Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.

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Guy 13

Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.
« on: 24 Sep 2010, 09:00 am »

Hi all Audio Circle members.
Here it is: Phase Two of my GR Research V-1 / V-2 side by side evaluation.
The match V-1 vs V-2
 :duel:
 The long awaited test…
(Phase three will be done after New Year or when my speakers have 100 hours burn in - which ever comes first.)
I did follow a few recommendations from Danny and AC members.
I have now a little more than 6 feet behind the speakers, I have adjusted the toe in and I am sitting in line with the coaxial driver.
I’ve played various type of music from jazz, vocal, classical, drums, reggae, solo guitar and finally :
Chesky audio frequency test CD.
My Niteshade Audio amplifier model : NS-15 (10wpc) volume control was set at 11 o’clock (About 5 wpc) and I’ve used a switch box to switch rapidly between A and B speakers, so I could hear right away the difference between the two speakers.
For the V-1 :
The highs are clear naturals and include the studio reverberation from the recording.
The mids are very present, live like.
The bass is natural, but lack some depth. (Probably because all the controls on the Rythmik A370PEQ were not set properly or needed to be set according to the room acoustic. (I will do that during the next listening session.)
For the V-2 :
The highs are a little muffled or veiled in comparison with the V-1, but for me, just a little.
Still clear but not as present as the V-1.
The mids are soft, none aggressive, but not as natural as the V-1.
Chesky test CD with the low 30 Hz can hardly be heard with the V-1 while the V-2 did reproduce adequately the low frequency.
Strong – weak points :
V-1
Good at vocal and solo instrumentals.
Natural, presence and clarity.
Bass is natural and tight, but does not go low enough or lack deepness.
V-2
Deep natural bass and of course, goes lower, much lower.
The lower price of the V-2 is also his strong point.
My conclusion ! Which one is better ?
Well both, each one as his own strong points.
For voice and instrumentals = V-1
For deep bass and none aggressiveness = V-2
Now, which one I prefer ?
The V-2, because of the deep bass and the soft mids and highs and also, because of the soft price.
(All those points are very important to me.)
If a hybrid V-1/V-2 existed with clarity and deep bass, I would go for the hybrid.
That’s it.
Those are my prior to 100 hours burn in conclusions.
No looser, both winner in different category.
Because of the lower price of the V-2 I would probably recommend the V-2 for the audiophile on a budget.
Of course many of you won’t agree with my findings and conclusions, but that the purpose of Audio Circle :
Audio freedom of opinion !
Audio Circle members, start making waves…
Guy 13.
Note : I know, the egg foam does not do anything !








 

Wind Chaser

Re: Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.
« Reply #1 on: 24 Sep 2010, 11:15 am »
Isn't there a crossover between the tweeter and the mid band driver?  From what I can see there's just a cap, and I thought there was more to it than that??

Guy 13

Re: Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.
« Reply #2 on: 24 Sep 2010, 12:05 pm »
Isn't there a crossover between the tweeter and the mid band driver?  From what I can see there's just a cap, and I thought there was more to it than that??
Hi Wind Chaser.
Yes there is more than just a capacitor between the tweeter and the mid band diver. (By the way, what you see on the tweeter termonals is not a capacitor, but a resistor.)
Danny would not sell a V-2 with only a capacitor as a crossover. You should know that Danny's middle name is : Mr. Crossover...
The GR Research crossover is at the bottom of the V-2 beside the SA-1 plate amplifier.



Any more questions ?
Guy 13.

PDR

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Re: Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.
« Reply #3 on: 24 Sep 2010, 02:51 pm »
Guy...
The V2 goes lower?......I would of assumed with the servo system the V1 would of had the edge.
My servos can throw a punch...I have had drummers listen and say its like the kit is in the same room. Are you sure the V1 is wired correctly?


Guy 13

Re: Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.
« Reply #4 on: 24 Sep 2010, 02:57 pm »
Guy...
The V2 goes lower?......I would of assumed with the servo system the V1 would of had the edge.
My servos can throw a punch...I have had drummers listen and say its like the kit is in the same room. Are you sure the V1 is wired correctly?
Hi.
I have already checked two times the wiring of my V-1, but after the poor bass result I had, I will check again.
If the V-1 could have the same bass as the V-2, then I will say the V-1 is the winner.
Stay tune.
Guy 13.

Danny Richie

Re: Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.
« Reply #5 on: 24 Sep 2010, 03:09 pm »
If the V-1 isn't playing as low as the V-2 then you still have a problem with the V-1.

The V-2 should hit a -3db down in the mid 20's at best. The V-1 will easily hit a -3db in the teens and is flat to 20Hz.

The V-1 bass should also give you about 10db more output then the V-2.

Bass response on the V-1 should also be much faster, tighter, and cleaner...


Wind Chaser

Re: Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.
« Reply #6 on: 24 Sep 2010, 03:20 pm »
Danny would not sell a V-2 with only a capacitor as a crossover. You should know that Danny's middle name is : Mr. Crossover...

I didn't realize it was hidden, but your right about Danny.  That's why it would be so shocking if it was only a cap.

As much as I'd like to buy these speakers... and as much as I know there isn't any likelyhood of anything at all being close to them without having to spend several thousand dollars, they just aren't suitable for my room.  I got rid of something less than half the size because they were in my way all the time.  It's really too bad, because I know this is the speaker that would offer the type of performance I'm looking for. 

Danny Richie

Re: Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.
« Reply #7 on: 24 Sep 2010, 03:24 pm »
Quote
I didn't realize it was hidden, but your right about Danny.  That's why it would be so shocking if it was only a cap.

What you are seeing is a shunt resistor. It is the last thing in the tweeter circuit. Mounting it on the tweeter makes it real easy to adjust the value if needed verses mounting it in the crossover board.

Guy 13

Re: Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.
« Reply #8 on: 24 Sep 2010, 03:26 pm »
I didn't realize it was hidden, but your right about Danny.  That's why it would be so shocking if it was only a cap.

As much as I'd like to buy these speakers... and as much as I know there isn't any likelyhood of anything at all being close to them without having to spend several thousand dollars, they just aren't suitable for my room.  I got rid of something less than half the size because they were in my way all the time.  It's really too bad, because I know this is the speaker that would offer the type of performance I'm looking for.
Hi Wind Chaser.
How about buying from Danny a pair of N-3 and one or two Rythmik sealed servo 12" subwoofer ?
Guy 13.

drphoto

Re: Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.
« Reply #9 on: 24 Sep 2010, 04:28 pm »
Must be some wrong w/ the subwiring in the V1. There's several ways to get it wrong. See my other post on the issue.

TomS

Re: Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.
« Reply #10 on: 24 Sep 2010, 04:32 pm »
Must be some wrong w/ the subwiring in the V1. There's several ways to get it wrong. See my other post on the issue.
I agree.  Took me 2 tries to get it right.  You'll know when it is  :duh:

Wind Chaser

Re: Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.
« Reply #11 on: 24 Sep 2010, 04:37 pm »
Hi Wind Chaser.
How about buying from Danny a pair of N-3 and one or two Rythmik sealed servo 12" subwoofer ?
Guy 13.

I don't want anything less efficient than what I already have.
« Last Edit: 24 Sep 2010, 09:31 pm by Wind Chaser »

Tyson

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Re: Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.
« Reply #12 on: 24 Sep 2010, 06:42 pm »
Guy, what is your impression of the off-axis performance of both speakers?

Rclark

Re: Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.
« Reply #13 on: 24 Sep 2010, 10:12 pm »
Is it just me, those look like they're built wierd/missing stuff compared to the standard model pictures. Large baffle on the V2 also. And wheels? Those can't be helping things, no?

NeilT

Re: Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.
« Reply #14 on: 24 Sep 2010, 10:52 pm »
Thanks Guy, for taking the time to document and share your impressions.
Neil

Guy 13

Re: Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.
« Reply #15 on: 25 Sep 2010, 12:29 am »
I don't want anything less efficient than what I already have.
Hi Wind Chaser.
Got that and I agree with you.
I know, I have the V-1 (97db) and V-2 (93db)
both driven beaytifully by only a Niteshade Audio 10wpc amplifier.
Guy 13.

Guy 13

Re: Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.
« Reply #16 on: 25 Sep 2010, 12:35 am »
Thanks Guy, for taking the time to document and share your impressions.
Neil
Hi Neil.
Thanks for your nice words.
Very few Audio Circle members do what you did.
I hope in the future more members will post pictures like I do,
because like they say :
A pictures is worth a thousand words !
Can you  or other Audio Circle members tell me how to make my pictures smaller, I have noticed that they are way too big for my post.
Thanks again and have a nice week end.
Guy 13.

ebag4

Re: Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.
« Reply #17 on: 25 Sep 2010, 12:42 am »
Guy,
I typically open the pictures in Paint (standard on most/all Windows OSs under programs>accessories) go to image>stretch/skew> and reduce the size to 33% (this will be dependent on the resolution your camera is set at), then save the resulting pic as a jpeg.

Best,
Ed

jtwrace

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Re: Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.
« Reply #18 on: 25 Sep 2010, 12:45 am »
I use this free program http://pixresizer.en.softonic.com Works great!

PDR

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Re: Phase Two. The match (Side by side) V-1 vs V-2.
« Reply #19 on: 25 Sep 2010, 01:21 am »
Hey Guy.....I like your pics the way they are.....makes it much easier for us geezers  :wink:

Kind words......how about awesome,wow,and VERY COOL.

I am like you....I jump right in....dont care what anyone else thinks.
Have built a bunch of DIY kits in the last few yrs, living in northern Canada doesnt
leave much opportunity to audition designs like down in the larger centers of the States.
So I build and audition them in my own room. We have high end audio outlets here, and I
frequent them as much as I can, but I'm not spending 30k....besides, what i have at home is
usually as good or better......by the way, Thanks for that Danny.

Keep up the good work, can only imagine the work you have put in, and the obstacles
you have overcome being in Asia, and building not one but two sets of the Vs.

Perry