VMPS FF-1 pair

clarkjohnsen · « **on:** 16 Jun 2011, 04:25 pm »

What?! Never heard of them? These VFR (Very Full Range) loudspeakers include the usual VMPS bass design with outboard full-height ribbon drivers and two electronics boxes. Cabinets in rosewood (I think). Two amps required, or even three. (I may have one extra one, a Plinius.) Great, powerful sound but a bear to set up... but then... well...

Make an offer, BUT they need to be picked up in Boston. Encouragement: They are on street level.

617-901-3723

sts9fan · « **Reply #1 on:** 16 Jun 2011, 04:39 pm »

I'll give you $200 and pick them up tonight. Deal?

clarkjohnsen · « **Reply #2 on:** 16 Jun 2011, 04:42 pm »

Very funny. But I have a date tonight...

Uh, do I know you?

cj

sts9fan · « **Reply #3 on:** 16 Jun 2011, 04:45 pm »

A) Not joking
B) Don't know, do you?
C) You should set a price

clarkjohnsen · « **Reply #4 on:** 16 Jun 2011, 04:52 pm »

1) Sorry, I thought it was some bud'o'mine teasing me.

2) Still could be!

3) Agreed. My bad. I had been thinking $500... a steal!

Why don't you call me this afternoon, say after 1:20?

cj

PS I don't have a date tonight. Only, I'm not sure where all the pieces are, so I need a little time.

sts9fan · « **Reply #5 on:** 16 Jun 2011, 04:58 pm »

How much juice do they need?

clarkjohnsen · « **Reply #6 on:** 16 Jun 2011, 05:06 pm »

Reasonably efficient... like most VMPSs... low 90s, best I can recall. I used three Pliniuses -- 50/50, 100/100, 250/250... the last was overkill. You might call Brian.

c, now signing off line

clarkjohnsen · « **Reply #7 on:** 16 Jun 2011, 09:13 pm »

Does, rather. But, no. More complicated, and heavier. Here ya go:

http://www.audioasylum.com/reviews/Speakers/VMPS/SRE-FF1/speakers/54227.html

The version I have? Guess I gotta ask Brian.

cj

JP78 · « **Reply #8 on:** 17 Jun 2011, 04:21 pm »

Exceptional value-for-dollar if you have the amps and don't mind the mediocre WAF. I can't think of any sound quality coming near this price.

clarkjohnsen · « **Reply #9 on:** 17 Jun 2011, 04:52 pm »

It's the FF1 SRE with the long BG panel replacing the square mids. Says Brian. It was $9500 retail. [SIGH] I take a dive.

DFaulds · « **Reply #10 on:** 23 Jun 2011, 02:42 pm »

Damn, wish I lived a little closer to Boston. $500 is a steal for these.

John Casler · « **Reply #11 on:** 23 Jun 2011, 04:36 pm »

Do they look like this Clark?

clarkjohnsen · « **Reply #12 on:** 23 Jun 2011, 06:43 pm »

Kinda... but there are 5" drivers where the black rectangles are. And I'm in rosewood.

cactusjack · « **Reply #13 on:** 23 Jun 2011, 06:56 pm »

Although not Brian's latest designs and drivers, they are amazingly good speakers. I have the plain FF-1's and would not give them up until I can afford Brians latest design. You never see them come up for sale. Folks that have them seem to hang on to them.
Be aware they are very heavy! 350 lbs/Speaker. They will fill a large van or pickup bed. It will take 2-3 folks just to load them.
If the ribbons are in good shape they are worth more that the price he is asking by themselves.
Neat thing is that these are not in California where about 98% of all the used VMPS speakers for sale seem to be. So, if you are close and can transport them, these are an absolute steal. I believe Brian can provide replacement drivers for these. But that would be a question just for him. If I was closer I would be knockin on Clarks door.
Happy listening.

James Romeyn · « **Reply #14 on:** 24 Jun 2011, 02:48 am »

Quote from: clarkjohnsen on 16 Jun 2011, 04:25 pm

...outboard full-height ribbon drivers...

How many "ribbon drivers" per speaker? Multiples are the current 8" planar magnetic, single is the older BG true ribbon.

Driver(s) attached to the side of a VMPS enclosure are for midrange output.

Then you wrote:

Quote

...5" drivers where the black rectangles are...

referring to the image below.

All 5" VMPS drivers are midranges. You can see where this is going. It can't have mids inside the enclosure and attached to the side of the enclosure.

I assembled speakers for Brian in that era, just a while after we closed the earlier "2 guys in a garage" business.

The price and apparent description contradiction would seem to justify a request for an image.

I'm more than curious. I notified an acquaintance in NJ about them.

James Romeyn · « **Reply #15 on:** 24 Jun 2011, 02:53 am »

Quote from: cactusjack on 23 Jun 2011, 06:56 pm

...Be aware they are very heavy! 350 lbs/Speaker. They will fill a large van or pickup bed. It will take 2-3 folks just to load them....

Marine Aviator/Firefighter George K. drives Brian's van to CES and does the heavy setup moving/lifting. You may have enjoyed seeing George schlepp the RM50...alone. IIRC it's over 400 lbs.

doug s. · « **Reply #16 on:** 24 Jun 2011, 02:09 pm »

perhaps the 5" drivers are ribbons?

it looks like there's something about 5" behind the grillecloth of the second speaker... if i had room, i'd drive up to beantown to pick them up for $500.

doug s.

James Romeyn · « **Reply #17 on:** 24 Jun 2011, 04:36 pm »

perhaps, perhaps....

Those square gizmos are Dyna______ (forgot the last part of this word).

The Dynapanels, same as anything in the vicinity of "5 inch" in any VMPS speaker is and was M-I-D-R-A-N-G-E driver, and such midrange is mutually exclusive of anything with a side-attached full height panel of mids.

Do you guys get this YET?

Brian never made, and no designer with a grain of smart would design something with mids of different design separated by several LATERAL inches in the SAME SPEAKER! HELLO! EARTH TO AUDIOPHILES, YOU ARE EXITING EARTH'S GRAVITATIONAL PULL!

Doesn't mean, whatever it is, ain't worth $500/pr. But c'mon, Clark the seller already stated he has to find all the parts. It just looks increasingly more like another $500 garage sale deal, and less like a pair of actual FF1 SRE's............which BTW, IIRC, every FF1 SRE that left the shop was full mandatory active LPXo with active John Curl designed XO, yet Clark never mentioned this. (Brian offered passive as a theoretical only, because no one with 2c of brains spent this much on passive LP for those woofers.)

I'll accept a free lunch at the next audio show from the buyer for this consultation

The two speakers pictured are just radically different. One has a BG true ribbon, OEM cost several hundred each, the Dyna panels I'll disclose OEM cost but not publicly here...take my word, the BG true ribbon cost many multiples more than the Dynapanels. We just have a bunch of non-sensical words on a screen till we see an image.

I could definitely be wrong, but I'd be (happily) shocked if Brian has ANY replacement drivers for any of the speakers pictured.

In ascending time sequence, all midranges, all offered w/ "FF1" designation, we built:

In the enclosure, center mounted: Brian's design, absolutely superb OEM 5" midrange cone (handily beat all earlier USA, Japanese, and European cones by a huge margin...wish I kept several)
In the enclosure, center mounted same location as cones: Dynapanels (bought out all stock from SF supplier after principal died)...
Side-mounted separate frame: BG 5' panel side-mounted (in this case a small grill covered the area where previously the cones/Dynapanels existed)

Finally, Brian offered and "upgraded" in the field (at least one pair I know of, my customer): replaced the single tall BG ribbon with multiples of the current 8" planar magnetic (not a true ribbon). IMO none left the factory this way as an original model, but possibly only a few.

I used to prefer the 8" panels over the BG true ribbon. Now re-thinking that the BG was likely the best of the breed. Yes, the 8" far higher sensitivity and hence cheaper/easier to drive (less amp cost). But now, I might prefer the BG true ribbon unless the 8" is digitally EQ'd as Brian now offers (in that case it's a clear winner). For sure, if running the 8" without digital EQ, the only way to go is tubes or an extremely soft sounding SS. Another point, all the 8" are monopoles till the RM50 arrived last year, and I don't believe in monopoles under any circumstance. All the BG are dipole (I prefer bipole or my current favorite recipe from Floyd Toole over dipole...RM50 is quasi-bipole). As Brian and other believe, no natural sound has a monopole radiation pattern. We need to use the room for ambiance cues....but I digress.

Also, certainly IMO, the 8" sans digital EQ, lack the body, depth, and thick creaminess I prefer in the midbass (at least when x'd with the 12s...this is likely one reason the RM30 is so successful, because its smaller 6.5s have thicker midbass). My wife Debra heard that 1k peak in the 8" panels and from day one (I continually prodded her to change her mind, believe me) she always displayed a, um, strong hankering to return to cones...) OTOH she always liked the tall BG true ribbon.

Just my random thoughts about this "deal of the C". I don't know what BG offers now, but those tall panels were pretty darn killer. I owned FF3 SRE active w/ full 5' BG side-mount panels. FF3 were dual 10s.

clarkjohnsen · « **Reply #18 on:** 24 Jun 2011, 05:44 pm »

Evidently Mr. Romeyn is of the view that I can't rightly see what is so plainly in front of my eyes. And for evidence he asserts that the FF-1s were never made the way mine clearly were. Very well, be that way. "But c'mon, Clark the seller already stated he has to find all the parts. It just looks increasingly more like another $500 garage sale deal." The implication here (okay, the accusation) is that I'm selling inferior of imitation goods. Whatever.

The onslaught continues: "BTW, IIRC, every FF1 SRE that left the shop was full mandatory active LPXo with active John Curl designed XO, yet Clark never mentioned this." So Clark must be hiding something, or selling an incomplete system. I can't think where Mr. Romeyn is getting his, ah, information. I did mention in the ad the presence of two electronic boxes, did I not? Granted I forgot about the two external crossover boxes, but they were not Curl-designed... and they *are* included. The system is intact and is the very same thing that Brian shipped to me.

With one since-discovered exception: The grilles are missing. But the speakers look handsome enough that I never cared to cover them.

James Romeyn · « **Reply #19 on:** 24 Jun 2011, 06:05 pm »

I think I have an explanation. Some or all SRE w/ side-mounted BG true ribbon had the aforementioned small grills covering holes where previously cones were installed. So maybe Clark could remove the small grills if they exist and can be removed and see if there is an empty hole. This will solve that mystery.

Clark, get a camera. You may have missed the part that I'm trying to locate a buyer.