[tim92gts]

Hi,
It would be interesting to know which amps you're using on the B&Ws, they're good speakers but they do need plenty of power.
Also i can't remember if they use a port, speaker placement might affect your bass.

Apologies, just reread your original post, can you get a demo of another 4BSST2 to try a bridged pair?
That could well give the bass extra headroom and impact.
Depends a bit how that nominal 8 Ohm impedance matches with reality, another possibility with three ways is to get the extra 4B plus a pair of external crossovers as the low crossover point is at around half power.
Ideal for the 803s would be a pair of 7 Bs.
Tim

[zybar]

My room is about 22x13.  My budget is about $10k.  I guess I would like to get deeper base, but overall I am curious how much better the sound quality can get by upgrading from my B&W 803Ns.. When I upgraded from Rotel components to Bryston the difference was huge.  Now I am wondering if I can get even better sound with new speakers.. Btw I drive a Yaris....

I use Vandersteen 5A's and I think that they would be a huge upgrade over the B&W speakers you have.  Not only will they be more transparent and revealing in a very positive way (i.e. more detail while being less harsh or strident), but the built in subwoofers with 11 band EQ will allow you to get almost flat response from the low 20's to 120hz.  When you have tight and deep bass, you not only will love what it does in the lower octaves, but you will be amazed at how much cleaning up the bass does for the mid-range!

Used 5a's can be had at your price point.

I haven't heard the newest Salk speakers so I can't say how they compare to the 5A's.  I did own Salk HT3's for a few years and while they are a great speaker and an even better value, there isn't any area in which I preferred the HT3's over the 5A's. 

Best of luck on your search.

George

[bobNL]

Hi, noticed that someone mentioned the fact.8 speakers and commented that the sound is different from the i series. Am still wondering if I would go for the PB1i or the fact 8. Could you tell me what difference you would expect. Would be driving them with my b100 integrated. Unfortunately I have not heard them side by side.

Cheers,
Bob

[Diamond Dog]

Hi, noticed that someone mentioned the fact.8 speakers and commented that the sound is different from the i series. Am still wondering if I would go for the PB1i or the fact 8. Could you tell me what difference you would expect. Would be driving them with my b100 integrated. Unfortunately I have not heard them side by side.

Cheers,
Bob

Hi Bob :  My experience was that the i-series speakers which I've heard ( and owned ) sound terrific and offer really good bottom end even at lower volumes ( which is important to me ) but like a lot of British speakers I've heard ( and owned ), they sound a little "laid-back". That can be a fine attribute if that appeals to you. The fact.8's are a lot more dynamic-sounding and offer a clarity which is almost eerie - in fact after having i-series PMC's here for a while, the fact.8's took some getting used to but now I really think i prefer the way they are voiced vs. my previous speakers and would have a tough time going back. As to imaging, soundstaging etc., PMC's do that really well regardless of series. I would add that the fact.8's were really easy to place in my listening area. There was a review in TONE where there was some mention of them being a little fussy in terms of room placement but that was not my experience. I have not needed to adjust the high or low frequency adjustment switches on them to get results I'm happy with but they're there if you need 'em should you make a change in your room or your system. I listen to a really wide variety of music here and the fact.8's deal with all of it in a really satisfying way. I would think that the PB1i's might offer a little more bottom because of the size/number of drivers and cabinet volume vs. the fact.8's but I don't feel any lack of bass with the fact's.
It would seem to me that you may not get the best out of those PB1i's driving them with a B100, Bob - I think that as you approached the integrated with the speaker cables to hook 'em up for the first time, that B100 would be looking from side to side at those speakers and thinking " Oh man, sh*t's about to get real..."    

D.D.

[bobNL]

Hi Mr Dog,

Still sort of new here (been reading the forum far longer) so will not be calling you Diamond just yet. So far my integrated did not strike me as if it would be afraid of anything, good to know there are limits. I can understand the clarity you are mentioning. Heard the fact.8's at a dealer, next to the IB2i and the sound certainly was different. They had a huge tube amplifier driving them during the demo, and both sounded great - but markedly different, I agree. Both my room size and my budget made the IB's less desirable, so I was wondering what the PB1i's would be like. At low volumes the facts were incredibly good. Moreover, they are kind of pretty to . Guess that settles it!
BTW Have you heard the twenty series?

Many thanks for your helpful reply,
Cheers,
Bob

[Phil]

tie-breaker,

having the same speakers I have been wondering the same thing.  All in all, with excellent components, the 803s sound better than their reputation.  I've found that cleaning the power contributes enormously to the overall sound.

The latest B&W not only have a different tweeter they also have a different crossover and are said to be easier to drive and more natural sounding in the HF.  The 802D is said to be warm and inviting and was always significantly better than the 803.  They should be worth a listen, but $15k new. 

That said, folks with all Bryston gear are pointing you towards a known good match of electronics and speakers.  Or perhaps Bryston's own speakers which are in development?

Phil

[1oldguy]

tie-breaker,

having the same speakers I have been wondering the same thing.  All in all, with excellent components, the 803s sound better than their reputation.  I've found that cleaning the power contributes enormously to the overall sound.

The latest B&W not only have a different tweeter they also have a different crossover and are said to be easier to drive and more natural sounding in the HF.  The 802D is said to be warm and inviting and was always significantly better than the 803.  They should be worth a listen, but $15k new. 

That said, folks with all Bryston gear are pointing you towards a known good match of electronics and speakers.  Or perhaps Bryston's own speakers which are in development?

Phil

Hi Phil /......Could you go into some detail about the new B&W Diamond sound?Thoughts impression would be great.

[Diamond Dog]

Hi Mr Dog,

Still sort of new here (been reading the forum far longer) so will not be calling you Diamond just yet. So far my integrated did not strike me as if it would be afraid of anything, good to know there are limits. I can understand the clarity you are mentioning. Heard the fact.8's at a dealer, next to the IB2i and the sound certainly was different. They had a huge tube amplifier driving them during the demo, and both sounded great - but markedly different, I agree. Both my room size and my budget made the IB's less desirable, so I was wondering what the PB1i's would be like. At low volumes the facts were incredibly good. Moreover, they are kind of pretty to . Guess that settles it!
BTW Have you heard the twenty series?

Many thanks for your helpful reply,
Cheers,
Bob

Happy to help in some small way. I haven't had the opportunity to hear any of the Twenty series as they were released not long after I took delivery of my fact.8's. They look like an interesting proposition and appear to incorporate several design ideas from the fact's along with some new ones as well like the slanted cabs to assist in achieving time alignment. If you decide to follow through with the fact.8's, do you have a finish chosen? I opted for the Tiger Ebony and after having the "i" series around here for a while in the classic PMC cherry finish, it's a big change.

D.D.

[DaveNote]

Happy to help in some small way. I haven't had the opportunity to hear any of the Twenty series as they were released not long after I took delivery of my fact.8's. They look like an interesting proposition and appear to incorporate several design ideas from the fact's along with some new ones as well like the slanted cabs to assist in achieving time alignment. If you decide to follow through with the fact.8's, do you have a finish chosen? I opted for the Tiger Ebony and after having the "i" series around here for a while in the classic PMC cherry finish, it's a big change.

D.D.

D.D. I went from cherry MB2s to Ebony MB2is. Prefer the Ebony as almost all of my gear and stands are black. Are we living parallel lives?

Dave

[Diamond Dog]

D.D. I went from cherry MB2s to Ebony MB2is. Prefer the Ebony as almost all of my gear and stands are black. Are we living parallel lives?

Dave

For your sake, I hope not! 

D.D.

[David C]

I agree with DD on the laid back sound of UK speakers BUT just back from RMAF and I narrowed down my choice to Wilson (they only had the Sasha) but I was after the Sophia3, revel studio 2s and the PMC PB1i. After days of listening I chose the PMC.  I think they have great base for the size and a really good sound. My wife went withme and she at first liked the Wilsons and the revels but we landed on the PMCs. They are a bit not in your face but we loved the sound. The Bryston gear sounded fantastic and I am sure I have a new amp in my future I did listen to the Classic Audio Reproductions T3.4 and they sounded great but too big  for a WAF.

[Diamond Dog]

David C :  Congrats on the new PB1i's - you'll love 'em. Since you were at RMAF and obviously at the PMC / Bryston room, in the name of all that's decent man, you must tell us : How did the Twenty series sound?

D.D.

PS: Not all Brit speakers sound laid-back - ever sit through a Monitor Audio demo? Ay Carumba !

[jimdgoulding]

Hi Bob :  My experience was that the i-series speakers which I've heard ( and owned ) sound terrific and offer really good bottom end even at lower volumes ( which is important to me ) but like a lot of British speakers I've heard ( and owned ), they sound a little "laid-back". That can be a fine attribute if that appeals to you. The fact.8's are a lot more dynamic-sounding and offer a clarity which is almost eerie - in fact after having i-series PMC's here for a while, the fact.8's took some getting used to but now I really think i prefer the way they are voiced vs. my previous speakers and would have a tough time going back. As to imaging, soundstaging etc., PMC's do that really well regardless of series. I would add that the fact.8's were really easy to place in my listening area. There was a review in TONE where there was some mention of them being a little fussy in terms of room placement but that was not my experience. I have not needed to adjust the high or low frequency adjustment switches on them to get results I'm happy with but they're there if you need 'em should you make a change in your room or your system. I listen to a really wide variety of music here and the fact.8's deal with all of it in a really satisfying way. I would think that the PB1i's might offer a little more bottom because of the size/number of drivers and cabinet volume vs. the fact.8's but I don't feel any lack of bass with the fact's.
It would seem to me that you may not get the best out of those PB1i's driving them with a B100, Bob - I think that as you approached the integrated with the speaker cables to hook 'em up for the first time, that B100 would be looking from side to side at those speakers and thinking " Oh man, sh*t's about to get real..."    

D.D.

Dog, your PMC 8's are one of a very few at the top of my fantasy list.  I think it's great to be able to adjust the tweeter's ouput.  I'm a two way person, I think, but want full range, of course.

[bobNL]

Hi Mr Dog,

The dealer where I auditioned the Facts offers to give them a custom piano black lacker finish. Looks fantastic, so I guess that will be my choice now. Black Facts, sounds rather nice does'nt it. Was especially impressed by the dynamic sound of the facts at lower volumes, sort of reminded me of horn speakers I heard some time ago. Unfortunately the proximity of my neighbors limits the volume I can get away with.

Cheers,
Bob 

[jjc1]

Hi Mr Dog,

The dealer where I auditioned the Facts offers to give them a custom piano black lacker finish. Looks fantastic, so I guess that will be my choice now. Black Facts, sounds rather nice does'nt it. Was especially impressed by the dynamic sound of the facts at lower volumes, sort of reminded me of horn speakers I heard some time ago. Unfortunately the proximity of my neighbors limits the volume I can get away with.

Cheers,
Bob 

   Black Facts make a cool Daddy_O, when  you turn em on they're a-rarin to go. Black Facts!

[David C]

DD aka Mr Dog
the twenty (larger one) was playing the first day as the PB1i's were not set up yet and it was that sound that brought me back to the room to listen to the PB1i's on day two. The twentys sound really good. Great base for the size and the clarity and detail was fantastic.

David

[vegasdave]

Go for the 802 Diamonds. Excellent speaker that compares to speakers costing twice as much. Or if you can find them, the older 801Ds. Those are great too, but you need a lot of room for them.