Changing from ScanSpeak to Raal 70-20XR tweeters in my TRT's

rklein · « **on:** 3 Nov 2011, 03:22 pm »

I have been enjoying my DIY'd TRT's for close to two years now. Very nice non-fatiguing sound.

As much as I like my speakers, I have wondered what they might sound like if I switched out the ScanSpeak D3004/6600-00 AirCirc Tweeters with some Raal Tweeters.

After talking with Rick, I decided to go ahead and purchase a set of the Raal 70-20XR tweeters from him and try them in my TRT's.

I will post my impressions on this change after living with the Raal's for a bit.

Currently, I have Nightshade Audio electronics driving my TRT's.

Regards,

Randy

ricardojoa · « **Reply #1 on:** 3 Nov 2011, 03:32 pm »

Good luck, and please report back.

You have a great looking system!

jackman · « **Reply #2 on:** 3 Nov 2011, 03:35 pm »

Are you sure you want to do this? Those ScanSpeak tweets are VERY nice. I'm biased because I'm not a fan of ribbons but your dome tweets are very high quality. Good luck.

Also, those are really nice looking speakers! How do they sound in your current setup?

Pez · « **Reply #3 on:** 3 Nov 2011, 03:39 pm »

I say go for it, Raal is better than scanspeak IMO. For whatever thats worth...

rklein · « **Reply #4 on:** 3 Nov 2011, 04:05 pm »

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Are you sure you want to do this? Those ScanSpeak tweets are VERY nice.

Yes, the ScanSpeak tweets ARE very nice! However, the only way that I will be able to REALLY test whether the Raal's are the real deal is to try them in MY system, in MY room with MY electronics. The worst thing that can happen is that I don't care for them and end up selling them and going back to my ScanSpeaks.

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Also, those are really nice looking speakers! How do they sound in your current setup?

I have a pretty small room at present (14' x 14') and I am "in-between" DACS as I sold my EE minidac and bought a very inexpensive DAC to hold me over until I complete my build of a TP Buffalo III w/Paul Hynes regs. However, while I had the EE DAC, the system sounded full of accurate tone/tambre to my classically trained ears. Imaging was very good as well. I could close my eyes and could picture the instruments being in their proper places. The TRT's are not a forward in your face type of speaker. Vocalists are just a little in front of the accompanying music.(which is where they are in live settings)

Will the Raals be an upgrade?? Well, if I like what I am hearing than yes, it is an upgrade.

BTW, being from NE Ohio, I love your avatar!

Regards,

Randy

jonbee · « **Reply #5 on:** 3 Nov 2011, 04:57 pm »

It should be an interesting comparison. In a well designed speaker (that is, designed for integration with a ribbon) I personally prefer good ribbons to ANY dome tweeters I've heard, but there are things they don't seem to do as well. Ribbons have more air, better internal definition and clarity, but less body than domes. The also have problems integrating with other conventional drivers (my Tempestas use an Accuton mid, and the integration is perfect). The RAAL doesn't seem much different in these areas than other good ribbons.
That said, to me domes just sound slow and closed in by comparison, but as in all things, how they match up with your woofers and taste will rule.

srb · « **Reply #6 on:** 3 Nov 2011, 05:03 pm »

What will be required as far as modification to the current crossover? It would be hard to imagine that they could just be swapped without some crossover rework.

Steve

rklein · « **Reply #7 on:** 3 Nov 2011, 05:30 pm »

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What will be required as far as modification to the current crossover?

Rick has stated my existing crossovers need some different caps as well as a couple of different resistors.

Rick Craig · « **Reply #8 on:** 3 Nov 2011, 06:43 pm »

Both are great tweeters - just a matter of preference. I've always liked ribbons so that's what I use. The RAAL has also won over many people who didn't like ribbons.

rklein · « **Reply #9 on:** 4 Nov 2011, 02:21 pm »

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What will be required as far as modification to the current crossover? It would be hard to imagine that they could just be swapped without some crossover rework.

Well, upon further discussion with Rick, I have decided not to modify the crossovers myself but rather send him one upper woofer(2.5 way speaker) along with the two crossovers for the upper woofer/tweeter and let him re-do the crossovers with his software as he already has the Raal tweeters in-house.

He is going to charge me a whole $50 for this service.

Rick has been great to deal with and is a real asset to AC members.

Regards,

Randy

Rob S. · « **Reply #10 on:** 4 Nov 2011, 08:50 pm »

Good move Randy. Both cost and the move to the Raals.

I made the move last year and haven't looked back. And I had no faults with the air circ tweeters, raals are just a step up.

Speaking of Ricks help, he went way overboard on his time and expertise to get me setup for active triamping with DEQX, just in case you try that route.

Look forward to your feedback when you get your drivers installed.

Rob S

rklein · « **Reply #11 on:** 6 Nov 2011, 02:25 pm »

Hey Rob:

Pleasure speaking with you on the phone the other day. And yes...I am absolutely intrigued by going down the DEQX road. I know that there is one for sale right here on AC but I must resist for right now

Regards,

Randy

drmike · « **Reply #12 on:** 6 Nov 2011, 04:39 pm »

are you going to modify the cabinets or make new ones?
i have the ssr's i'm thinking of changing.
thanks,
drmike

rklein · « **Reply #13 on:** 7 Nov 2011, 02:02 pm »

The only cabinet modifications that need be done will be to make the tweeter openings a bit larger to accomodate the back box of the Raal 70-20XR's. The fronts of the Raals completely cover the existing cut-outs made for the ScanSpeaks. I will just have to front mount the Raals(but will try and see if I can flush mount them as I am sure my OCD will be at play

)

Regards,

Randy

AvFan · « **Reply #14 on:** 8 Nov 2011, 04:19 am »

Those are such pretty cabinets I'd have a tough time squaring up the existing tweeter opening to try out the RAAL. I say this only because of how nice your cabinets are and not because I have any opinion regarding whether the RAAL or ScanSpeak sound better. I don't think you could go back the ScanSpeak if you didn't like the RAAL unless you did some pretty slick routing and inlay work to cover the screw holes used to mount the RAAL. Also, Rick designed a nice MTM for me using the RAAL and it is supposed to be surface mounted versus flush mounted. Rick will certainly confirm that for your particular application. Enjoy!

Rick Craig · « **Reply #15 on:** 8 Nov 2011, 02:03 pm »

Quote from: AvFan on 8 Nov 2011, 04:19 am

Those are such pretty cabinets I'd have a tough time squaring up the existing tweeter opening to try out the RAAL. I say this only because of how nice your cabinets are and not because I have any opinion regarding whether the RAAL or ScanSpeak sound better. I don't think you could go back the ScanSpeak if you didn't like the RAAL unless you did some pretty slick routing and inlay work to cover the screw holes used to mount the RAAL. Also, Rick designed a nice MTM for me using the RAAL and it is supposed to be surface mounted versus flush mounted. Rick will certainly confirm that for your particular application. Enjoy!

The 70-20XR frame is fairly thin so it really doesn't have to be flushmounted. With a mod like this that would be very difficult to do because of the difference in the frame depths.

rklein · « **Reply #16 on:** 8 Nov 2011, 06:22 pm »

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The 70-20XR frame is fairly thin so it really doesn't have to be flushmounted. With a mod like this that would be very difficult to do because of the difference in the frame depths.

Rick:

Thanks for the clarification on the mounting of the Raal's.

AvFan:

Based on conversations with 3 to 4 people both here on AC and elsewhere, whose opinions I respect, is why I am making this move. Actually, I am glad that the Raal's need to be surface mounted. If for some reason, I think that I made a lateral move, it will be not too hard to plug the screw holes needed for the Raal's so that only I will know where those holes were made.

Regards,

Randy

jmc207 · « **Reply #17 on:** 8 Nov 2011, 06:50 pm »

I'd think some strong tape could hold the RAAL in place well enough for an initial audition. It has been done before. Then proceed from there.

AvFan · « **Reply #18 on:** 9 Nov 2011, 07:01 am »

Quote from: rklein on 8 Nov 2011, 06:22 pm

Based on conversations with 3 to 4 people both here on AC and elsewhere, whose opinions I respect, is why I am making this move. Actually, I am glad that the Raal's need to be surface mounted. If for some reason, I think that I made a lateral move, it will be not too hard to plug the screw holes needed for the Raal's so that only I will know where those holes were made.

Regards,

Randy

Quote from: jmc207 on 8 Nov 2011, 06:50 pm

I'd think some strong tape could hold the RAAL in place well enough for an initial audition. It has been done before. Then proceed from there.

Rick is certainly sold on the RAALs (I really like my MTMs with the RAAL) so there is a very good chance you will like them in your TRTs. Are they better than the ScanSpeak? I'll be curious to know what you think. And that sounds like a great idea to try and tape (double stick?) the RAALs in place versus screws through the lacquer. It is the woodworker in me that wants to preserve nice finishes like the one on your TRTs.

rklein · « **Reply #19 on:** 9 Nov 2011, 04:46 pm »

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I'd think some strong tape could hold the RAAL in place well enough for an initial audition. It has been done before. Then proceed from there.

jmc207:

Thanks for the tape idea. Mucho Appreciado!

Regards,

Randy