LFP-V Edition Tube Rolling Thread

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Vinnie R.

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Re: LFP-V Edition Tube Rolling Thread
« Reply #60 on: 27 Jan 2012, 09:45 pm »
Hi Merkel2016,

Thanks for your post - I have to agree!  8)

Hi Artmindes,

For more aggressive, faster sounding (and higher resolution), try EAT Coolvalve or Genalex Gold Lion (as posted earlier in this thread).  The MW Dario and Pinched Waist are not the best choice for speed, accuracy, and "aggression" with rock/metal/electronica, IMO...

Vinnie


CoolMilo

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Re: LFP-V Edition Tube Rolling Thread
« Reply #61 on: 3 Feb 2012, 09:20 pm »
I purchased a Corvina with the balanced option a month ago and I am very pleased with the purchase. The headphone amp really makes the LCD-2's sing, as Vinnie says.  :D

I started tube rolling. To get started I tried the Amperex 7308. It seemed to make a small improvement over the standard tube, but overall I was not impressed with the upgrade.

Today I received a Miniwatt Daria E188CC and wow what an improvement. I mostly listen to Jazz/World/flamenco music with a side of Pink Floyd and Rush from time to time. But everything that Vinnie described about the tube is the improvement I hear listening to my LCD-2's. They sing and they rock and roll now!

Vinnie wrote:
Miniwatt Dario 7308/E188CC (1960s, Made in France, gold pins, around $150 per tube)

The Sound

- Solid, full-sounding bass
- Fantastic soundstage width and depth
- Fleshed-out midrange
- Rich tone, "meat-on-the-bones" and juicy!
- Sweet and airy top-end

I couldn't agree more.

Does anyone know of a similar thread like this but comparing speaker matching to Red Wine Audio's Amps?

Vinnie R.

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Re: LFP-V Edition Tube Rolling Thread
« Reply #62 on: 7 Feb 2012, 02:24 pm »
Hi CoolMilo,

Welcome to the Red Wine Audio forum!

I'm glad you are enjoying your balanced Corvina / LCD-2 combo - and the MiniWatt Dario is one of the best tubes for this pairing IMHO! :D

Quote
Does anyone know of a similar thread like this but comparing speaker matching to Red Wine Audio's Amps?

See: http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=50808.0

Just a sampling of RWA amp / speaker pairings - there are so many more.  Feel free to contact me if you have any questions.

Happy listening,

Vinnie

Merkel 2016

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Re: LFP-V Edition Tube Rolling Thread
« Reply #63 on: 27 Feb 2012, 06:31 pm »
So the Miniwatt Dario sounds great! Does it also increase speed and liveliness of sound?

I sometimes find Isabellina too polite sounding with heavier rock/electronic music and I am looking for a more aggressive and faster sound.

Which will be better for speed and dynamics - the Miniwatt Dario or Amperex 6922 Pinched Waist?

Hey Artmindes, sorry I didn't reply to yours; as you can see from my high post count I don't spend a lot of time here. :lol:  I am more of an electric blues and jazz guy with a bit of everything else thrown in* except metal :o so I'm probably not the best guy to ask-- I'd listen to Vinnie (above) if you haven't already pulled the trigger on a new tube.

*actually, if you include things like Zero 7 or David Holmes in your electronic listening, they sound outstanding through the Miniwatt Dario, but when you say "speed" that might not be what you're looking for. There is a nice bit of what I think the experts-- of which I am not one-- call "decay" in the sound produced by the Miniwatt Dario, which I personally like but it might not be best for really quick, clean transitions in your music. As always, this is only my ears speaking.

catmansound

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Re: LFP-V Edition Tube Rolling Thread
« Reply #64 on: 23 Mar 2012, 02:53 am »
I'm new to this thread, 1 year's reading in 1 eve, so i'm caught up. Just purchased brand new Isabella & Vinnie is making magic with an old pair of 70.2's upgraded with LFP-V. So, any suggestions for the combo?

Vinnie R.

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Re: LFP-V Edition Tube Rolling Thread
« Reply #65 on: 28 Mar 2012, 05:17 pm »
Hi catmansound,

There are a lot of good choices!  Once your Isabella and upgraded 70.2s ship back (just waiting on the battery packs, which are on the way!) , I recommend listening with the stock tubes for a while
and then determining what aspects of the sound (if any) that you would like to be enhanced with good NOS tubes  8)

I'll email you as soon as everything ships.

Sincerely,

Vinnie

BrentG

Greetings, All.
   
This is my first post on this forum. I hope to write a detailed review of my Signature 15, once it is fully broken in.
My system: http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?action=systems;area=browse;system=1743

My Signature 15 is about half-way through break-in. After spending some time with the Sig 15, I've concluded that (for my system, at least) the stock JJ tube is too forward in the treble. I wanted to see if tube rolling could tame the treble a little.   I purchased two tubes from Upscale Audio: The US-made Amperex 7308 vintage gold pin and the Telefunken PCC88 / 7DJ8.

Amperex 7308 vintage gold pin
http://www.upscaleaudio.com/products/Amperex-7308-vintage-gold-pin!.html
This tube has a very relaxed treble. Even the midrange is laid back. The dynamics are… well… laid back. If The Dude was a twin triode, he might be the Amperex 7308 gold pin.
     
I was hoping the Amperex 7308 gold pin would tame the treble. I found that the target was overshot by a considerable margin. Also, I missed the more dynamic presentation of the stock tube. While this tube is pleasant in the Sig 15, it’s just too relaxed for my taste.

Ah, well. 

Telefunken PCC88 / 7DJ8
http://www.upscaleaudio.com/products/Telefunken-PCC88-%7B47%7D-7DJ8.html
This tube caught my attention immediately, and has yet to relinquish it.  The treble is extended and smooth; it has a nice sparkle without being harsh. There is an open, airy character to instruments and voices. The midrange is well balanced with the treble and bass. The bass is tight – much tighter and faster than the stock tube or (especially) the Amperex.
   
More generally, this tube is faster and more dynamic than the stock tube – and way, way more so than the Amperex 7308 gold pin.   Imaging is excellent, creating a soundstage with tremendous detail and depth.

In a word, gorgeous.

Vinnie R.

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Re: LFP-V Edition Tube Rolling Thread
« Reply #67 on: 30 Apr 2012, 09:59 pm »
Hi Brent,

Welcome to the RWA forum!

Thanks for sharing your tube rolling experience with the Signature 15.

I never heard the Telefunken 7DJ8.  Sounds tasty!  :drool:

One day...

Vinnie

Alwayswantmore

Re: LFP-V Edition Tube Rolling Thread
« Reply #68 on: 30 Apr 2012, 10:54 pm »
Interesting in that it shows just how much system matching matters. I guess that is one of the advantages of being able to tube-roll to tailor the sound.

fitmartin

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Re: LFP-V Edition Tube Rolling Thread
« Reply #69 on: 1 May 2012, 09:07 pm »
Amperex 7308 vintage gold pin


Tried an Amperex gold pin 1968 in my Signature 15, very lack lustre and bland sounding...NOT recommended IMHO


Alwayswantmore

Re: LFP-V Edition Tube Rolling Thread
« Reply #70 on: 1 May 2012, 09:32 pm »
Hi fitmartin. No disrespect to you, but what I have in both an HPA and Sig 15 sounds amazingly good. These may be different??? ...but this is what I'm running...

Amperex USN-CEP (military grade), gold pins, 7308 tubes. 1965 production, white letter, U.S.A. (Amperex New York) manufacturer (Philips) Amperex factory date code:  VR5 *5D

Cheers! Kent



Amperex 7308 vintage gold pin


Tried an Amperex gold pin 1968 in my Signature 15, very lack lustre and bland sounding...NOT recommended IMHO

fitmartin

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Re: LFP-V Edition Tube Rolling Thread
« Reply #71 on: 3 May 2012, 03:22 am »
Different tube from yours, US production green lettered 1968

Ken D

Re: LFP-V Edition Tube Rolling Thread
« Reply #72 on: 3 May 2012, 10:21 am »
Question about Dario Miniwatt.

I'm using Amperex 6922 PQ white label in my Signature 15.  Looking for richer sound.

Found a seller with Dario green label tube manufactured in 1979.   Anyone know how close to early 60's tube this tube would sound ?

He wants $90 so looking for some input before I pull the trigger.

thanks.

Profbratsch

Re: LFP-V Edition Tube Rolling Thread
« Reply #73 on: 3 May 2012, 03:14 pm »

I'm using Amperex 6922 PQ white label in my Signature 15.  Looking for richer sound.

Have you considered Tungsram tubes?  They might have the color you are looking for, and there are quite a few being listed on Ebay at the moment.  Reasonably priced, too... :thumb:

Hope you find what you are looking for!

BrentG

A funny thing happened on the way to audio bliss…
« Reply #74 on: 8 May 2012, 05:50 pm »
Last week – more than a week after rolling in the Telefunken 7DJ8, I noticed a significant change in the Signature 15. The treble opened up further; also the overall dynamics increased. The difference was enough for my wife (who is not a musician, an audiophile, or even a particularly careful listener) to comment that the system sounded brighter.

I was reminded of this posting by Jeff V:

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=104279.msg1073960#msg1073960

Quote
“At 40-50 hours, the Sig 15 snapped into focus rather dramatically.  Kinda went from ‘good’ to "Whoa!"

On some recordings, the Sig 15 / Telefunken 7DJ8 combination is revelatory - the sense of ambiance and air around instruments and voices can be stunning. On other recordings, it’s definitely too much of good thing – it can sound unnaturally bright; male vocals can get lost in the mix, female vocals can have exaggerated sibilant fricatives.

[I should note that my GoldenEar speakers utilize ribbon tweeters. Their treble performance is smooth and extended, but not what I would call forgiving. Also, my listening room is on the live side and I’m not using any acoustic treatments.]

I rolled the Amperex 7308 vintage gold pin back into the Sig 15. What a difference a week makes! This tube sounds much better to me now. It’s still a little too laid back in the treble for me – but only a little.  [I find I’m listening at louder levels to compensate for the treble.] The midrange is really, really good now; most vocals are spot on. Dynamics seem OK to me; not amazing, but I don’t notice the dynamics sounding compressed as before.

Overall, I’d say the Amperex 7308 tube is now closer than the Telefunken 7DJ8 to my ideal tonal balance. I’d like a little of that Telefunken sparkle back in the treble. I’d also like better dynamics.

I guess tube rolling shall continue… First, I shall roll the stock tube back in!

The key thing I’ve learned is to be more patient… allow the unit to fully break-in before commencing the tweaking.

-Brent

******

Master: …Ed Gooberman, you must learn patience.
Ed: Yeah, yeah, patience.  How long will that take?

fitmartin

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Re: LFP-V Edition Tube Rolling Thread
« Reply #75 on: 9 May 2012, 04:33 pm »
Thanks Brent, your feedback has been very helpful to me.
I found the Amperex 7308 USA produced 1968 too laid back in all areas and returned it for another attempt thanks to the kindness of Chelsea at TC Tubes
here is what is on its way
http://tctubes.com/Philips-Miniwatt-6DJ8-ECC88.aspx
it is high gain so will keep you posted on the sound when I receive it.

cheers,

Martin    :thumb:

fitmartin

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Re: LFP-V Edition Tube Rolling Thread
« Reply #76 on: 28 May 2012, 10:15 pm »
The Phillips miniwatt made in Holland 1965 is a high gain tube that offers the same sound as the Dario Miniwatt made in France at a fraction of the cost...I paid about $80 shipped

The Sound

- Solid, full-sounding bass
- Fantastic soundstage width and depth
- Fleshed-out midrange
- Rich tone, "meat-on-the-bones" and juicy!
- Sweet and airy top-end

Phillips is the parent company for many Euro made tubes  :thumb:

Vinnie R.

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Re: LFP-V Edition Tube Rolling Thread
« Reply #77 on: 29 May 2012, 01:46 pm »
Hi fitmartin,

Quote
The Phillips miniwatt made in Holland 1965 is a high gain tube that offers the same sound as the Dario Miniwatt made in France at a fraction of the cost...I paid about $80 shipped

That's a nice price - gotta try them an compare to the Darios....

Thanks for all your posts!

Vinnie

vincent28

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Re: LFP-V Edition Tube Rolling Thread
« Reply #78 on: 12 Sep 2012, 04:32 pm »
http://www.tubemuseum.org/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=SH_E88CC

Just place in a siemens grey shield ao over my telefunken cca.
Holy cow

Vinnie R.

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Re: LFP-V Edition Tube Rolling Thread
« Reply #79 on: 21 Sep 2012, 01:43 pm »
Quote
Just place in a siemens grey shield ao over my telefunken cca.

Hi vincent28,

Are these as good as the Siemens Cca's from the 1950s?


Cheers!

Vinnie