[vinyl_guy]

I'd go along with this, having worked with a number of plastic forming companies. If surface finish is important and/or a need to avoid costly post mold cleaning, then the releasing aid is typically included in the base material.

This is consistent with what I have read and heard. In Fremer's 2d video he talks about mold release compound being part of the vinyl formula. The process at Pallas shows the vinyl biscuit being heated between the labels with the press closing/closed and then cooled before the trimming phase.  On the video, Michael states he has been told that the mold release compound rises to the surface as the vinyl is heated. According to the video, it takes about 45 seconds to press a record.

[rcag_ils]

Do they use PAM for mold release agent? I wonder.

[lonewolfny42]

The records are handled by humans as they are inserted into the inner sleeve and cover (finger prints)

Not in this video.....it's all machines....have a look...(at 0:53)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K29vyFJKCeM

[Elizabeth]

I want to comment on water. purified water. "Aqua Fina" (Pepsi) is really pure water. Local municipal water is passed through membranes that really get every tiny bit of junk out of the water. The only stuff in it is the bit of stuff off the innards of the bottles it is sold in!
When I do wash a record in the sink, I final rinse it with Aqua Fina. No residue.
(When I fill a bowl with tap water, the amount of gunk left after the water dries up,  is disgusting!!)
On AudioAsylum, a long set of posts about the problems of ultrapure water..? But I never have had any problems.. (maybe because I just rinse with it?   .. so..

[orthobiz]

I want to comment on water. purified water. "Aqua Fina" (Pepsi) is really pure water. Local municipal water is passed through membranes that really get every tiny bit of junk out of the water. The only stuff in it is the bit of stuff off the innards of the bottles it is sold in!

Fremer commented once about AquaFina specifically, stating it was good stuff. I use the reverse osmosis stuff from the culligan unit in my kitchen.

Paul

[Scott F.]

I'd like to know what "mold release" compound is used. Anybody know or is it just something you've heard. I seen a few videos on stamping records, and there was no "mold release" used at all. So what is the story. I'm not sure if it could even work.

Hiya Wayner,

I addressed mold release a few years ago in an old thread. Here are the links to my posts;

Initial Post

Response 1

Response 2

Between the old article I wrote for TNT-Audio that Photon posted above and the links to my old posts, that should give you the info you are looking for.

[vinyl_guy]

Hiya Wayner,

I addressed mold release a few years ago in an old thread. Here are the links to my posts;

Initial Post

Response 1

Response 2

Between the old article I wrote for TNT-Audio that Photon posted above and the links to my old posts, that should give you the info you are looking for.

Scott,

thanks for posting this. Very interesting and very helpful

[DaveyW]

Yes thanks Scott - Very informative.
I suspect that there's a variation in formulations making some discs worse than others in terms of levels of end of process surface contaminant.

I suppose if you have an RCM as Neo says, why not.
My position on this may well be different if I had this option. I'm still using the manual process as outlined in my web page, it gives good results but is quite time consuming and the air drying takes up whole rooms at a time as I tend to do in batches.
I have been mulling over a home made RCM on and off for a while using a combo of steam and vac - 2011 could well be the year 
By the way it's very unlikely to be anywhere near as professional a job as yours Scott - Nice job 
Cheers
Dave

[Wayner]

Thanks for the info Scott. I just couldn't buy the fact that something was sprayed onto the stamper plate, as it would act as a hydrolic and interfere with the groove pressing (it has to go somewhere) and that is probably why they formulated something into the vinyl.

Now, there are a couple of vinyl labels that brag about 100% virgin vinyl, but failed to mention that it is infact (according to Scott's report) an alloy of various materials.

Wayner

[Scott F.]

Thanks Guys (and girls  )

As I understand it, the vinyl formulations are fairly secretive so we really don't know how much salts of stearic acids are in the vinyl but they are there.

I'm not sure if you've ever opened a new piece of vinyl and seen this dull sheen on the surface but if you have, I'm pretty sure that is the salts Duane (the Disc Doc) is referring to. I suspect that albums like those are a fairly standard vinyl formulation that use a fair amount of salts. Some of the new vinyl formulations like the Quiex II tend to look a bit cleaner when you open them but I still clean them anyway knowing they still have to use salts or some sort of mold release.

[Wayner]

Having only a laundry sink for a RCM, and don't try and talk me into one, I did some experimenting this afternoon. I like this stuff called De-solv-it. It made from orange peel oil and will cut though things like wax and glues. Anyway, I tried a few of my new LPs that felt sticky when I damp brushed them. I first sprayed De-solv-it on both sides and let it sit for a bit, then into the laundry tube filled with warm water and dishwashing detergent. De-solv-it will eventually break down the detergent, but for awhile, the detergent will cut the De-solv-it. One new record, XTC as the Dukes of the Stratosphere damp brushed very nicely. It was slippery and totally noise free. I don't know if any residue is left, but it doesn't look like it or sound like it. Give it a try.

Wayner

[Wayner]

Had to wash them a second time, but now they are really clean.

Wayner

[lonewolfny42]

Speaking of clean....

From the CES 2011 blog....a new record cleaning machine....

http://www.stereophile.com/content/sumikos-okki-nokki

[Johnny2Bad]

Having only a laundry sink for a RCM, and don't try and talk me into one, I did some experimenting this afternoon. I like this stuff called De-solv-it. It made from orange peel oil and will cut though things like wax and glues. Anyway, I tried a few of my new LPs that felt sticky when I damp brushed them. I first sprayed De-solv-it on both sides and let it sit for a bit, then into the laundry tube filled with warm water and dishwashing detergent. De-solv-it will eventually break down the detergent, but for awhile, the detergent will cut the De-solv-it. One new record, XTC as the Dukes of the Stratosphere damp brushed very nicely. It was slippery and totally noise free. I don't know if any residue is left, but it doesn't look like it or sound like it. Give it a try.


Wayner

I would proceed with caution with citrus-based cleaners on LPs; at a minimum you should do extensive testing on non-critical albums. It may well be that they are fine on vinyl, but I can assure you they will permanently damage most plastics, paints, etc if used at too strong a concentration. The erosion happens over time and will not be evident with a spill or application wiped quickly, so if it were me I would take a long term look and see ... a few weeks would be a good start; I've seen the damage reveal itself in that time. If you do decide to use it as a cleaning fluid component, then dilution to recommended levels ... no stronger ... and thorough cleaning is my minimum suggestion.


Plastic is not vinyl; I realize that, and different chemical formulas yield different products even if the component ingredients are the same or similar, but then again not always that different. I have no direct experience with citrus cleaners used specifically on vinyl compounds so can't comment on whether it's a danger or benign with vinyl.


As for the OP's question, I agree that cleaning of new albums is desirable. Almost any hot stamping process will have release agents to aid in volume manufacturing efficiencies, I see no reason why LP manufacturing would be different, and it's always been my understanding that the release agents are present in new vinyl albums.

[guest48077]

Yeah i always clean New Records befor playing.

[Wayner]

I would proceed with caution with citrus-based cleaners on LPs; at a minimum you should do extensive testing on non-critical albums. It may well be that they are fine on vinyl, but I can assure you they will permanently damage most plastics, paints, etc if used at too strong a concentration. The erosion happens over time and will not be evident with a spill or application wiped quickly, so if it were me I would take a long term look and see ... a few weeks would be a good start; I've seen the damage reveal itself in that time. If you do decide to use it as a cleaning fluid component, then dilution to recommended levels ... no stronger ... and thorough cleaning is my minimum suggestion.


Plastic is not vinyl; I realize that, and different chemical formulas yield different products even if the component ingredients are the same or similar, but then again not always that different. I have no direct experience with citrus cleaners used specifically on vinyl compounds so can't comment on whether it's a danger or benign with vinyl.


As for the OP's question, I agree that cleaning of new albums is desirable. Almost any hot stamping process will have release agents to aid in volume manufacturing efficiencies, I see no reason why LP manufacturing would be different, and it's always been my understanding that the release agents are present in new vinyl albums.

Well it already comes in a plastic bottle. The records are already cleaned and I doubt there will be any long term reactions to the cleaner. Not the first time I've used this stuff on records, but is the first time I used it to clean a new record. Seems to work rather well. Bio-safe as well.

Wayner

[orthobiz]

Since this thread I've been cleaning my records with a single stage enzyme routine. The "full" routine starts with my enzyme stuff, then l'Art du Son then purified water. TEDIOUS! I figure if there's grime in the manufacturing plant, the enzyme should take care of it.

Paul