likely to sell the Zu speakers.  Probably for a steal.  There just isn't room in here for two sets of speakers.

Since you've already purchased the Selah's, I won't go on about Harbeth but I was going to advise that you not discount the line due to the negative experience with that one dealer.

I know you and I have often had similar thoughts on gear, so the recommendation of Harbeth is very much appreciated.  I may re-visit Harbeth at some point, although I'm not in a hurry to do so.  I wonder if the SHL5 also does well in a smaller room -- there seem to be conflicting reports on whether it really does well in such an environment or not.

[wilsynet]

of course it does, unless you don't mind paying 30% more just because it is still a decent price.

Maybe Selah should have priced the standard veneer models at 15% more just so you could feel good about paying less incremental dollars for the custom veneer.  But that wouldn't represent good value to the customers who don't want a custom veneer.

Would it make you feel better if everyone paid more so that you could incrementally pay less, even though you're still paying the same amount in absolute dollars?

[wilsynet]

Why swap out the PMC AML-1's with any of these?  Seems like a sideways step at best to me.

I had no idea.  Those PMC AML1 speakers were $8,500 new, and have integrated Bryston amplifier modules.

I would imagine that yes, it would likely be a sideways move.  Really a matter of taste rather than better or worse in absolute, irrefutable terms.

[doug s.]

Maybe Selah should have priced the standard veneer models at 15% more just so you could feel good about paying less incremental dollars for the custom veneer.  But that wouldn't represent good value to the customers who don't want a custom veneer.

Would it make you feel better if everyone paid more so that you could incrementally pay less, even though you're still paying the same amount in absolute dollars?

the upcharge for salk & cirrus is less, cuz they have to build a veneer on to a cabinet anyway - all you are paying for is the added material cost.  saleh doesn't have to do that; it's included in the p/e cabinet.  so, if you get a special finish on the tempesta, you are paying for the material cost of the stock finish, the added upgrade material cost, and the labor cost to remove the stock finish and apply the upgrade finish.

i am surprised this is surprising to anyone.   

doug s.

[wilsynet]

i am surprised this is surprising to anyone.

Not me.  Totally agree with you.

[doug s.]

I had no idea.  Those PMC AML1 speakers were $8,500 new, and have integrated Bryston amplifier modules.

I would imagine that yes, it would likely be a sideways move.  Really a matter of taste rather than better or worse in absolute, irrefutable terms.

unless all the gushing over the wapor cirrus is not hyperbole.  seems quite a few folks at the rmaf show thought them as good or better than $30k-$40k offerings...

doug s.

[vortrex]

Maybe Selah should have priced the standard veneer models at 15% more just so you could feel good about paying less incremental dollars for the custom veneer.  But that wouldn't represent good value to the customers who don't want a custom veneer.

Would it make you feel better if everyone paid more so that you could incrementally pay less, even though you're still paying the same amount in absolute dollars?

now you're just being silly.  my question of why a Selah veneer is so much more expensive than similar vendors is the question.

[vortrex]

if you get a special finish on the tempesta, you are paying for the material cost of the stock finish

that makes no sense at all.  I'm strictly talking about the $1k custom veneer and not what is included in the base price.  the base price includes the price of the stock finish.

[kip_]

now you're just being silly.  my question of why a Selah veneer is so much more expensive than similar vendors is the question.

Are you being purposely dense? They have to get a cabinetmaker involved and pay them. With prebuilt cabinets then you just drill holes. Note that unlike Salk this INCLUDES the cost of the veneer.

[vortrex]

You have obviously NEVER built an enclosure from scratch.  I have.  30% is faaaaaarrrrrr less that I would charge to build it.  And stripping the existing veneer is NOT a good option. 

Or, you could save ALL that money by building the cabinets yourself and you can see for yourself what exactly is involved.  Seems simple and easy.  It's not.

the enclosures from PE are like $200 retail, which means they are probably made for less than half that cost so there is profit being made for everyone involved.  if indeed all the $ for the Selah custom veneer is because of the time/effort to strip the old off, then why not just build cabinets from scratch for far less?  does anyone even know for sure of the standard veneer is being removed?  maybe he is just veneering over the existing or getting boxes already which are bare.