Magico Q1 versus ...

wilsynet · « **on:** 16 Feb 2012, 11:02 pm »

A number of months ago I heard the Magico Q1 speakers at an audio show. I was floored with what I was hearing out of these comparatively diminutive speakers.

No doubt having something to do with its stargazing price of $25K a pair, the common accusations I've read are "overpriced", "not really all that good" and "who are they kidding?"

Are the Magico Q1s any good? I think so. They may not be everyone's cup of tea, but I think they're good. Are they worth the dollars? Well I certainly can't afford them.

But overpriced could mean one of two things:

1. There are speakers which are just as good for meaningfully less money.
2. There are speakers which cost just as much but are qualitatively much better.

I'm primarily interested in answering #1.

What are your picks for a small monitor that sounds as good as the Magico Q1 for much less money?

Wilson

HT cOz · « **Reply #1 on:** 16 Feb 2012, 11:18 pm »

I like these guys http://www.vaporsound.com/#all

golfugh · « **Reply #2 on:** 16 Feb 2012, 11:23 pm »

Haven't heard the Q1's, but I got to spend a day in my system with the Joseph Audio Pulsar. Incredible monitor. $7000

jermmd · « **Reply #3 on:** 17 Feb 2012, 01:23 am »

The best monitors I've heard are Dynaudio but I haven't heard any of the above speakers including the Magico's. $25k for a monitor is really excessive IMHO. But I have heard they're great.

Joe M.

Letitroll98 · « **Reply #4 on:** 17 Feb 2012, 03:20 am »

I haven't heard the Vapor's, I have heard the Joseph Audio Pulsar, and would second both to go on your shortlist. Reading Valin's review of the Q1 in TAS it read like a review of the Pulsar. The sound was complete, not missing anything except some of the warmth of their floorstanding sibling Perspective. Impressions from people I trust indicate the Vapor is a different kind of speaker, a little more musical, but in the same league as far as quality, albeit this is second hand info. The only other bookshelf I've heard in that league is more expensive, the Tidal Amea Diocera at $33k, sorry.

WGH · « **Reply #5 on:** 17 Feb 2012, 04:22 am »

I would put the Von Schweikert Unifield 2 on a short list for a listen. Slightly larger at 17"h x 10"w x 12" deep and weighing 51 lbs, it is a little less diminutive than the Q1 but it also costs less at $8000. With the right amplification they can sound fantastic.

I don't remember if I have ever heard the Unifield Model 1, at 14"h x 9"h x 13"d it is almost the same size as the Q1 and they are only $4000.

Wayne

wilsynet · « **Reply #6 on:** 17 Feb 2012, 07:25 am »

Just wondering, how do the Cirrus and Joule respectively compare to the Magico? If the Q1 has great bass, does that mean the Cirrus doesn't?

bummrush · « **Reply #7 on:** 17 Feb 2012, 02:48 pm »

I don't know if you care for Legacy speakers but they have quality speakers for not bad prices not cheap but very high quality.

mhconley · « **Reply #8 on:** 17 Feb 2012, 02:54 pm »

At 1/20th the price I'd give Fritz's amazing Carbon 7's a shot. Then again, No Magico speaker has ever impressed me... IMMHO the Paradigm Studio 20's I have in my home theater setup sound better.

If you have the money to spend I'd go for any Von Schweikert Unifield speaker. I'm absolutely in love with the Unifield 3.

I also like Raal & Accuton drivers and I'd wager Salk's SoundScape M7 would sound great, Clearwave's Symphonia 7R, too.

Martin

groovybassist · « **Reply #9 on:** 17 Feb 2012, 03:18 pm »

I agree on the Pulsars - heard them at RMAF and thought they sounded great, even under show conditions.

In a couple of months, I'll take delivery of a pair of Evolution Acoustics MMMicroOne speakers - will let you know if they fit in this category. There's certainly no shortage of folks who've heard them at shows and would likely say they do belong.

fsimms · « **Reply #10 on:** 17 Feb 2012, 03:26 pm »

I think the Pulsars are fantastic, but I think the Salk HT1’s are as good or even better for half the price. The Cirrus is very good too. The Pulsars and the HT1’s have more excitement. The Cirrus is warmer. The Q1’s and the 7R’s didn’t light my fire but that could have been the music, system or the room.

Bob

orientalexpress · « **Reply #11 on:** 17 Feb 2012, 04:06 pm »

i heard the Magico Q1 at the california audio show,not that impressive,i think Sp tech Timepeace have a better image and bass then the Magico ,i also think u gotta give Fritze carbon 7 a home try,It's free

,i don't think Magico can do that.Good luck

lapsan

HT cOz · « **Reply #12 on:** 17 Feb 2012, 04:56 pm »

You might also consider the N2X Kit http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=85020.0

DS-21 · « **Reply #13 on:** 17 Feb 2012, 05:39 pm »

Quote from: wilsynet on 16 Feb 2012, 11:02 pm

1. There are speakers which are just as good for meaningfully less money.
2. There are speakers which cost just as much but are qualitatively much better.

I'm primarily interested in answering #1.

What are your picks for a small monitor that sounds as good as the Magico Q1 for much less money?

My answer is a combination of #1 and #2: a small speaker for meaningfully less money that is qualitatively much better: KEF Reference 201/2.

The only demerit one can level at the 201/2 is that it's quite inefficient, and thus will get congested if one likes to listen to big orchestral pieces at seventh-row-center-in-the-Musikverein levels. Except for that constraint imposed by the chosen compromise of size and bass extension, they are impeccably engineered and beautifully crafted speakers. And they sell for (if memory serves) about $4k for an front mains trio. Less than that if one limits her/his music enjoyment to 2-channel.

Note how smooth its horizontal dispersion is, from Stereophile:

Compare that to the "mushroom cloud" one gets from a poorly designed speaker, such as the Magico Mini, which will narrow in directivity through the midrange, and then balloon at the bottom of the tweeter's passband.

Here, for reference, is the same plot for another $25k Magico speaker, which shows the comparative incompetence of their engineering:

The one time I heard Magico speakers, they sounded just like that: insufferably spitty.

kip_ · « **Reply #14 on:** 17 Feb 2012, 06:07 pm »

If I were looking for a very high end monitor, it'd either be the Vapor Cirrus, Selah Tempesta, or something custom from Salk with the RAAL tweeter. The first two are two of the finest monitors at any price; both are under 5k.

Quote from: sts9fan on 17 Feb 2012, 05:40 pm

This is a joke right? The GR is a fine speaker but it cannot compete with the Magicos.

I completely agree. It's a nice speaker but it's built to a certain price point.

Perhaps the person describing the Cirrus as "warm" is confusing warmth with coherence. A natural sounding, well integrated, coherent monitor is very easy to listen to and hard to beat.

wilsynet · « **Reply #15 on:** 17 Feb 2012, 07:02 pm »

It looks like most people really like the Vapor Cirrus and the Selah Tempesta. In particular, regarding the Vapor Cirrus, I've rarely seen so many people here in a non-manufacturer specific forum speak so positively and unequivocally about a specific component.

The Vapor Cirrus is probably a safer bet for me, it looks easier to drive at 8 ohms and a sensitivity of 87.5 db/2.83v/1m than the Selah Tempesta at 5/4 ohms and a sensitivity of 84.5 db/2.83v/1m.

I'll probably be reaching out to Ryan directly sometime between now and the next two months.

Wondering if people might have additional thoughts about these questions rattling around in my head:

1. I have a 60 wpc LFD Zero MKIV integrated amplifier. The proof of the pudding is in the eating, but is this likely a good pairing, or do I need a 100+ wpc amplifier to drive the Cirrus monitors to their full sonic goodness? I'm in a small room, sitting no further away than 10 feet from the front wall. Although that may change in the future, but I would never expect to have what would be considered a large room.

2. How does the Cirrus Vapor sound at low listening levels? There are a number of speakers out there that sound good when you crank it, but lose all their magic at lower listening levels.

3. How picky about placement are the Cirrus Vapors? How wide is the sweet spot, and also, is 2 feet from the front wall good enough, or do they really need to be pulled out further?

groovybassist · « **Reply #16 on:** 17 Feb 2012, 07:11 pm »

wilsynet:

LFD Zero IV, eh? Very cool. I'd be surprised if it wasn't great with the Vapor. I'm in the process of selling a Zero Mk III - I love the LFD sound, but with streaming audio (which is my main way of listening right now), I just needed a remote control. I've ended up with an Aaron No.1.a, which I'm very happy with as well. Good luck in your search - would love to hear how it turns out.

WGH · « **Reply #17 on:** 17 Feb 2012, 08:26 pm »

Although I like the Fritz Carbon 7's they are more a musical sounding speaker than the hyper-real sounding Q1. The Fritz speakers you listen to every day, the Q1's you play to impress your audiophile buddies.

A speaker that intrigues me is the new Odyssey Reference Monitor, it is small enough to qualify as a small monitor but puts out a big sound. The price is below $5000 too. The Reference Monitor got many favorable reviews at it's unveiling at the last RMAF and it wasn't even broken in yet. I was impressed. Klaus used expensive parts like the high-end ScanSpeak Revelator 4531 and the new Beryllium tweeter by ScanSpeak to see what could be achieved in a small package and wildly succeeded. Unfortunately the cabinet looks like it was made in his garage under a deadline. If he ups his game with a more elegant cabinet he will have a winner.

standub · « **Reply #18 on:** 17 Feb 2012, 08:30 pm »

Quote from: wilsynet on 17 Feb 2012, 07:02 pm

1. I have a 60 wpc LFD Zero MKIV integrated amplifier. The proof of the pudding is in the eating, but is this likely a good pairing, or do I need a 100+ wpc amplifier to drive the Cirrus monitors to their full sonic goodness? I'm in a small room, sitting no further away than 10 feet from the front wall. Although that may change in the future, but I would never expect to have what would be considered a large room.

2. How does the Cirrus Vapor sound at low listening levels? There are a number of speakers out there that sound good when you crank it, but lose all their magic at lower listening levels.

3. How picky about placement are the Cirrus Vapors? How wide is the sweet spot, and also, is 2 feet from the front wall good enough, or do they really need to be pulled out further?

1. I'm currently using my old Marantz SR7000 and it really only puts out 70 watts a channel and it sounds great to me. Usually i'm about 12 feet away.

2. They are very linear to me, low volume or high volume they sound the same tonally.

3. They are ported on the back so you do have that limitation to deal with but other than that they don't seem picky. I bought mine to eventually also be my front speakers for a home theater so off axis response was important to me and IMHO these are some of the best. Currently since I don't have the HT set up they are in my bedroom and honestly they still sound good in my bathroom that is off to the side of them.

P.S. the Odyssey Ref Monitors are pretty sweet too.

kip_ · « **Reply #19 on:** 17 Feb 2012, 08:36 pm »

Are the Odyssey monitors ported? I highly doubt they reach deep enough in a sealed cabinet to play full range. The revelators will hit maybe 50hz in a reasonably sized cabinet. I've also read reports that the RAAL is superior to the Be tweeter but I think that is a matter of taste.