[vortrex]

Vortrex,

If we go way back, and if I remember correctly (uh-oh... ), you started noticing noise as a problem after you replaced your BAT amplifier with the LineMagnetic right? If that is basically true, then you probably had a fair amount of phono related noise the whole time you were using the BAT but you just never noticed it. The extra 10dB of gain that you picked up in the LineMagnetic allowed you to hear the noise and pay more attention to it. 10dB is a lot of gain, no matter where you place it.

You asked earlier if you should include the gain of your amp in you calculations. The answer is yes. Not necessarily for the KAB calculator, but for your own calculations. Try dropping your phono gain calculations by 10 dB and see if that gets you closer to where you want to be. (Subtract 10dB from the phono since you picked up 10dB in the amp.)

You said the Leben with the step up was quiet. Why did you change it then? If you didn't like the sound of that combo, try using an active with only 49dB.

yes, that is definitely true.  that's why I've always been mentioning it as a gain issue (with my limited knowledge).  I think my other thread was even entitled "too much gain?".  ok, good to know about the gain for the cart then.  it seems I've read so many posts saying your phono pre needs to be X gain for Y cart otherwise it will not "sing".  that's why I was hesitant to get a pre with much less gain than what KAB, etc suggests.  if it really is system gain that's important I can work towards that.  I was not an owner of the Leben, the dealer who I got the amp from came by with it to use for testing.  I've got it arranged with him to borrow it for a couple of days.

[Gzerro]

here are some crude measurements I did before with an app on my phone.  now this is with the volume knob pegged, but you can get a feeling for the huge difference in noise level.

CDP connected or no input connected to the amp = 28-30db
phono stage connected (with table or not) = 68-70db and can spike up to 75db

I feel bad for possibly have injecting bad information here. My perception at the dealers was that the Zesto and Chinook were very quiet, but that is in comparison to realistic volume levels we were listening at and mostly with jazz and rock records. He cranked it up, but did not max the volume during his demo.

You have a lot of knowledgeable people here saying what you are getting is within a normal range, people much more knowledgeable than I am.

To inject an objective comparison I just made some measurements with my system, a Parasound JC-3 (reviewed as a very quiet phono stage), into a Parasound P7 pre. The P7 has a digital readout for volume which helps make objective comparisons. I used my Radio Shack SPL meter, which unfortunately only reads down to 50db so I couldn't make measurements of noise below that threshold.

For a baseline, in my system at "60" volume, a compressed rock record plays at an average SPL of 80db. At "75" I am averaging 100db.

If I switch the JC3 into MC mode (68db of gain) with nothing plugged in, background noise becomes audible from the LP (to me) around "65-70" on the volume knob. It does not hit 50db and become measurable until "83". If I pegged the volume to 100 it would probably be about the same as you are getting.

Its looks to me like your noise is a bit worse than what I am getting, but not broken.

I am sorry if my prior post was misleading. I still have trouble thinking anyone would be bothered by the noise from the Zesto, but perhaps my hearing just isn't that good or I am not as sensitive to noise as others.

If you want to sell your Zesto send me a PM

[vortrex]

this issue has been resolved.  as suspected, it was too much gain.  after bringing in the 4th high-end phono pre, and it sounding exactly the same as the others, I bought some good 14db attenuators.  problem solved!  not only is it quiet now, but the volume knob is much easier to control.  unlike everything waki said, the noise did not stay in ratio to the music level.  so, I have to turn it up more now (which is good), and the noise level does not increase.