Pascal vs Hopkins

django11 · « **on:** 17 Dec 2010, 11:51 am »

Light heavyweight champ Jean Pascal against the 45 year old legend Bernard "Popkins". I'm actually nervous for Pascal...

Rob Babcock · « **Reply #1 on:** 17 Dec 2010, 12:20 pm »

"The Executioner" is da man! Even at his age his still an incredibly dangerous fighter!

satfrat · « **Reply #2 on:** 18 Dec 2010, 06:50 am »

I'll side with "Popkins" til the day he becomes grandfatherPopkins. I'm hoping that day isn't this saturday.

iiiiiiit's Showtime!

Cheers,
Robin

jackman · « **Reply #3 on:** 18 Dec 2010, 08:08 pm »

I hate Hopkins and hope he gets beaten into retirement, perminantly. My prediction is that Hopkins will clutch, grap, hit on breaks, hit Pascal below the belt, fight in spurts and land some punches but not enough to win a decision and then bitch after the fight about being robbed. I'm tired of this guy and, although I was once a fan (and agree with those who say Roy Jones dodged Bernard after their first fight because he knew he would lose) but now I can't stand this trash.

Pascal is a decent fighter and has youth on his side. Bernard is in remarkable shape for a 45 year old man and he knows how to box enough to keep him in any fight in this division. His fights are rarely entertaining and I don't expect this one to be any different. Hopkins is very smart in the ring and knows how to hold and cheapshot when things start slipping in the fight. Hopefully the younger man will put him on the deck and be ready for Bernard's antics.

django11 · « **Reply #4 on:** 19 Dec 2010, 12:19 am »

Pascal is from my hometown. I wasn't all that impressed with him when he was coming up but since and including the Froch fight, which he lost, he has matured remarkably. He was impressive against Diaconu and especially against Chad Dawson. But he fights in spurts and gets gassed around midway in the fight. It also kind of worries me that Bernard wanted this fight, he must have seen something. I hope I am wrong and Pascal can get at least the win. A KO would be very surprising and would finally end Hopkins career...

satfrat · « **Reply #5 on:** 19 Dec 2010, 12:30 am »

You look at Hopkin's promo pictures, then you see the man and it's like seeing 2 different fighters. I'm more curious than anything to see if Bernard actually has anything left or if this is just a money fight for the guy. But to look at him, I don't see it being much of a fight. I hope I'm wrong,,, and I hope Jackman's dead wrong with his cheap shot scenario.

Cheers,
Robin

dB Cooper · « **Reply #6 on:** 19 Dec 2010, 03:00 am »

I like Hopkins but wish he would retire. Agree with django: he must see a flaw in Pascal, otherwise he wouldn't have taken the fight. Whether he has enough left to exploit the flaw is the question. Even if he does, he might get hosed by the hometown judges the way Sugar Ray did against Duran long ago.

I also like the now-pitiful Holyfield and wish he would sell his ~~hotel~~ house, bank the money, move into someplace far less ridiculous, and spend his time playing with the children and grandchildren of the numerous women he banged out of wedlock. (Not that I am criticizing him for having sex, just for being a hypocrite for repeatedly cheating on his wive(s) while proselytizing constantly.)

jimdgoulding · « **Reply #7 on:** 19 Dec 2010, 03:59 am »

dbC- Sugar Ray was handily defeated by Duran in Montreal. What chu talkin about, bro? I've seen that fight three times and am objectively certain he was.

jimdgoulding · « **Reply #8 on:** 19 Dec 2010, 04:05 am »

Quote from: satfrat on 19 Dec 2010, 12:30 am

You look at Hopkin's promo pictures, then you see the man and it's like seeing 2 different fighters. I'm more curious than anything to see if Bernard actually has anything left or if this is just a money fight for the guy. But to look at him, I don't see it being much of a fight. I hope I'm wrong,,, and I hope Jackman's dead wrong with his cheap shot scenario.

Cheers,
Robin

Sure, it's a money fight. Win or lose. He's not contending or anything.

satfrat · « **Reply #9 on:** 19 Dec 2010, 05:13 am »

OOOOh Canada, it was highway robbery that happened up there. 2 point Hopkin card against 2 tied cards and Hopkins got robbed. Pascal cried dirty fighting after the fight, nothing could have been further from the truth. It was one of the cleanest Hopkins fight I have ever witnessed and quite frankly an incredible performance from a 45 year old fighter. Pascal got schooled, Pascal was the one who was punching behind the head, and Pascal was the one who cried after the fight, even tho they let him keep his belt. Really sad champion IMHO.

But what a surprisingly good fight to close 2010! Thank you Bernard Hopkins.

Cheers,
Robin

jackman · « **Reply #10 on:** 19 Dec 2010, 01:59 pm »

Hey it looks like I missed an entertaining fight. Let's see, Bernard gets dropped in three of first four rounds, comes back and fights string and then bitches about the decision? Hopkins bitching about a decision? I feel like I have seen that fight several times. Every time he loses he bitches.

Hopkins probably outboxes that Canadian wuss but you don't get dropped three times and take away the belt in a champ's backyard. Did Hopkins knock Pascal down during the fight? I didn't see the fight.

django11 · « **Reply #11 on:** 19 Dec 2010, 02:20 pm »

It was a good fight and Bernard was phenomenal. He clearly won the fight except for the two knockdowns. The scorecards tell a different story because of the two knockdowns. On the scorecards it could have gone either way and no journalists, except Jim Gray who probably should be on Prozac, is crying robbery. After the third round Pascal could have been ahead by 5 points . From the 4th to the 12th you only needed to give Pascal two rounds to get to a draw. No robbery there. Still, Pascal is lucky to have escaped with his belts and is certainly the sorer fighter this morning.

Hopkins wasn't totally clean, he knocked Pascal down with a head butt and landed a few low blows. But all in all it was probably Hopkins most entertaining, clean and energetic fight in a long time.

Here are the actual scorecards:

jackman · « **Reply #12 on:** 19 Dec 2010, 02:27 pm »

Interesting fight. I hope to see a replay. Hopkins is crafty with his cheap shots. He leads with his head, holds and hits and throws low blows when the ref isn't looking. I believe the only reason it wasn't three knockdowns is that one was ruled a slip. Hopkins needed to score at least one knockdown in later rounds to win a decision.

I need to see a replay but it's rare for a challenger to come to a champ's backyard, get knocked down more than once and dominated early and come back to win a close decision. It just doesn't happen.

Hopkins knows how to fight and is in great shape for his age. I just wish he wasn't such a crybaby.

jackman · « **Reply #13 on:** 19 Dec 2010, 02:32 pm »

How did the third judge score it 10-9 when Hopkins was knocked down? Should have been a two point round like the other judges scored it.

Oh, and Jim Gray is as bent as a jockey's elbow.

dB Cooper · « **Reply #14 on:** 19 Dec 2010, 03:23 pm »

Quote from: jimdgoulding on 19 Dec 2010, 03:59 am

dbC- Sugar Ray was handily defeated by Duran in Montreal. What chu talkin about, bro? I've seen that fight three times and am objectively certain he was.

I too have seen that fight several times; Ray fought Duran on more or less equal terms and lost because he was goaded into fighting Duran's fight by the classless Duran's behavior (like giving Ray's wife the finger at press conferences). Ray wanted to prove he could brawl with him which he did. If anything he beat himself by fighting the wrong fight. The ease with which Ray not only dominated Duran in the rematch but MADE HIM QUIT shows who was the better fighter. No mas! No mas!

JackD201 · « **Reply #15 on:** 19 Dec 2010, 03:44 pm »

I hope to see a replay too. Sounds like it was one heckuva fight from how wildly the sides differ.

dB, You can't judge the Montreal fight by the rematch. Leonard himself said he pressed for the immediate rematch because he knew of Duran's propensity to severely fatten up after every fight. (Kinda like the template for Ricky Hatton I guess

)I still think Leonard was far and away the better boxer. The second fight however, by his own admission, proved he won with his smarts more than his skill. As far as "owning" Duran, I believe Tommy Hearns owns that distinction.

satfrat · « **Reply #16 on:** 19 Dec 2010, 04:37 pm »

Quote from: jackman on 19 Dec 2010, 02:32 pm

How did the third judge score it 10-9 when Hopkins was knocked down? Should have been a two point round like the other judges scored it.

Oh, and Jim Gray is as bent as a jockey's elbow.

Quite simple really, Hopkins was winning the round til the freak slap behind the head knockdown which made is a 10-9 round instead of a 10-8. There was 1 legit knockdown and even then it did no damage, simply caught Bernard off balance. The head bunts were being precipitated by Pascal who in the early rounds was charging into Hopkins like a rhyno on meth. His herky-jerky style had Hopkins pausing in the 1st 4 rounds but once Bernard caught him with a couple well placed body shots, that was that. Most of the actual fouling was Pascal's behind the head punches, especially early on. But towards the end of the fight, even them weren't bothering Hopkins anymore. Hopkins told it like it was after the fight while Pascal acted just like he should have, a grateful fighter would had just been rescued by 2 of the judges. And Jim Gray was his normal annoying little prick self but at least he knew who the winner was.

But I can practically guarantee you won't see Pascal fight Bernard again, even in 5 more years. Bermard made him a scared fighter who's reactions after the fight was over (but before the scorecards were read) is what I'll personally remember,,, and anyone who hasn't seen this fight, look for that once the 12th round bell is rung. It tells the whole story.

edit: the only reshowing of this fight that I can find on my (2 week ahead) DirecTv interactive Guide appears on Showtime2 this coming tuesday 12/21 @ 10:00pm est .

Cheers,
Robin

django11 · « **Reply #17 on:** 19 Dec 2010, 05:57 pm »

I thought that the 2 knock downs were legit. The first one caught Bernard just behind the ear (btw the american judge scored the first round 10-8 Pascal). A lot of the shots behind the head were just because of the styles: Pascal's looping punches and Bernard ducking. On the second knock down, Bernard when straight down and I think Pascal should have jumped on him after the count instead of letting him clear the cobwebs.

That was an intentional head butt when Pascal went down. Bernard's fouls tend to be of the subtle variety. Still, for Bernard, it was a pretty clean fight.

Pascal was rescued by his two knock downs of Bernard. He also landed the harder punches. Really, I can't see a majority draw as a robbery.

I would tend to agree that Pascal won't want the rematch. But Pascal has earned my grudging respect and has improved fight after fight and has taken on challenge after challenge. In a rematch he would be smart enough to change styles. Mind you Bernard is a boxing genius so it is hard to pick against him. And really, Pascal's style is not a good one to beat Hopkins. (But then who's is? Even Calzaghe only beat Hopkins by controversial split decision.) If I am Pascal's promoter I'm looking for a fight with Tavoris Cloud...

Here are the 2 knockdowns
Knock down one
Knock down two

Who is the last guy who knocked Hopkins down twice? I guess Pascal deserves a little credit...

satfrat · « **Reply #18 on:** 19 Dec 2010, 06:17 pm »

Quote from: django11 on 19 Dec 2010, 05:57 pm

I thought that the 2 knock downs were legit. The first one caught Bernard just above and behind the ear (btw the american judge scored the first round 10-8 Pascal). A lot of the shots behind the head were just because of the styles: Pascal's looping punches and Bernard ducking. On the second knock down, Bernard when straight down and I think Pascal should have jumped on him after the count instead of letting him clear the cobwebs.

That was an intentional head butt when Pascal went down. Bernard's fouls tend to be of the subtle variety. Still, for Bernard, it was a pretty clean fight.

Pascal was rescued by his two knock downs of Bernard. He also landed the harder punches. Really, I can't see a majority draw as a robbery.

I would tend to agree that Pascal won't want the rematch. But Pascal has earned my grudging respect and has improved fight after fight and has taken on challenge after challenge. In a rematch he would be smart enough to change styles. Mind you Bernard is a boxing genius so it is hard to pick against him. And really, Pascal's style is not a good one to beat Hopkins. (But then who's is? Even Calzaghe only beat Hopkins by controversial split decision.) If I am Pascal's promoter I'm looking for a fight with Tavoris Cloud...

Well I guess as it was with the judges, the press judges, and the announcer judges, we saw the fight differently. Then again that pretty much sums up the sport of boxing in a nutshell.

But at least we agree and I think anyone who watches this fight will agree, it was a damn good fight!

I hope to watch Pascals next fight tho, just to see what lingering effects, if any, that might have resulted from this fight. Being optimistic, it'll make him a better fighter but it could also make him doubt himself after being so easily schooled by Hopkins. Stay tuned,,,,

Cheers,
Robin

dB Cooper · « **Reply #19 on:** 19 Dec 2010, 06:24 pm »

Quote from: JackD201 on 19 Dec 2010, 03:44 pm

I hope to see a replay too. Sounds like it was one heckuva fight from how wildly the sides differ.

dB, You can't judge the Montreal fight by the rematch. Leonard himself said he pressed for the immediate rematch because he knew of Duran's propensity to severely fatten up after every fight. (Kinda like the template for Ricky Hatton I guess )I still think Leonard was far and away the better boxer. The second fight however, by his own admission, proved he won with his smarts more than his skill. As far as "owning" Duran, I believe Tommy Hearns owns that distinction.

Don't recall saying Leonard "owned" Duran but he did make him do what no other fighter could: quit.* I don't judge the Montreal fight by the rematch. I'm just saying that, win or lose, Ray held his own in a streetfight with one of the best fighters ever at a time when many viewed him as an overhyped media creation. He just fought the wrong fight. I just think the fight was closer than you see it. Ironically, Hagler made the same mistake years later by trying to prove he could outbox Ray (he couldn't; should have used the same fight plan he used against Hearns.)

*Hearns didn't make Duran quit; he just turned off the master circuit breaker

Loved seeing that...