[DARTH AUDIO]

I may have to finally break down and get this one. Anybody want a couple of my tts?

 

Wayner 

Thanks for the heads up!! Just sent Santa a message with this picture.

[BobRex]

My $$$ would go on TTWeights direct drive.

The TTWeights tables are rim drive, not direct.  They also come without an arm, so add that cost onto the package.  You also have to deal with separate motor and arm pods, which can be a pita to set up.  If the "cheap" (I forget the name and can't get to the site from work) table were still under 5 grand it woud be competitive with the Classic 3, but at the current price and the cost of an arm, you are looking at a minimum 30% premium for the TTWeights. 

[orthobiz]

I'm still waiting for last years Christmas present, The CARS-Candy-O that was in last years catalog (on MOFI) and it's in there this year, still "unavailable".

I'd say a year is jumping the gun.

Wayner

Get the three Elvis Costello records, they are available now. Without Elvis there would have been no Cars!

Paul

[Minn Mark]

Ha ! Forget Wayner !   Send your donations to ME, in care of V.E.T.E. (vinyl exists to enjoy). Your money is efficiently used. All proceeds will go to furthering VETE's cause.

Thanks in advance for your generosity !

Mark.

[Minn Mark]

OK, but seriously......I dont know anyone who has a VPI, but seems like I see lots in the threads that they aren't speed stable w/o the SDS, which is an extra $1200?  C'mon.....$3000+ and up for TT and they're not speed stable ?

You guys, please clue me in. Would love to upgrade from my 1993 SOTA Comet, but really get 'audio nervosa' when it comes to so many varying options and opinions...

M

[Sonny]

OK, but seriously......I dont know anyone who has a VPI, but seems like I see lots in the threads that they aren't speed stable w/o the SDS, which is an extra $1200?  C'mon.....$3000+ and up for TT and they're not speed stable ?

You guys, please clue me in. Would love to upgrade from my 1993 SOTA Comet, but really get 'audio nervosa' when it comes to so many varying options and opinions...

M

Well, I had the Scout and now an older TNT, and before the SDS, the speed was fine...again, since these are belt driven and the belt is long, speed does vary over time as the weather gets warmer or colder...the belt expands/retracts, etc...but it was not an issue for me....

Again, most high end tables have an outboard PS that controls speed...so VPI is not alone.

Thanks
T

[Scottdazzle]

OK, but seriously......I dont know anyone who has a VPI, but seems like I see lots in the threads that they aren't speed stable w/o the SDS, which is an extra $1200?  C'mon.....$3000+ and up for TT and they're not speed stable ?

You guys, please clue me in. Would love to upgrade from my 1993 SOTA Comet, but really get 'audio nervosa' when it comes to so many varying options and opinions...

M

M,

I have a VPI Classic and it has been speed stable from day one.

S

[Wayner]

I think, and perhaps John TheChairGuy can answer this better, the new and massive platter that VPI now uses on almost all of their models, weighing in at (I thought) 20 some odd pounds, takes care of lots of speed variation issues just because of the inertia of the mass.

This is why older vintage Empires were, and still are, very popular as they also featured massive platters. Since ths VPI motor is a synchronous type, which locks onto sinewave, rather then voltage, isn't really a problem.

On another front, I also see that Soundsmith cartridges, the Zepher, now has a VPI formulated cartridge made exclusively for the unipivot tonearm of the VPIs. It's $1000 price is up there, but it is an moving iron design that is suppose to address azumuth smear that unipivots are known for (azimuth wobble).

So now we are up to $7,000 for a real killer system. I know this is a table that I would not normally support, because of it's high price, but I think VPI has put together all of the right things, finally, that I would want my table to have.

If we also value our record collection (mine is insured for $100,000), then $7,000 player is not out of line.

Wayner

[TheChairGuy]

OK, but seriously......I dont know anyone who has a VPI, but seems like I see lots in the threads that they aren't speed stable w/o the SDS, which is an extra $1200?  C'mon.....$3000+ and up for TT and they're not speed stable ?

You guys, please clue me in. Would love to upgrade from my 1993 SOTA Comet, but really get 'audio nervosa' when it comes to so many varying options and opinions...

M

Mark,

Like scotthobby, the VPI Classic seems speed stable without SDS...whereas the HW-19 MK. III I owned such speed consistency was impossible without SDS.

With SDS, the HW-19 was speed stable (to my ears, at least)

John

[1oldguy]

This really is the cats meow.Has anyone here tried this table or heard it?

[eclein]

Wayner if you start unloading TT to get this sweet new one make sure you drop me a line on the cheapest one your moving out.......I'm diggin Vinyl.

[etcarroll]

As a recent convert to the VPI way, having acquired a Scout and Super Scoutmaster, I've been following the company and learned that Sheila Weisfeld (Mrs. VPI), has been having health issues.

So, if you'd be so kind as to keep her in your thoughts I'm sure it would be appreciated.

[marknoir]

$6,000

 

Wayner, I could never understand your fascination with this thing. Probably akin to mine of old Jaguar cars - they never run that well, but they look great standing still... Anybody familiar with table design and the similarity of this thing to old school Empire and AR tables will tell you, that this is nothing but an overpriced gimmick, successfully marketed by smart people. There is a large number of tables out there for less than half the price which will sound as good if not better. The whole idea of putting the motor back on board, after advocating for many years that it should be outboard, and should be an expensive option as such, seems ridiculous to me at. And then claiming that it sounds better than TNT and XR and whatever - just undermines company's reputation to me. VPI used to be a user-oriented company, now they are clearly into making money. $6000 for this? Give me a break... Get yourself an old VPI HW-19 for peanuts, and you are just about there.  Put in a new bearing/platter/perifery ring - and you ARE there. Nothing new here, some people claim that their Lenco in a nice freshly laquered wooden box sounds better than a $40 000 reference table, and sell them for $4000 - another gimmick apparently bringing mucho money. Some tube preamps have nothing in them but a couple of tubes, caps and a tranny, and try to justify a $8000 price tag. How about a phono cartridge for 10 grand? Just a state of affairs in our age.

But to each his own, I guess. I'd rather buy an old Jaguar.

[TheChairGuy]

Marknoir,

I had an HW-19 MkIII. It got the new bearing for it, the periphery ring, I mounted the motor fully outboard and added SDS (borrowed from a friend) and tried with both built-in springs and with springs defeated in various ways. Arms employed were a fully rewired and drop counterweighted Rega 250, a JELCO/ AQ PT-5 and an Origin Live Illustrious MkII.

All told, assuming the MKIII valued at it's used price of $800 back then and we'll assume (as they were) that all of the addons except new bearing valued at used costs...the package with the OL arm was over $3000 involved.

Having owned it and listened intensely to it (search for my name and VPI HW-19 and you'll find a couple comparo's I made with tables owned at that time) and I can tell you that $3000 almagamation of used add-ons didn't sound nearly as good as the VPI Classic bought at the then intro price of $2500.

I use the same periphery ring, it's set up in the same system used by the same user (me) and I can categorically tell you that the Classic trounces the HW-19 setup. The HW-19 I'd even rate as fair only until the SDS was paired with it.

VPI can set their own price on what they want. I have heard that dealers make a short mark on the now $2750 Classic machine, so some part of the higher $6k price on the Classic 3 are higher dealer margins and more profit.

I have previously expressed preference for DD decks as I felt their superiority of speed over belt drives...but here I happily spin my Classic, save only for a periphery ring added, and sense no speed irregularities even on prized piano pieces I have heard hundreds of times over the years. There is nothing like listening to piano to find speed irregularities.

The Classic is simply a sensational new deck. Dunno' about how much better the 3 could be, but my thinking is my system and hearing at age 48 aren't going to find 2.2x the enjoyment from it as the Classic now brings to me 

John

[marknoir]

Hello John and thank you for your long reply

IMHO, the only thing sensational about the Classic III, is it's price. Perhaps your VPI HW-19 didn't sound as good because you used an outboard motor According to "new" VPI theory, on-board would sound better - sarcasm intened. BTW, all three arms you used are not as good as VPI's own, so comparison was not a neutral one. Original Classic also used an all acrylic platter, which is clearly inferior to HW-19 MK-IV composite acrylic/led/cork (replaced by a proper platter later on, as additional expensive option, of course)

You have to remember, that some of us are still living in the real world, where $6K is a lot of dow, especially in today's financial climate, so to call an old dog in new clothes with a price tag of a good used car "sensational" - not sure... But you derive pleasure out of it - good for you

[twitch54]

Well, I had the Scout and now an older TNT, and before the SDS, the speed was fine...again, since these are belt driven and the belt is long, speed does vary over time as the weather gets warmer or colder...the belt expands/retracts, etc...but it was not an issue for me....

Ditto to what Tuan said, an Aries III guy here, with that being said I have the SDS along with Super Platter, Perf ring and Black Diamond clamp, all assembled for less than $7200, I doubt very much if the Classic III will better it.

[Wayner]

I like the Classic III because of the arm, and mass of the plinth. I'm sure the mass will kill any vibration born motor noise, and the arm has VTA on the fly. If I were to buy another VPI, this may be the one I would buy.

I like it because of the platter mass, the plinth weight and the arm. I have a HW-19jr. and it is hoe-hum. It also has an AudioQuest PT-6 tonearm and while not a POS, it is not as revealing as even my Technics SL1200MKII. It is quiet, however.

If I were to design a table, it would be very close to the classic III, in my book they did everything right. At 2.2x the classic's price, as John pointed out, there is probably not going to be 2.2X better enjoyment. But I think everyone here knows that things just don't work that way.

It's great a American jewel, and I suspect as it ages, it will age gracefully, as has my Empire (which I am listening to as I type). As I look across the rest of the VPI lineup, considering features and cost, and assuming I had 5K+ to spend on this goofy hobby, this probably would be the one.

Wayner 

[orthobiz]

Marknoir,

I had an HW-19 MkIII.

I use the same periphery ring, it's set up in the same system used by the same user (me) and I can categorically tell you that the Classic trounces the HW-19 setup. The HW-19 I'd even rate as fair only until the SDS was paired with it.

John

Hey John, your old deck hardly knows you anymore! Still spinning strong.

Paul

[Wayner]

As with the Empire's massive platter, it's simply a matter of physics, killing any attempt at having speed fluctuations. It simply sounds like a DD table. So you can understand my thrill to see a table with a 25 pound platter!

I'm too busy (and too broke) to pick this thing up, and if I did come to my senses, I'd probably get the Classic, just because of the cost. But when you find a deck that has all the features that seem to fit your thinking, and considering the last time I bought a new turntable (that was a classic), what the hell. I've kicked my self in the ass for being a cheapskate a couple of times before. Marknoir, yes the thing is overpriced. But, I'll bet it's fun paired up with the right MM.

More dribble.

Wayner 

[95Dyna]

That's my Classic I on steroids.  The Classic I is so good I can't imagine this one.  Maybe it would be cheaper to buy the Classic I and give it a couple injections  .