[twitch54]

Everything is new. The record is new. Played it a couple of times on the table.

are we talking about only 'one' record problem here ??

A small confession. Last night, also changed the stylus weight on the record (what is the term used here ?) from 1.9g to 2.3g (as per specific instruction from sound smith). Will this have any profound effect ?

Also tried to fiddle a little with the VTA but not much effect.

I am using the original fluid that came with the RCM as I have no other at the moment. Also no distilled water at the moment. There should be one or two other RCM owners in my city. I will seek them out for further information.

Joe it's pretty obvious you are new to analog as well as the RCM ritual. With that being said never use anything less than distilled water in your solution receipe as well as the rinse cycle. Any clown that tells you tap water is just fine is just that..... a clown, for he has no clue as to what is in 'your' tap water.

[rab1234]

Joe

So I take it that it is the one record only your having trouble with? Like I said I have one I could not get the material off, now granted I haven't tried a brillo pad...yet. And I agree with MinnMark, that system looks like a honey. It just now came to me, you may have, like myself left the vacuum on too long.

[jazdoc]

Couple of observations:

That Shelby Lynne record is a notoriously bad pressing with respect to background noise/pops/ticks.  Might want to see if this can be replicated with other (non-valuable/treasured) LPs.

It's worth investing in high quality record cleaning fluids.  I recommend the Audio Intelligent and know others who use the Walker with excellent results.

On occasion, record cleaning will cause an apparent increase prominence in pops and clicks.  This is permanent damage to the grooves that can become more conspicuous with a quieter background that typically follows a good cleaning.

[Wayner]

So your saying that cleaning a record with an RCM can damage records.....

Huh.

That is exactly why I never use one, nor will I ever buy one. I think they are a waste of time (and money). I've cleaned my records (used) once in the laundry sink with dish-washing detergent and warm water, label and all. I dry them off with an old bath towel. that is the first and last time they ever get washed.

Then with my own solution of 3 parts reverse osmosis water and 1 part 99% isopropyl alcohol in a misting spray bottle, I spray my old Discwasher brush, to get it damp and brush the record while it's spinning on the table, prior to listening. No damage, no noise, just nice shinny, slippery records. Has worked for 45 years so far.....

Wayner 

[madog99]

Very nice system you got going there !!  all I can say is RINSE ! when I started with my DIY RMC I was using the VPI fluid also and had the same problem , added a rinse with drug store water , solved that issue of more noise after cleaning . Also I don't use the Vpi fluid anymore , switched to the Nitty Gritty and it seems to be less soapy and easier to vacum off ? I doubt you are damaging your LP , just cleaning issues . New LP's have a ton of static and I found a soak with the fluid on for 20-30 seconds seems to help let the fluid do it's job of lifting the gunk off the record and seems to kill the static , don't know why but that's just my results with new vinyl and my system .

[jjc1]

   I use an enzyme based cleaner called "record time" distributed by Musical Surroundings in California. Maybe an enzyme based cleaner would help.

[TONEPUB]

So your saying that cleaning a record with an RCM can damage records.....

Huh.

That is exactly why I never use one, nor will I ever buy one. I think they are a waste of time (and money). I've cleaned my records (used) once in the laundry sink with dish-washing detergent and warm water, label and all. I dry them off with an old bath towel. that is the first and last time they ever get washed.

Then with my own solution of 3 parts reverse osmosis water and 1 part 99% isopropyl alcohol in a misting spray bottle, I spray my old Discwasher brush, to get it damp and brush the record while it's spinning on the table, prior to listening. No damage, no noise, just nice shinny, slippery records. Has worked for 45 years so far.....

Wayner 

So if you've never used one and have never owned one, how can you comment on how they work or don't work?

I think the suggestions about an extra water rinse (pure as possible) are excellent.  As well as the stylus cleaning, you may be gunked up and it does creep up at times.

BTW, very nice system.

[pansixt]

I use a VPI cleaner and sparingly and only when necessary.

Any vinyl enthusiast should know or will soon find out when this may be.

I have never over cleaned a record. I have over played them, and over treated them with some junk that was supposed to make them sound better.

I remember in about 1974 I bought a Dustbug. Ill advised and gullible as I was, I used a solution of 50/50 Distilled water and Denatured(?) Alcohol and liberally applied this mixture to the Dustbug everytime I spun my favorite records.

Before long I had some unplayable discs with an insane amount of gunk in the grooves. Sounding like my stylus was tracking sandpaper.

Most I could replace easily and cheaply at that time. But a few I let someone steam clean with a crude method which I can't, or won't recall. These few were salvaged and lived to play another day. This lends some credence to the steam cleaning method.

I will probably refine my cleaning method with some of the above mentioned techniques. Particularly an additional rinse.

Great stuff here. And I hope the original problem is resolved without great expense.

James

Edit: Damn, I hope some of our friends from the Discless Circle don't notice this topic.
Or we may never hear the end of it!!

[Wayner]

So if you've never used one and have never owned one, how can you comment on how they work or don't work?

I think the suggestions about an extra water rinse (pure as possible) are excellent.  As well as the stylus cleaning, you may be gunked up and it does creep up at times.

BTW, very nice system.

Because my records are clean and noise free. Is the RCM going to get it even cleaner? I don't see how.

Here is another thought for you, Jeff: The record grooves are a continuous "screw thread", spiraling in towards the center. If we have a fixed brush then the brush can't follow the spiral and will ride over the peak of the grooves continuously, this, to me, can result in damage to the peaks and the grooves them selves.

Wayner

[woodsyi]

Wayner,

Your method may or may not clean just as well or better than RCMs but I know for sure it's a lot more cumbersome to take my LP two floors up to my bathtub to clean.  I am happy to have the RCM in the room where I keep most of my LPs.  I can clean any record within a minute without much effort.  The convenience is why I got an RCM and I now know that it does a damned good job of cleaning records.  More power to you if you can do without one, but don't knock on people who use RCM. 

[JohnR]

I think Wayner has convinced me not to get a machine.

How about that 

[rab1234]

Now I clean the record with a machine when it calls for it or making a recording and a for every day use just a light clean (with solution) by hand and always give the stylis a wet wipe and a quick static zap.

[Wayner]

I'm not knocking anyone that has an RCM. More power to them. I, for myself, do not feel the need. There is more then one way to skin a cat, tho I do not eat them (yet).

My record cleaning technique started when I was a kid. The only table I could afford was the lowly AR-XA, and I'm pretty sure RCMs where probably not invented then. However, I did realize that contamination of the grooves did seem to pose a problem, not only on playback, but on record wear.

If we disagree on the methods, so be it, but at least we do agree that records need to be cleaned.

My sink is in the next room. So when I buy a batch of used records, I fill the sink up with dishwashing detergent and get some old fuzzy bath towels, one on the table next to the sink and another to dry the record off. I submerge the record, then use a 2" horse hair paint brush to swirl gently around in a circle, hopefully getting into the grooves. I do not use hardly any pressure.

I assume in my own mind that this perhaps gets the "big" chuncks off, but wiping them clean with the towel seems to help too.

The total cleaning happens at the turntable, as I always damp clean before each play. The damp clean does 2 things. First, it neutralizes any static that may be on the surface, and then the damp brush picks up any dust on the surface. Again, I don't use lots of pressure, just let the weight of the brush do the work for a revolution or 2.

After a couple of cleanings, the records turn out nice and shiny, free of pops and clicks and it's good forever, never cleaning the record again in the sink.

Again, it's good that most if not all agree that clean records make happy listening.

Wayner 

[joeling39]

Hmmm, a lot of info to pick through. I added the distilled water routine & it seemed to help a little. Biggest revelation came when I played another brand new copy of the same record & it was just as noisy. Funny I did not noticed that when I got the table working a few days ago prior to cleaning. So far, I have only cleaned 1 record. In the meantime, I think I won't clean the rest of the records until I get someone local to teach me. All my records are new anyway. So I'm just gonna settle in to spin them & trying to get used to having to leave the listening seat everything 5 to 6 tracks & no jumping tracks with remote etc. 

Regards,
Joe Ling

[jazdoc]

So your saying that cleaning a record with an RCM can damage records.....

Huh

No.  Probably wan't completely clear from my prior post.  IME, sometimes permanent damage to the grooves (usually manifests as ticks/pops) becomes more evident after record cleaning because the background noise recedes.

[pansixt]

In the meantime, I think I won't clean the rest of the records until I get someone local to teach me.

Joe- Where are you located?

James

[joeling39]

I'm in Malaysia on the island of Borneo.

Regards,
Joe Ling