starting out on a budget....

mightym · « **on:** 19 Nov 2011, 10:33 pm »

I'm wanting to put together something to do Two things.

1: Provide me with private listening while blocking the majority of ambient noise around me.

2: Provide connectivity between my computer and my analog stereo system of OK fidelity.

I've only owned one pair of headphones before, and that was in the '70's, an old pair of cheap Sennheiser's I bought on sale at an audio shop, long since gone....

I've been doing a little research on the WWW today, and I'm considering the following, and would like comment from the good folks at AC regarding my choices.

Purchasing a Fiio 10, as a go between, and a headphone amp. I'm not sure though that I will be able to hook it up to my Integrated KT-88 SET. Can I run a patch cable from the Fiio 10's headphone output to the line level input of my amp without damaging either one? No need, I went back and looked again, there's a line out on the unit, DOH!

Then there is the matter of a headphone choice. I'm 52 years old, can no longer hear much above 16K. From what I've read today, I need closed back can's to give the privacy needed, but it's easier to get fidelity at a decent price if they are open. The AKG K77, and K 99, fall into my range and both seem favorably regarded, but I'm also open to other suggestions. The KRK KNS 6400, and 8400 are also seemingly bargains at the price.....

I'm aware that everyone has their own personal favorite's, I have no preconceived notions regarding the headphones. I would like to not be out more that $50-100 for the 'phone's. Truth be told, since the Fiio 10 will cost in the $75 range, and my original thinking was to keep cost under $200, I could spend a little bit more than $100, and still come in on budget.

Please enlighten me good people....And thanks for the help.
John

mightym · « **Reply #1 on:** 19 Nov 2011, 10:36 pm »

I should add, that the choices I listed previously were as much about the comfort of wearing them as fidelity. I tend to listen, when I get the chance, for lengthy sessions. Comfort, and listening fatigue are prime considerations regarding the final choice.

John

mightym · « **Reply #2 on:** 20 Nov 2011, 03:48 pm »

I've been doing a little ( really a lot ) of research on the web this AM. Mostly reading review sites and reviews posted by buyers. Since I'm pretty cheap at heart, and don't have a lot of experience with cans, I've stayed to the low side of my budget. I can always upgrade from here. I see where there have been a number of views of this, but no commenters....

As of now I'm narrowed to 2 choices, both reviewed as balanced sounding, comfortable and outstanding value for the $ spent.

The AKG K 77, and the Audio-Technica ATH-M40fs are the current frontrunners unless other suggestions come along.

John

Noseyears · « **Reply #3 on:** 21 Nov 2011, 11:58 pm »

Hello,
Can you tell us more about your musical preferences? AKG and ATH line sound signatures are way different.

SteveFord · « **Reply #4 on:** 22 Nov 2011, 12:31 am »

Check out some of the cheaper Grados - not sealed but very comfortable and non-fatiguing.

Russell Dawkins · « **Reply #5 on:** 22 Nov 2011, 12:36 am »

I think the Fostex T50RPs are worth considering. Not the most comfortable or beautiful in the world, but low distortion mid range and treble for the price and can be modded to another level entirely. Closed back, too.

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=98738.0

saisunil · « **Reply #6 on:** 23 Nov 2011, 01:31 am »

ATH M50s - buy them used if you like or or even better (IME)SRH-840s
I sold them at much lower price ...

mightym · « **Reply #7 on:** 23 Nov 2011, 03:33 am »

Thanks for the replies.

I'm on the road ATM

I cannot audition any of these can's. At least no where that I'm aware of in NE Okla.

An audio bud suggested the Shure SCH 440's as being great bang for the buck They are the next step down the line from the 820' IIRC.

I did a quick look at the Fostex's, they are available within my price range, but I really have no experience with the cans to rely on. The reviews I saw were all over the place. plus I'm not familiar with any of the "Mods" that were mentioned to be necessary to the outstanding performance.

Some definite food for thought.

When I get back home later this week I'll look about some more.

I kinda eliminated the A-T M50's 'cuz they only come w/1/4" plug.

I've also added folding to the requirements, since I will be traveling with these.

More later,
John

dB Cooper · « **Reply #8 on:** 23 Nov 2011, 04:05 am »

If traveling is a big piece of the picture, have you considered IEMs? There are decent ones in your price range and the isolation will probably exceed most full size cans. I am getting a moderate priced Ultimate Ears set soon because I need at least one pair of isolating 'phones but can't abide sealed around-the-ear types for more than a few minutes no matter how good they sound.

I did listen to some Sony 'phones some years ago that were relatively inexpensive and had excellent isolation; don't remember the model number.
Another option might be Sennheiser HD228's, an over the ear model that is on deep markdown at Amazon. The earpieces swivel to make a "flat pack" but the headband doesn't fold. How far wrong can you go for $36?

Don't rule out 1/4" plugs; adapter options abound. Some even come with them.

Russell Dawkins · « **Reply #9 on:** 23 Nov 2011, 08:58 am »

Quote from: mightym on 23 Nov 2011, 03:33 am

I did a quick look at the Fostex's, they are available within my price range, but I really have no experience with the cans to rely on.
I kinda eliminated the A-T M50's 'cuz they only come w/1/4" plug.
I've also added folding to the requirements, since I will be traveling with these.
John

This from the A-T page on the M50:
Connector: Gold-plated stereo 1/8" (3.5 mm) connector with strain relief and professional screw-on 1/4" (6.3 mm) adapter. They fold, too, and come with a very useful pouch which looks just like one of A-T's microphone pouches.

The Fostex on the other hand does not fold and is 1/4" only. I have worn both and can recommend the A-T. It is definitely more comfortable than the Fostex, looks better, and has outstanding bass. The Fostex wins in the midrange, though, by a small margin. If I had to choose one I would go for the A-T, as I like the folding feature and I am a sucker for deep clean bass, truth be told.

mightym · « **Reply #10 on:** 24 Nov 2011, 02:17 am »

Thanks Russell, for your kind help. The comment I made about the plug should have been aimed at the A-T AT M40fs, they only come with 1/4" plug. The general idea is to not carry more stuff than I already have to, since I have to schlep this stuff home to use it here too.

I intend to do some more research on the modding of headphones, as the idea of the Fostex cans appeals to me. The putative " best " 'phones are planar magnetics, and the idea of getting in at a low entry point and tweaking to superior performance appeals to the tightwad in me.

I can live without the folding feature, but it would make things easier.

db Cooper, I have considered the In Ear options, but I'm the opposite of you in that regard. I've spent many weekend days at the gun range wearing over the ear muffs, or in ear suppressors. For that kind of activity I can go either way, but for long term use I find the over the ear type more comfy.

I've got more research to do.....

Thanks you-all for your help.

Brain Fart. I commented that there was no where to go listen to cans in my area. Well Tulsa is 60 miles from here, and has a Guitar Center, according to their website, they stock almost all of the phone's I'm interested in hearing...A trip to T-Town is in order.

More after the trip to town....hope they aren't too busy Friday.

John

Russell Dawkins · « **Reply #11 on:** 24 Nov 2011, 02:45 am »

You are welcome. If it is any further help, I bought a pair of M40fs for my studio years ago on the advice of another studio owner and found I could not work with them - they were so tonally colored I could not hear what I needed to hear. I sold them and bought a pair of secondhand AKG k601s for the same purpose (convenience monitoring around the studio) and like them a lot, as I do the whole family of AKGs.

The A-T 50s are a different story, though. I could live with the small midrange non-linearities, plus would enjoy the way they fold, the versatility, the comfort (although a little warm) and the bass!.

mightym · « **Reply #12 on:** 24 Nov 2011, 02:52 am »

It blows my mind that these MFG's market the products as "Studio Monitors" which to my way of thinking would mean they need to be tonally accurate, and neutral. ( Then again what do I know, I like my Fostex FE 206's in their BLH's. )

I'm looking forward to Friday, I hope the Guitar center has all the stuff in stock that they listed as such on the site, they even had the option of some used gear that looked interesting too.

Russell Dawkins · « **Reply #13 on:** 24 Nov 2011, 06:34 am »

Many makers of speakers and headphones use the term "studio monitor" for its serious sales appeal without much regard for its ramifications - which over the years has led to certain recordings having a strange tonal balance which really only makes sense when heard on the speakers they were mixed and sometimes mastered on. JBL comes to mind for their contribution during the 70's, at least. They are actually quite good these days, since Floyd Toole has held a position of influence in the corporation.
In the modern project studio monitors are used which are not entirely accurate - a typical flaw being a slight "smiley-face" EQ tonality - a little subtle boost in the entire bass region and a similar broad but subtle rise in the entire treble range. Alternately, it could be thought of as a low Q (broad) trough in the mids - around 1k.

This sounds slightly "hi-fi" and is inclined to impress the client, which is nice but does not translate to sounding great on the largest number of playback devices - car radios, boom boxes, TVs, headphones, surround systems and low, mid and hi end home systems.

A truly neutral studio monitor, of which there are just a few, can be a joy to listen to with a very good recording.

adydula · « **Reply #14 on:** 24 Nov 2011, 08:34 pm »

ATH M50's...excellent low cost, entry level cans.....I have $1000 cans and some in between, these are indeed very nice for the price..

All the best
Alex

Noseyears · « **Reply #15 on:** 26 Nov 2011, 01:33 am »

I think the HFI-580's is a nice pair of headphones, they have better detail level than the M50's. Nice attack, with a nice amount of bass.

Let us know how everything goes,

dB Cooper · « **Reply #16 on:** 26 Nov 2011, 05:44 am »

This thread is a perfect example of how one man's meat is another man's poison... as much for headphones as for speakers, maybe more so since you don't wear speakers. There is something on this list for everyone to like and dislike. I have been following with interest as I have been looking for something similar- a portable, easy-to-drive, reasonably-priced set of 'phones that isolate and are comfortable. That last is the hard part for me- I have long been partial to the Sennheiser open models (have 555s right now). "Active" noise canceling models have no real performance advantage over a good isolating design in my experience so those are out. Right now the leading candidates (for me) are Sennheiser 228 over-ear (how far wrong can you go for $36 at Amazon) and/or Ultimate Ears 500s IEMs (about $50 street price). Looking at user reviews, the expensive IEM models seem to get dinged for the same issues as the cheap ones, plus IEMs are relatively loseable so it doesn't seem to make sense to spend a pile of cash on them. I'm sure I could do better at the price point you have in mind but for portable use I'm more easily pleased than for more serious listening at home. Good luck in your search!

mightym · « **Reply #17 on:** 26 Nov 2011, 10:43 pm »

I had read a number of headphone site postings indicating that the poster went to "Guitar Center" and listened to this or that set of cans. Well Just so you don't waste your time like I did, apparently Oklahoma law doesn't allow them to have a " Headphone Tree ", something about health regulations. I have in fact gone into stores in Oklahoma and listened to music over headphones, the only difference was that the store was selling the music, not the cans.

What a disappointment, and why didn't I call before driving 60 miles? That's on me anyway, not them. They were nice, and the advice of the salesman reinforced much of what I've been reading online all along.

I'm going to wait until Cyber Monday, and place an order for whichever of the cans on my short list is most reasonably priced then.

The more I read about the most recommended set, The A-T ATH M50's the more I like. However, the price is still out of the budget. I hope someone has a superlative deal online Monday morning.

The current short list is:
Sony MDV R6,
Shure SRH 440,
A-T ATH M50,
Ultrasone HFI 450,
and the Fostex T-40 RP II

I'm leaning toward the Shure from several standpoints. They are light, reviewed as comfortable by most reviewers, the cable is easily replaceable, as well as having full repair part availability.

Would anyone here care to comment on the Ultrasone'? it's a recommendation from an associate, and I've no experience with that brand at all. They are reputed to be neutral sounding, which will suit me, as I listen to a wide variety of genre.

Thanks again for all the helpful commentary.

John

Addendum, I just noticed the HFI 580's are on sale at Amazon within my range ( barely ). I may need to alter my list, yet again............

mightym · « **Reply #18 on:** 26 Nov 2011, 11:08 pm »

Noseyears,

would you care to comment on the sound of the HFI 580's in regard to the open large soundstage that some commenters have raved about? Getting the music out of your head as it were.

I really enjoy sitting right in the sweet spot of a well set up HiFi rig that plays those old '60's, and '70's recordings where I can close my eyes and locate each instrument....Holographic sound if you will.

I'm curious, would not have expected to get sound like that out of a set of cans...

John

mightym · « **Reply #19 on:** 28 Nov 2011, 10:56 am »

I got sucked into the Black Friday thing at WalMart this year, after stating that I would never do that...

Hey everyone has his price....

I just pulled the trigger on an order for Cyber Monday. I went with the overwhelming choice of nearly all the reading I did. The A-T ATH M50s, and my original choice for DAC/Amp the Fiio E 10.

Broke the budget by $8 and change, I'll have to skip lunch one day this week.

Gotta go to work now, thanks again all who posted. I'll try to be back in a few weeks to give a review.

John