[bubba966]

So I'll start things off with this.

I'd read a good deal about how "the room is the most important component in your setup" for quite some time.

Always thought that it can't really make such a big difference in how things sound.

Did eventually get a small clue that room treatments made a big difference a VSAC last October as the only two rooms at the show I thought sounded any good at all were about the only two rooms that used any real room treatments at all.

A few months later, I got a deal I couldn't pass up on some Eighth Nerve room treatments.

 

I certainly wished I'd done something about my room much earlier. Man, did that make a huge positive difference (even when I didn't think I had much of a "problem room").

So while I can't say much on what to use for whatever your situation is, I can say that no matter what your setup entails, do use some sort of room treatments. Find something that ifts your room, budget, etc. and do it. Don't put it off thinking it's "the finishing touch". Hell, it should be the very first thing you do...

[ohenry]

I noticed that Steve Deckert has some interesting info regarding room geometry on the Decware site if anyone is curious.  I'll be the first to admit, I'll not be fiddling around with false walls, but if I were building a house then maybe some forethought alone those lines would be good. . .

[Ethan Winer]

Bubba,

> Don't put it off thinking it's "the finishing touch". Hell, it should be the very first thing you do <

Yeah, no kidding. It amazes me that folks will spend thousands of dollars on electronic gear and loudspeakers, blissfully unaware that their room has a frequency response riddled with peaks and deep nulls throughout the entire range.

Great forum. I'm glad to see people finally starting to recognize that their room is more important than pretty much anything else.

--Ethan

[Carlman]

Glad this circle is up and running.  I have been slapped in the face with how much room interaction plays a part in speaker or gear choices.  Things like whether your room is wide or long, carpeted or not... etc... all made for huge differences.  It was a surprise for me, maybe not for others, though.

Part of this experience has required some basic acoustic research for me.  I had to know why this phenomenon exists.  Why did my speakers sound so good in the demo room and then terrible when I got them home?

Why do I hear digital harshness now when I didn't before... same exact system, different room.  

There are also psychoacoustics.... which play a big part in all this as well.  

Then of course, there's psycho-semantics...  Which people can get into in a hurry...

I hope this will be a great place to learn more about acoustics and be able to apply it more effectively.

Thanks and have fun!  

-Carl

[pugs]

I received some Eighth Nerve stuff a couple of weeks back.  Originally, I put it up according to Nathan's diagram.  Everything was much more focused.  I had some time the other day to experiment a little more.  It's really amazing how the sound changes when you take a piece down and put it somewhere else.

Last night, I was hearing a lot of boominess while playing Morphine.  I walked around the room and found a spot where the boominess was the worst.  I put a seam up at the wall/ceiling joint, and voila, much better.  I read that the Eighth Nerve stuff wasn't supossed to do much to the bass, but it really did in my case.

I think it's very important to experiment with different configurations.  I realize now that the original configuration produced more of a dead sound.  Now, I have a nice dead/live balance that is much better than the original configuration.

[Rob Babcock]

Let me shout out a big "Welcome" to Ethan Winer!  It's an honor to have you here: your site is what initially gave me the inspiration to start an acoustics forum at AC.  I've noticed that it's hard to find quality info on the subject, and it takes a lot of Googling!   My idea is to gather this into a useful knowledge base at AC.  We're not the biggest site out there, but we're growing!  

I've got a link to your DIY site in the Starting Block, and it'd be great to link you here if that's okay.  I'm definately eager to pick your brain as much as you'll let me!  I'm itching to build some panel type bass traps pretty soon.

[nathanm]

Acoustics are easy to judge without even putting a single piece of equipment in a room.  Your ear insantly recognizes the relative size and reverberant quality of a space just by your being there.  Whether its ambient noise or the reflected sound of your own voice\body movements you can make a fairly accurate assumption about how good music is going to sound over speakers in the same room.  If a room sounds good for talking in it will probably sound good for music.  A few hand claps or jingling car keys never fails to point out any weird echoes there are as well.  I think that if you like the way a room sounds and feels on its own, if it is a place you feel comfortable in, then it'll sound better to your ears music-wise.

I've got a live end\dead end kind of setup with foam all over and just walking into this room from elsewhere in the house causes a drastic drop in the noise floor.  Immediately everything feels closer and more intimate.  Although I don't have a rodent problem per se, I wouldn't doubt that you could hear a mouse fart in there.  Acoustic noise floor is to me the most critical factor.  If that's low enough there isn't anything else to distract you.  I'd like to eventually have total diffusor coverage on the "live end", but that's quite a big project.  Bass nodes are also a problem, but there's really only one or two which sound objectionable.  You're pretty much screwed in a small room anyway.  Then again, acoustic treatment for a big room costs more money.

[Ethan Winer]

Hi Rob,

Thanks very much for the warm reception. As you know, I'm a man on a mission to explain why the acoustics in your listening room matter more than pretty much everything else.

> I'm definately eager to pick your brain <

Ooh, that sounds painful.

But if you promise to be gentle I'll gladly help.

--Ethan

[Ethan Winer]

Nathan,

> If a room sounds good for talking in it will probably sound good for music. <

I'd qualify that somewhat. Speech does not contain appreciable amounts of low frequency energy, so it does not reveal problems that can make a real mess of music. For example, a lot of people cover their walls with foam or other thin materials which absorbs only mid and high frequencies. So you clap your hands, or speak, and it indeed seems a lot better. But music and bass instruments are still boomy and very muddy. You can tell there's a bass instrument playing, but you can't make out the notes very well. This is why I'm a big believer in broadband absorption that's effective down to at least 80 Hz.

--Ethan

[Carlman]

But music and bass instruments are still boomy and very muddy. You can tell there's a bass instrument playing, but you can't make out the notes very well. This is why I'm a big believer in broadband absorption that's effective down to at least 80 Hz.  ...

This is something I've been trying to understand how to implement.  I'm assuming bass traps are the answer.  I have a small room and I feel I'm missing detail in the bass.  It's a little bloated in the midbass area... and then rolls off sharply for low bass.

Can someone point me to the principles so I can start learning how to correct this?

-Carl

[Ethan Winer]

Carl,

> Can someone point me to the principles <

See the Acoustics FAQ, second in the list on my Articles page:

www.ethanwiner.com/articles.html

--Ethan

[Carlman]

Carl,

> Can someone point me to the principles <

See the Acoustics FAQ, second in the list on my Articles page:

www.ethanwiner.com/articles.html

--Ethan

VERY good reading.  Thanks.