[musicgeek]

Hi everyone! So I'm converting my setup from a dedicated desktop stereo listening to a mixed use HT+music living room system.

As of now, I have:
Sabaj D5 DAC
Modwright SWL 9.0SE pre
Odyssey Khartago extreme monoblocks
running a pair of really good speakers.

80% of my listening is digital (Spotify, youtube, Tidal).


I am moving to a 3.1 system with a TV, and realized the inconvenience of this setup to run on TV with my initial plan of just getting a decent AVR.
The Modwright has HT bypass, which is a big reason I bought it in the first place, and sounds great. But looking at the setup, it'll be:

Bluetooth dongle, Chromecast audio, TV streamer optical into DAC, feeding into Modwright
Vinyl player into phono pre into Modwright
AVR preout into Modwright HT bypass

Just to listen to different music from Youtube (30%) to Spotify (70%), I would need to change DAC source and preamp source each time (and this is just digital sources)

So I was thinking of 'downgrading' the preamp and getting a high-ish end AVR (Yamaha Aventage 1070+, Anthem MRX 520+), which people claim have very clean preamp stages.
Yamaha would come with a network streamer (spotify/tidal) as well as phono preamp, and I'll continue to use my Odyssey monoblocks for powering stereo - basically a one-remote setup, or zero if I use voice.

I get to sell the preamp as well as the DAC and recover a good bit of cash too.

Is the significant convenience worth the trade-off in sound? How much is my preamp doing in my current listening experience (which I love)?

[Freo-1]

I understand what you are trying to do, but the pre out from the Yamaha is sub optimum at best.  I tried this awhile back, and discovered that the preamp out from the Yamaha was very mid-fi sounding.  Truth be told, the Yamaha receiver sounded better using it as an integrated than running the preamp out to external amps. 

[charmerci]

I'd suggest just watching your videos through your system as is, at least at first. (Have you?) I can't see (hear?) it sounding that much "better" through an AVR.

[musicgeek]

Thanks! Freo, could I ask which Yamaha you tried? I was afraid of this..

Chamerci, it would be good if I could try, but as of now I don't have a TV or AVR. Which AVR I end up buying would depend on this.. So its hard to make a comparison up front. I don't want to buy an expensive receiver if im keeping the stereo pre..

[Freo-1]

It was the 2040.  Don't think there is much change in this area with the current model. 


The AVR receiver actually sounds pretty decent when used as an all in one.  Have you thought about using a speaker switch?  You could switch in the AVR for streaming music, and your existing rig for more critical listening. 

[musicgeek]

Got it, thanks! Seems like my plan isn't the best then.
The thing is, I love the Odyssey amps and my stereo speakers are going to be power (and current) hungry 3-ways (30-20000hz).
Would the 2 channel system alone be satisfying for movies? I can then sell the center channel and subwoofer and live with what I have...

[Freo-1]

The short answer is yes.   I do that. 


Here's the trick: Need to have the HDMI from the blu ray audio feed the TV, and use digital out from the TV to the DAC. 

[charmerci]

Years ago, I would just watch videos through my computer screen and my  stereo with a sub and a pair of stereo speakers... and frankly, it was damn impressive! Just hook it up to your stereo first. I don't think you'll miss a center speaker, surround speakers, etc.

[Freo-1]

Years ago, I would just watch videos through my computer screen and my  stereo with a sub and a pair of stereo speakers... and frankly, it was damn impressive! Just hook it up to your stereo first. I don't think you'll miss a center speaker, surround speakers, etc.

Agree.  However,  with modern 5.1 mix from blu ray/DVD, need to feed the audio to the TV, and the digital out from the TV to the DAC.  Otherwise,  won't get any dialogue. 

[A_shah]

I have two separate systems in the same room , was using the OPPO 205 Via HDMI from LG OLED TV and using the DAC & 7 channel out to WYred4Sound MC7150 Class D amp. for the HT . I was looking for a separate Pre -pro processor  for HT system but in the end could not justify the cost based on specs. so ended up recently buying a Denon AVR-H4500H WOW what a difference the experience with the Audyssey XT 32 is simply outstanding. the Dolby Atmos just about brings the reality to whole experience

 of Streaming 4K from Netflix or Amazon . I find the experience far better than visiting a Cinema Theater  My main Stereo speakers are finally packed and being shipped to Lou Hinkeley for upgrades
Asghar

[ooheadsoo]

Wouldn't a regular chromecast satisfy both your YouTube and Spotify needs? My personal solution is to use my TV as a monitor for my pc. From the pc, I can access pretty much any digital source that I use. Even so, I'm considering getting a regular chrome cast just to simplify things.

As for multi channel blu-ray, don't either the player or receiver down mix to however many channels you tell it to?

[Doublej]

What speakers are you using?

[SoCalWJS]

I have two separate systems in the same room , was using the OPPO 205 Via HDMI from LG OLED TV and using the DAC & 7 channel out to WYred4Sound MC7150 Class D amp. for the HT . I was looking for a separate Pre -pro processor  for HT system but in the end could not justify the cost based on specs. so ended up recently buying a Denon AVR-H4500H WOW what a difference the experience with the Audyssey XT 32 is simply outstanding. the Dolby Atmos just about brings the reality to whole experience

 of Streaming 4K from Netflix or Amazon . I find the experience far better than visiting a Cinema Theater  My main Stereo speakers are finally packed and being shipped to Lou Hinkeley for upgrades
Asghar

I’m basically in this camp as well.

Bought a “Refurb” Denon 4500h from A4L a while back. Use the pre outs to either Odyssey or a Custom Folsom Chip amp. Not as good of a sound as when I use my ModWright LS100 for critical listening, but a whole heck of a lot more convenient 99%+ of the time. DirecTV, ModWright OPPO 205 (HDMI & Analog), Roku, Chromestick, Firestick, and iPad/Computer (WiFI) all connected to the Denon. Between the DirecTV remote and the iPad, I can control virtually every function and source.

Wife can just use DirecTV Remote for ease.

I have a “problematic” room that is the limiting factor for true max performance (even with extensive Room Treatment). Convinced I can‘t get much more out of this system until/unless I move. So I can minimize a few room issues with Audyssey at the cost of less performance on the Pre amp side. It’s a trade-off that I will put up with for the sake of convenience and Family harmony.

[musicgeek]

Wouldn't a regular chromecast satisfy both your YouTube and Spotify needs? My personal solution is to use my TV as a monitor for my pc. From the pc, I can access pretty much any digital source that I use. Even so, I'm considering getting a regular chrome cast just to simplify things.

As for multi channel blu-ray, don't either the player or receiver down mix to however many channels you tell it to?

Well, chromecast would, if I connected it to my AVR though I would be using the AVR as a preamp (which is less desirable if I choose to use a dedicated preamp as well)...unless you are suggesting 2 chromecasts, one for AVR and one directly on the TV for music, in which case that's an interesting idea!

[musicgeek]

Bought a “Refurb” Denon 4500h from A4L a while back. Use the pre outs to either Odyssey or a Custom Folsom Chip amp. Not as good of a sound as when I use my ModWright LS100 for critical listening, but a whole heck of a lot more convenient 99%+ of the time. DirecTV, ModWright OPPO 205 (HDMI & Analog), Roku, Chromestick, Firestick, and iPad/Computer (WiFI) all connected to the Denon. Between the DirecTV remote and the iPad, I can control virtually every function and source.

Wife can just use DirecTV Remote for ease.

I have a “problematic” room that is the limiting factor for true max performance (even with extensive Room Treatment). Convinced I can‘t get much more out of this system until/unless I move. So I can minimize a few room issues with Audyssey at the cost of less performance on the Pre amp side. It’s a trade-off that I will put up with for the sake of convenience and Family harmony.

I have two separate systems in the same room , was using the OPPO 205 Via HDMI from LG OLED TV and using the DAC & 7 channel out to WYred4Sound MC7150 Class D amp. for the HT . I was looking for a separate Pre -pro processor  for HT system but in the end could not justify the cost based on specs. so ended up recently buying a Denon AVR-H4500H WOW what a difference the experience with the Audyssey XT 32 is simply outstanding. the Dolby Atmos just about brings the reality to whole experience

 of Streaming 4K from Netflix or Amazon . I find the experience far better than visiting a Cinema Theater  My main Stereo speakers are finally packed and being shipped to Lou Hinkeley for upgrades
Asghar

Great to know this camp exists! Phew. I hadn't factored in room EQ, as my room is going to be plenty challenging I think (haven't moved yet). I'm itching to give both the Anthem (better sound) and Yamaha (better convenience features) a try, alongside the Modwright to see how they all compare - but honestly I think I can only afford one of them at a time :/

[musicgeek]

What speakers are you using?

A pair of Jeff Bagby's (RIP) amazing Continuum ii speakers, being upconverted to his 3-ways.

[WGH]

I have the same complicated setup you are contemplating, a surround processor and a preamp in the same system.

I switched RCA cables between the Van Alstine Fet Valve CFR preamp and the Anthem AVM60 preamp/processor and played some CD's. The Anthem MRX1120 receiver has the same toroidal transformer as the AVM60, the preamp section is probably identical.

I have been very happy with the AVM60, best surround sound I have ever heard. TV, blu-ray, streaming Netflix sound absolutely fantastic.

But as a stand alone preamp for music only the Van Alstine Fet Valve CFR preamp and AVA Fet Valve DAC is clearly better. When listening to CD's the Anthem was not as clean and precise, sounding muffled in comparison. Youtube and Spotify may have such low quality streaming you would never notice.

[charmerci]

Great to know this camp exists! Phew. I hadn't factored in room EQ, as my room is going to be plenty challenging I think (haven't moved yet). I'm itching to give both the Anthem (better sound) and Yamaha (better convenience features) a try, alongside the Modwright to see how they all compare - but honestly I think I can only afford one of them at a time :/

Buy a used AVR online. Plenty of low priced ones.  I found a $5 Sony at my local thrift store and it does sound good.

[Doublej]

A pair of Jeff Bagby's (RIP) amazing Continuum ii speakers, being upconverted to his 3-ways.

Yeah you'll likely hear a difference. Add to that the fact that you'll be going from a tube preamp to a solid state one. So it will definitely sound different. As the Modwright pre has dual outputs I would start with a 2.1 system and see if you feel like you are missing anything when you watch movies.

If you want convenience get an Echo and feed it to the Modwright using the Echo's analog audio out or if you can find a discontinued Chromecast Audio buy it and you can use analog or digital out to feed the Modwright.

I find the Echo to be super convenient. With it I can get TuneIn, iheartradio, Pandora, free Amazon Music and free Spotify*.   *As best I can tell free Spotify needs to be controlled by the Spotify app on a device. You makes your selections on the app and then select the Echo as the speakers.

When on sale you should be able to purchase an Echo Input for $20 and an Echo Dot for $30. The 3.5mm to RCA cable will set you back another $5-$10.

If you can find a used AVR for $5 buy it! A while ago there was a post about someone being impressed with a particular Denon AVR. If you can find the post and a used unit for a reasonable price I'd say go for it as well. Remember though many old AVRs were built in the days of 1080p, not 4K video. So you won't be able to pass 4K resolution from your cable box through the AVR.

[alexbpm]

I have a Yamaha CX-A5200 preamp/processor and I find the preamp section very clean, as tested by Audioholics.  Especially using "straight" mode for bypass.  Once you introducer a power transformer in the same chassis you introduce noise, I much rather hookup an external amp to a dedicated pre.  And if you're on a budget, you could pickup a Class D Audio (giant killer) amp for under $1k that crushes every integrated amp out there under $5k. 

However, the built in streaming capability of the top of the line Yamaha pre is complete garbage, buggy as hell and unusable.  You're better off with a Node 2i or a Cambridge CXN streamer.  My two cents.