[WEEZ]

Nobody can explain in simple english what an ideal specification should be for a speaker cable as far as resistance/inductance/capacitance.

Most of us don't know a square wave from a grommet- and are lucky to find that our systems work at all. Somtimes it's no wonder that people just "give up" and buy what the "golden ears" tell us to buy because it's just so "airy", or "natural", or whatever.

On a recent thread I asked about a "recommended" speaker cable with .037uh inductance and 349pf capacitance and Frank said that would be a 'nasty load'. Fair enough. I'll buy in. (10khz square wave,...)-

So, how come all the speaker guys keep talking about low resistance and inductance? Must be a disconnect somewhere   ( no pun intended)

Recently saw a square wave chart (graph) on a cable guy's website that showed a pretty good looking "match" with their cable which happened to have low resistance/high capacitance. Now, I'll admit that this guy recommends an RC network (Zobel?) with "some" amplifiers. So you can see why a non-technical audiophile like me would be confused. What the hell is a Zobel?  

Somebody is zooming somebody- but you can't tell me that using high resistance lamp cord from Radio Shack is the ideal way to go for somone that is serious about making good music in their living room. In fact, seems to me that I read on AVA's website (old newsletters) that Frank even 'kinda' liked a cable that had almost five times the capacitance of the Radio Shack speaker cable.

So---, I will try this again--,

Is there a resistance/inductance/capacitance set of parameters that us stupid hi-fi nuts should be looking for?- or should we just be at the mercy of conflicting views by the "know it alls" and when we screw-up- only then be told " I told you so".

Good grief  

WEEZ

[Keith F.]

Hi Bill,

I remembered reading about this topic in My speaker manual. You can read it by going to the Legacy Audio website, click on 'manuals', then choose 'signature III'. Scroll down to 'hook up cables'. There is a chart there with some explanations. In a nutshell, They say the ideal conductor would have negligible resistance, inductance and capacitance. The chart shows measurements of four different guages of wire, then in summary they say "There are no perfect cables. The best way to approximate the ideal would be to keep loudspeaker leads as short as practical". Hope this will help.

[David Ellis]

Is there a resistance/inductance/capacitance set of parameters that us stupid hi-fi nuts should be looking for?- or should we just be at the mercy of conflicting views by the "know it alls" and when we screw-up- only then be told " I told you so".

I think that I know a few of these tidbits, but very few.  

I don't think you need to be at the mercy of mass marketing regarding these issues.  Unfortunately, even a rudimentary explanation is very long and very complex.  It requires a telephone conversation at a minimum.  Face to face conversation is better.

I know of two guys who understand the issues extant and would be willing to explain them.  However, I am careful about consuming their time needlessly.  I suggest you have all brain cells attached and take notes during the conversation.  I suggest you call Frank VanAlstine, or Jeff Glowacki ( www.soniccraft.com ) for this explanation.

Before any telephone calls, I suggest you read the information on Jon Risch's site.  He is an industry guy who took the time to write some very good thoughts about cables.  http://www.geocities.com/jonrisch/cables.htm

For what it's worth, I use Goertz foil speaker wire.  I think capacitance is a very small issue with speaker wire.  I also think characteristic impedance is much more significant.  I have tasted many flavors of cable and find the Goertz most pleasing to the ear.  I DO understand the capacitance might cause oscillation problems in some amps.  My push pull tube amp performs just fine with the higher capacitance Goertz speaker wire.

[WEEZ]

David,

Thanks for your helpful response--

I have skimmed thru the links you suggested (pretty technical for a guy like me) but I will re-read again and again for better understanding. This is fascinating to me.

Interesting that you use Goertz wires- that is the very website I referred to that portrayed a decent looking square wave with their low resistance/low inductance/high capacitance wire. They are also the source for my comments (questions) regarding the RC jumpers (Zobel).

So far- what I have learned   (i think..) is that tube amplifiers with their associated output transformers are less likely to care whether the load contains a higher capacitance. But I really hope to use a solid state amplifier so I am concerned about the compatibility. I just want to do my next system right ( as best I can ). I have "had-it" with compatibility issues in the past---

By the way, your speakers were high on my list- but being impatient like I am- I am using Merlin's. Nothing is forever, however.  

As I mentioned in other posts- I am leaning (strongly) toward an AVA T5R with a solid state amp ( Omegastar, Frank? ).

Again,-- thank you for your insight. It is greatly appreciated. Once I am satisfied that I know what the hell I'm doing- I look forward to enjoying the music instead of worrying about the equipment.

regards,

WEEZ!

[David Ellis]

Well,

I'd tell ya' what I think I know    but this really is NOT my area of expertise.  As mentioned, I have learned a few things, but the scope and depth of my knowledge in this area falls VERY short of the afore mentioned gentlemen.

It seems like you were frustrated in the past.  Was it a 300B SET amp?  I have heard 1 of these with the right speakers.  The sound was VERY nice.  Otherwise a plain-jane 300b SET has little use IMO. 99.99% of speakers just won't work with a SET amp.

I can address some of your concern about the impedance load presented to an amplifier and the RC network.  

Any speaker without an RC network (commonly called Zoebel) will have a rising impedance (AC resistance) as the frequency also rises.  The effect  offers the amplifier a more difficult load via the phase angle.  

Some folks make a big deal about a simple Zoebel, but the Zoebel is VERY minor in the grande scheme of things.  99% of loudspeakers have very extreme impedance swings in the crossover/bass region.  The slow rise cured by a Zoebel is VERY minor.  

Further, I believe MOST of the hoopla concerning Zoebel's and impedance control came from the good old days when everyone had SET amplifiers.  Such amplifiers deal with impedance swings VERY poorly.  Most new SS amps have a dampening factor about 500 with an 8 ohm load.  This makes the impedance swings almost a non-issue.

You will have to ask smarter (i.e. amplifier) folks for more information about this subject.

[WEEZ]

Dave-

(Out of town & away from my computer- hence delayed response)

No, I have not and probably will never use a single-ended 300B or 2A3 type amplifier. As you point out, they are too limited in the speaker pairing. (Requiring high-eff. horns or other high eff. speakers making for an expensive and sometimes "touchy" situation- not for me)

My experience (bad) was when using an older tube pre-amp with a push-pull tube amp and then switching to a solid-state amp which happened to have a low input impedence and everything sounded terrible. ( I just got tired of fooling with output tubes and transformer noise with the tube amp, and probably should have stuck with it compared to switching to a solid-state amp that presented an impedence mis-match).

So now I'm using a mid-priced integrated that "works" but sounds closed in and has a sound stage no bigger than my computer screen. This leads to my continued questions about compatability so that the next time I can enjoy the wonderful soundstage and realism of my old tube stuff, without the hassle of adjusting bias and spending a couple hundred bucks every other year replacing tubes.

So, anyway, thanks for your input re: the links on speaker cables, etc. Someday soon I hope to find the realism I used to have- without all the hassle. And it sounds like I may find that realism with AVA equipment. I'm just a cautious guy trying to learn so I can get the biggest bang for the buck.

I have read and heard many good things about AVA equipment- and I have been assured now by many on this forum of their merits. And, to me, the interconnects and cable are an important link that I want to do "right" also.

Many thanks to everyone who has responded here...

WEEZ