SAE 1000E MC cartridge

James Romeyn · « **Reply #20 on:** 16 Sep 2011, 01:37 am »

Quote from: madog99 on 16 Sep 2011, 12:53 am

After doing some recording with the different carts and being able to switch from one to the other instantly in audacity , I ordered another SAE. My MM's aren't doing it for me anymore

There is nothing wrong with a good number of the better MMs. It's just that compared to a better MC, the MM is dryer and has what I describe as a "Here, take this or leave it, this is what I sound like" presentation, while the MC draws you in more to the performance. The MM may have good dynamic range (maybe better than some MC) but strangely, and counter to one's intuition, the MM may make more mechanical and/or background noise, maybe a function of the stylus shape.

This thread subject got my attention because it reminded me of the Supex SD1000E MC cartridges from the same era, still among the best I've ever heard and highly regarded back in the day...like a better Dynavector but with more musical enjoyment, less analytical...

Sounds like you guys found a steal! IIRC I never heard the Adcom cartridges mentioned above, but there was plenty written about them and all good, no glaring faults whatsoever. Not state of the art, but extremely good value and great overall presentation.

madog99 · « **Reply #21 on:** 19 Sep 2011, 12:40 am »

James , I agree about some MM's . My first MC was the Denon DL-110 and I was really liking it , but after a month or so went back to the Grado 8MZ on that table(Thorens 160) , just a nicer sound to my ears . Only have 2 MC's so not an expert by any means.

neobop · « **Reply #22 on:** 19 Sep 2011, 01:44 am »

I wouldn't necessarily agree with the MM characterization. I guess we all have different and limited experience over the years with the myriad carts out there.

I had an Adcom HOMC back in the mid '80s. The one I had was the first one to come out with a micro ridge tip, I think. It was an XC-MR or MR II. It was reasonably fast and detailed and had a rising high end which I found annoying. If I had known about loading back then, maybe I would have liked it more. For me, it had a somewhat relentless quality, but I go for detail and it wasn't bad. Some HOMCs have too much tip mass and can be ponderous. This Adcom seemed to avoid that pitfall. This SAE seems like a really good buy. I'm glad you guys are enjoying it.
neo

neobop · « **Reply #23 on:** 12 Oct 2011, 09:30 pm »

They must have a load of these carts. Now they're on Audiogon:
http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?anlgcart&1323420514&/Sae-1000lt---1000e-Moving-Coil

Funny I mentioned tip mass, .3mg is remarkably low for a HOMC. What's that cantilever made of? It looks like boron. Judging by your reactions, this seems like a great buy. Any guess at compliance? Which one did you get?
neo

simoon · « **Reply #24 on:** 13 Oct 2011, 12:33 am »

Quote from: neobop on 12 Oct 2011, 09:30 pm

They must have a load of these carts. Now they're on Audiogon:
http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?anlgcart&1323420514&/Sae-1000lt---1000e-Moving-Coil

Funny I mentioned tip mass, .3mg is remarkably low for a HOMC. What's that cantilever made of? It looks like boron. Judging by your reactions, this seems like a great buy. Any guess at compliance? Which one did you get?
neo

I believe the Audiogon add has been there as long as the ebay add has.

I emailed the seller to see if he can answer your questions.

And by the way, there's an ebay seller in Germany selling these for $265 usd .

simoon · « **Reply #25 on:** 13 Oct 2011, 05:17 pm »

So, it seems the catilever is made out of boron.

The seller does not know the compliance, as those specs are not published. But he says the cartridge works in arms where the effective mass is between 6 to 11 grams

Gopher · « **Reply #26 on:** 13 Oct 2011, 10:56 pm »

Can any gurus tell me if this would be a good match to a kuzma stogi s? Its a unipivot with 11g effective mass. I don't have actual compliance of the cartridge and 11g is top of recomended range, but that effective mass will increase with mounting hardware by...

madog99 · « **Reply #27 on:** 13 Oct 2011, 11:13 pm »

Quote from: simoon on 13 Oct 2011, 12:33 am

And by the way, there's an ebay seller in Germany selling these for $265 usd .

He was at $199 also at the start but then jacked up his price after awhile for some reason ?

neobop · « **Reply #28 on:** 14 Oct 2011, 01:27 am »

Quote from: Gopher on 13 Oct 2011, 10:56 pm

Can any gurus tell me if this would be a good match to a kuzma stogi s? Its a unipivot with 11g effective mass. I don't have actual compliance of the cartridge and 11g is top of recomended range, but that effective mass will increase with mounting hardware by...

I have no experience with your arm but I doubt if compliance would be an issue. The Adcom HOMCs had about the same recommended VTF and their cu was between 17 and 19. Those calculators only ballpark anyway. I've seen calculations come out to 7.5Hz resonance, when test record results were 10Hz. Synergy might be of concern with some arms, but going by reputation...

Nobody mentioned loading, at least not that I remember. Some HOMCs seem to sound better with a load somewhere between 1K and 47K.

It's a little strange that the seller didn't mention the boron cantilever. The least expensive new cart with a boron cantilever is an AT-150MLX. $200 won't even buy you a replacement stylus. With results reported here I'd jump on it if I needed a cart.
neo

Gopher · « **Reply #29 on:** 14 Oct 2011, 01:46 am »

thanks, neo. I emailed the seller through audiogon and will place an order tomorrow. My gut is telling me to go for this one as I'm switching to a mm phono pre and need the high output.

very interested to get this thing mounted and dialed/ fozgometered in.

madog99 · « **Reply #30 on:** 14 Oct 2011, 01:53 am »

Quote from: Gopher on 14 Oct 2011, 01:46 am

thanks, neo. I emailed the seller through audiogon and will place an order tomorrow. My gut is telling me to go for this one as I'm switching to a mm phono pre and need the high output.

very interested to get this thing mounted and dialed/ fozgometered in.

Be sure to let us know what ya think ! Break in time is at least 15 hr's , mine was anyway . Still working on the 2nd one on a different table .

Gopher · « **Reply #31 on:** 14 Oct 2011, 02:20 am »

I heard back from the seller as well and he thinks it will be a wonderful match to my kuzma arm... Hopefully it synergizes well with the Audion phono section im taking delivery of tomorrow. I'm actually cartridge-less at the moment borrowing a buddies well worn dynavector 20xH.

what kind of signature would you say this has, maddog?

roscoeiii · « **Reply #32 on:** 14 Oct 2011, 03:05 am »

Hope you hold onto the Dyna long enough to compare the 2 carts. Nice to have a HOMC Dyna as a reference point...

Gopher · « **Reply #33 on:** 14 Oct 2011, 02:21 pm »

I plan to, Roscoe. The buddy I'm borrowing it from is a fellow ACer and will be interested in the comparison. We'll probably listen to both with the Audion I'm getting and his Vista (ACLE) phono pre as its optimized for a cartridge with very similar specs.

I'm going to buy one of these cartridges this morning, but I'm stuck on the decision of LT or E. The longer life and higher desirability of the LT makes it a safer choice if it doesn't work out...

Gopher · « **Reply #34 on:** 14 Oct 2011, 03:45 pm »

I just got off the phone with the seller, Alfred. Super nice guy who spoke frankly about his opinions and how they came into the cartridges. I'm going to be going with a 1000E after all and if I love it, I'll probably come back for an LT.

From what he told me the LTs are the rage with his Japanese and Euro clients which love the tingly treble that extends forever, but that the E is better balanced, a little more engaging and probably a better match to my system.

I have a feeling I'll be going for a backup LT.

neobop · « **Reply #35 on:** 14 Oct 2011, 09:39 pm »

No doubt the LT has a slight rise to the response, but it will be more detailed than a .4 x .7 elliptical. I'm not quibbling with the seller, but most people just plug a HOMC into a standard 47K MM input and report the results. Loading might offer the best of both worlds, detail/extension and balance. This isn't always convenient though, or predictable.

The spec for both is 20Hz to 40KHz + 1dB, so it doesn't rise much. Probably less HF information makes the elliptical more bass oriented and "musical" as opposed to analytical. Just some thoughts on this option. In Europe the LT goes for more money. I don't think you'll go wrong either way.
neo

simoon · « **Reply #36 on:** 14 Oct 2011, 11:27 pm »

Quote from: Gopher on 14 Oct 2011, 03:45 pm

I just got off the phone with the seller, Alfred. Super nice guy who spoke frankly about his opinions and how they came into the cartridges. I'm going to be going with a 1000E after all and if I love it, I'll probably come back for an LT.

From what he told me the LTs are the rage with his Japanese and Euro clients which love the tingly treble that extends forever, but that the E is better balanced, a little more engaging and probably a better match to my system.

I have a feeling I'll be going for a backup LT.

That's exactly what I did.

Bought an E then went back for a LT.

I believe I like the detail of the LT better.

I will be very interested with your findings.

When I originally bought one of these it was to be a standby cartridge until I got something better (check out my OP). I think I like this well enough to not have to worry about getting something better for quite a while.

madog99 · « **Reply #37 on:** 16 Oct 2011, 05:26 pm »

I picked up the ART DJpre to see if it would better my on board phono , because of this cart .It did improve things so fell onto a used Clearaudio Nano and hooked it up today .
for anyone that wants to hear the LT version these are wav files so big .

SAE ART is of course the DJpro
SAE CA is the clearaudio .
they are the last 2 files in the list .

https://skydrive.live.com/?cid=43944d23f1c630cc&sc=documents&uc=2&id=43944D23F1C630CC%21767

simoon · « **Reply #38 on:** 21 Oct 2011, 07:26 pm »

My LT is fully broken in and sounds great.

This thing tracks so good.

Again, hard to believe the performance for $200.

madog99 · « **Reply #39 on:** 21 Oct 2011, 11:52 pm »

Quote from: simoon on 21 Oct 2011, 07:26 pm

My LT is fully broken in and sounds great.

This thing tracks so good.

Again, hard to believe the performance for $200.

Ditto on that