[Marius]

Hi,

Suddenly I discover that on the Cd's I'm ripping there are all Aiff files. In the Finder on my Mac, there's nothing but the listed files in Aiff format.
Previously I didn't use the Finder, but immediately used XLD or MAX to Rip the cd's to Flac, and write the ripped files to the HDD attached to the BDP1

SInce the BDP1 plays Aiff files, why bother with the tedious process of ripping the files? Nothing will sound better than the original?
What am I missing here?

Thanks,
Marius

[James Tanner]

Hi Marius

I find FLAC is better with metadata

James

[skunark]

Aiff and flac has the same metadata.   WAV is the one with no standard meta data support.   Perhaps elaborate a bit more James if you can. 

On a Mac OSX the tracks on a music cd are listed as AIFF and on MS Windows it's listed as WAV. Both are wrappers of the actual PCM data on the disc.   

Disk space is so cheap these so why alter it even more? 

[James Tanner]

Aiff and flac has the same metadata.   WAV is the one with no standard meta data support.   Perhaps elaborate a bit more James if you can. 

On a Mac OSX the tracks on a music cd are listed as AIFF and on MS Windows it's listed as WAV. Both are wrappers of the actual PCM data on the disc.   

Disk space is so cheap these so why alter it even more?

Hi

I find when I copy itune aiff files I have a difficult time transferring the album art 

[srb]

On a Mac OSX the tracks on a music cd are listed as AIFF and on MS Windows it's listed as WAV. Both are wrappers of the actual PCM data on the disc.   

On a Windows PC, CD tracks are listed as .CDA files.  If you try to copy or drag the .CDA files to your hard drive, you will only get a shortcut.
 
If you download FLAC or AIFF files from a music vendor, they will generally be tagged files with all the metadata.  Although AIFF allows for complete metadata tags, if you drag the AIFF files from a CD to the hard drive on your MAC, they won't contain all the tags.  If you don't "rip" them, you will still need some kind of tagging program with online database lookup to get and embed the tags.
 
I too, am not sure what is better about FLAC tags than AIFF tags.  I have an AIFF library and all the tags, including the album art, show in various software music players.
 
However, if you use iTunes to rip to AIFF, by default the album art that is automatically downloaded from the online database is stored in the iTunes database file and not in the song files themselves, and the artwork will be missing in other player applications.  When I use iTunes to rip to AIFF, as a second step after ripping, I select all of the songs for that album, then copy and paste the album art in the artwork window.  That will then embed the album art within the AIFF files.
 
Steve

[Marius]

please let me try to explain what I was doing and why:

Im on a Mac now, and don't use the Itunes because of the native limitation of resolution. I had the same copying experience as Steve with the windows software, ie copying gives a shortcut, so was surprised to see a Aiff file on the cd that was actually copied to the HDD.

Since that took only a couple of seconds, and ripping takes a really long time I started to wonder, why rip, and bare the tedious sequence and time consuming operations, if one could just simply copy and play the aiff's natively.

James remarks on tagging are spot on maybe, but in this search,I was mainly focussed on sound quality and ease of operation.

First impression on copied Aiff files: they certainly do Not sound the same through the BDPBDA combo compared to the BCD1. The latter sounding better to be honest...

Will have to try the WAV conversion? What setting do I use for that? Please see the attached pic for options.




Greetings!
Marius

On a Windows PC, CD tracks are listed as .CDA files.  If you try to copy or drag the .CDA files to your hard drive, you will only get a shortcut.
 
If you download FLAC or AIFF files from a music vendor, they will generally be tagged files with all the metadata.  Although AIFF allows for complete metadata tags, if you drag the AIFF files from a CD to the hard drive on your MAC, they won't contain all the tags.  If you don't "rip" them, you will still need some kind of tagging program with online database lookup to get and embed the tags.
 
I too, am not sure what is better about FLAC tags than AIFF tags.  I have an AIFF library and all the tags, including the album art, show in various software music players.
 
However, if you use iTunes to rip to AIFF, by default the album art that is automatically downloaded from the online database is stored in the iTunes database file and not in the song files themselves, and the artwork will be missing in other player applications.  When I use iTunes to rip to AIFF, as a second step after ripping, I select all of the songs for that album, then copy and paste the album art in the artwork window.  That will then embed the album art within the AIFF files.
 
Steve

[skunark]

With any CD, focus on 16 bits and 44.1Khz when ripping to AIFF, WAV, FLAC or ALAC.

Also, make sure the program you are using can provide a checksum like XLD or Max.

[Marius]

Ok thanks. So 16 bit is is. This was a screendump of Max.

I have errorcorrection selected, but see no option for checksum. I suppose this is what you mean?:



Marius

With any CD, focus on 16 bits and 44.1Khz when ripping to AIFF, WAV, FLAC or ALAC.

Also, make sure the program you are using can provide a checksum like XLD or Max.

[skunark]

Cdparanoia is the best option for MAX, but I was thinking of "RIP" with AccurateRip selected.  This generates a checksum that is compared against an online database of other rips.  XLD might be the more updated choice.

Sadly rippers for Mac seem to be aging, but might not be a bad thing.  RubyRipper for Linux is probably the best choice today and EAC for Windows seems to be a popular candidate.  I just never can trust anything that bleeds for seven days and just won't die...err wait, that's a Southpark quote, not a Microsoft one.

[Marius]

I was just about to start importing my rather extensive Itunes lossless ALAC library. Figuring out how to go about that.
How do you do that James? Is there an import tool to copy those Itunes files and albumart into a BDP1 readable set of files to transfer to the HDD?
on the Mac that is..

Marius

Hi

I find when I copy itune aiff files I have a difficult time transferring the album art 

[skunark]

I was just about to start importing my rather extensive Itunes lossless ALAC library. Figuring out how to go about that.
How do you do that James? Is there an import tool to copy those Itunes files and albumart into a BDP1 readable set of files to transfer to the HDD?
on the Mac that is..

Marius

I wouldn't even bother with ALAC.  For what I had ripped, the BDP is clearly not ready for it.  Probably better to say Linux is clearly not ready for ALAC.  I know the BDP is probably 6 months to a year behind on the bug fixes for the ALAC codec and MPD, but none of the bug reports indicated they (mpd, ALAC codec packages) fixed the issue I had with ALAC files as they transition between songs. 

For the Mac i use the command line program called "rsync" but it's probably daunting to most and a simple misuse could be costly if you don't have a reasonable backup.  You might check out "drop-sync" from the app store, it seems to fit the bill for an "rsync" gui.   You can configure it to sync between your iTunes folders and the mounted BDP network drive.

[Marius]

XLD working fine here, its just that I find the userinterface on the file and directory/map naming a bit quirky. Max feels a lot more userfriendly. Although when  selecting the 'coding'-tab in options, it 7 out of 10 quits suddenly...

just to be certain: the should not be any audible difference in using the two programs? Flac is Flac, Wav is Wav, Aiff is Aiff?
just as there shouldn't be any difference in using a (high end )USb cable between HDD and BDP1?

Marius

Cdparanoia is the best option for MAX, but I was thinking of "RIP" with AccurateRip selected.  This generates a checksum that is compared against an online database of other rips.  XLD might be the more updated choice.

Sadly rippers for Mac seem to be aging, but might not be a bad thing.  RubyRipper for Linux is probably the best choice today and EAC for Windows seems to be a popular candidate.  I just never can trust anything that bleeds for seven days and just won't die...err wait, that's a Southpark quote, not a Microsoft one.

[Marius]

Right.
have to study this one. Thanks!
Thought I just convert it all with one push on a button....
like this: I have all ALAC lossless files in my Itunes library, select all, select advanced, select: make version aiff, then add those files to HDD. that wouldn't work? Or is all the tagging lost this way?

Marius

I wouldn't even bother with ALAC.  For what I had ripped, the BDP is clearly not ready for it.  Probably better to say Linux is clearly not ready for ALAC.  I know the BDP is probably 6 months to a year behind on the bug fixes for the ALAC codec and MPD, but none of the bug reports indicated they (mpd, ALAC codec packages) fixed the issue I had with ALAC files as they transition between songs. 

For the Mac i use the command line program called "rsync" but it's probably daunting to most and a simple misuse could be costly if you don't have a reasonable backup.  You might check out "drop-sync" from the app store, it seems to fit the bill for an "rsync" gui.   You can configure it to sync between your iTunes folders and the mounted BDP network drive.

[skunark]

XLD, MAX, RIP and iTunes use the same library to encode the file.  XLD and RIP provides a checksum of the audio portion and compares it to an online database.   It only provides the additional insurance of a good copy.   I'm sure within a few years, there will be programs to check already ripped files against a database to ensure you still have a valid copy.    In the last two months i've had two files on my HDD corrupt so i'm more than eager for someone to provide this check.   The only leg up I can give to FLAC is that his is built into the SW library, but sadly not may folks take advantage of it.

Your question about Flav Vs Flac, Wav vs Wav and Aiff vs Aiff is almost a trick question.  It's only as good as the program ripping, but as stated, all use the core audio to convert to AIFF, WAV or ALAC and all use a version of cdparanioa to rip.  Even the good Microsoft rippers will use cdparanioa to rip.    And as for the USB cable on a HDD serving up data, it's the cable failed, your computer would be crashing right now ...

[skunark]

Right.
have to study this one. Thanks!
Thought I just convert it all with one push on a button....
like this: I have all ALAC lossless files in my Itunes library, select all, select advanced, select: make version aiff, then add those files to HDD. that wouldn't work? Or is all the tagging lost this way?

Marius

Tagging will be maintained.  Only gotcha is if you used iTunes to rip and download the album art.  iTunes will actually store the album art in a separate database, which is different than most rippers, and most likely will be lost.  All other tagging will be properly converted.     You can easily have iTunes convert the files as well and after completed remove the ALAC version from the library.  It is a long process though, but fully necessary if you own the BDP.

[Marius]

well thank you, thats all quite reassuring, and lets me focus on getting things done rather then comparing programs.

XLD, MAX, RIP and iTunes use the same library to encode the file.  XLD and RIP provides a checksum of the audio portion and compares it to an online database.   It only provides the additional insurance of a good copy.   I'm sure within a few years, there will be programs to check already ripped files against a database to ensure you still have a valid copy.    In the last two months i've had two files on my HDD corrupt so i'm more than eager for someone to provide this check.   The only leg up I can give to FLAC is that his is built into the SW library, but sadly not may folks take advantage of it.

Your question about Flav Vs Flac, Wav vs Wav and Aiff vs Aiff is almost a trick question.  It's only as good as the program ripping, but as stated, all use the core audio to convert to AIFF, WAV or ALAC and all use a version of cdparanioa to rip.  Even the good Microsoft rippers will use cdparanioa to rip.    And as for the USB cable on a HDD serving up data, it's the cable failed, your computer would be crashing right now ...

[Marius]

Hmm, I thought I'd walk the itunes way, to be have an advantage in time and convenience. Since I would have to manually find a way for the album art, that might not be the case afterall...

have to rethink that one again then. Or find a converter that does it all...Too bad Im not an Apple developer...Where to pose this question? Ill try the Apple circle..

Thanks again, Marius

Tagging will be maintained.  Only gotcha is if you used iTunes to rip and download the album art.  iTunes will actually store the album art in a separate database, which is different than most rippers, and most likely will be lost.  All other tagging will be properly converted.     You can easily have iTunes convert the files as well and after completed remove the ALAC version from the library.  It is a long process though, but fully necessary if you own the BDP.

[skunark]

For iTunes adjust your import settings to use AIFF the you can create a playlist for ALAC file types (or non-AIFF).  Convert the playlist and then slowly remove the ALAC duplicates.  I saved the file but removed from iTunes, then only synced "aif" files. 

[srb]

Hmm, I thought I'd walk the itunes way, to be have an advantage in time and convenience. Since I would have to manually find a way for the album art, that might not be the case afterall...

If you want to use iTunes to rip files, it only takes a few seconds to embed the album artwork into the files (AIFF, ALAC, AAC or MP3 files - WAV files cannot save artwork or metadata within the file).
 
After ripping an album, simply select that album's files:
 

 
Then in the artwork window, Copy and Paste the image:
 

 
The artwork will now be saved in the song files instead of the iTunes database.  Pretty quick and simple.
 
Steve
 
 

[James Tanner]

Hi Steve,

Thanks for all your help on this - much appreciated.  I have a MAC Pro Laptop but not a MAC guy so generally use dbpoweramp as my ripper to Flac on my PC setup and all is well so far.

james