looks very interesting!

ratso · « **on:** 20 Sep 2010, 07:47 pm »

i am new to virtue audio (i have seen reviews before, but it never really clicked in my head until recently). now i find for the last few days, i have been magnetized to the website and thinking reeaaallll hard about them. i currently am "in between" systems - i am having a pair of salk HT2-TL's built. and so a few noob-to-virtue questions if i might.
i have a huge (really huge) room. actually, my house really doesn't have many walls at all - it is an open, loft style home. so i will need some power for my 88dB sensitive 4 ohm salks. salk recommends 100-250W for these. they can be bi-amped, so i am thinking the M451. i see it is rated at 87WPC when using the 30v/300W power supply, but i am having a difficult time finding this on the website - is this the antek? i see the 30v/130W listed? also, my plan is to get by temporarily with one sensation for now, and later get a second for biamping. i'm sure a lot of you out there have 88dB sensitive speakers, can i get some input on how well this amp would drive them? (BTW i will be using it as a poweramp, not as an integrated). also, i see on the website a few "known issues" with this amp that they say will be fixed in the future, has this/will this happen soon (although it's not a deal breaker - the issues seem like no big deal IMHO). finally i see the M901 is sold out, is that a temporary situation or are they gone for good? thanx in advance for the help

virtue · « **Reply #1 on:** 20 Sep 2010, 07:58 pm »

Hey Ratso,
Thanks for visiting! I would recommend trying an M451 with batteries! Return it if you don't like it - I'll waive restocking.
What I can say about the known issues associated mainly with the tube buffer, is that there are no easy fixes and it will take 6-12 months before new models are made. It took us 3 years to perfect the ONE/TWO and Sensation has only been on the market for around 7 months, and the buffer, for 3 months. The M901s coming will be made exactly the same way as those in stock.
Very best,
Seth

eclein · « **Reply #2 on:** 20 Sep 2010, 07:59 pm »

"ICEBlocks" if your budget allows would be fantastic I would think!!

PSB Guy · « **Reply #3 on:** 20 Sep 2010, 08:00 pm »

Here's the link to the JT Dynamic (30v/300w) power supply:
http://store.virtueaudio.com/category-s/81.htm
I've asked Jim Salk about the suitability of the Sensation with his Songtowers, which are also 4 ohm speakers, and he said they should get along well together. Since the HT2-TLs have similar specs, I think you'll be fine with the Sensation and the 30v/300w power supply.

Cornelis

ratso · « **Reply #4 on:** 20 Sep 2010, 08:09 pm »

thanx for the responses! i think i may be more than "visiting" seth - usually when i get interested in something it winds up in my living room sooner or later. i have gone the ice amp route in the past and do like them, but really have my eye on the sensations (although i know the ice amps put out a lot more power). i'm not so sure i want to go the full on battery route - i know it's not so much a hassle anymore but i'm still just leaning toward the "set it and forget it" power supply. am i correct that the output watts is solely based on the power supply (i.e. bigger supply = more watts?).

PSB Guy · « **Reply #5 on:** 20 Sep 2010, 08:19 pm »

Quote from: ratso on 20 Sep 2010, 08:09 pm

am i correct that the output watts is solely based on the power supply (i.e. bigger supply = more watts?).

Yes, up to a point. The Tripath chipset used in the Virtue amps has a maximum rated output of 87 watts into 4 ohms, which you will reach with either the 30v/300w JT Dynamic power supply or batteries. Everyone has an opinion on which is better.

Cornelis

ratso · « **Reply #6 on:** 20 Sep 2010, 10:10 pm »

hmm didn't realize the battery allowed you to reach full power, interesting. maybe i need to think a little more about them. one final question and then i will leave you guys alone - it's kinda hard to get your head around being able to upgrade your power supply and you get a bigger amp (if only all amps worked that way). is there drawbacks to pushing it to the limit - shortened life, sound quality, etc.

Zero · « **Reply #7 on:** 20 Sep 2010, 10:13 pm »

Ratso,

I hope I don't step on any toes by making this post but... How do you feel about noise ( like hums and hiss ) coming from your speakers? Because unless the power you have coming into your home is squeaky clean, that's exactly what you'll run into with the JT Dynamic power supply. It's unregulated, which means all the noise running through your power lines will go through the amp and directly to your speakers.

Now, if you have inefficient speakers / are sitting far away from them / don't give an earthly crap about noise - then its no biggy. If however, you think such a thing would bother you, I'd highly encourage you to take the battery route.

ratso · « **Reply #8 on:** 20 Sep 2010, 10:16 pm »

aha! and thanx much for that zero, that tilts things towards batteries a great deal.

eclein · « **Reply #9 on:** 20 Sep 2010, 10:24 pm »

I use a 30V/130W power supply with my TWO.2, the one's Seth has on the website and I get clean, plug and play power...I believe they work with the unit your considering. I'm like you in the "set it and forget it" category and I'm extremely happy with that power supply. FWIW

PSB Guy · « **Reply #10 on:** 20 Sep 2010, 11:00 pm »

Quote from: Zero on 20 Sep 2010, 10:13 pm

Ratso,

I hope I don't step on any toes by making this post but... How do you feel about noise ( like hums and hiss ) coming from your speakers? Because unless the power you have coming into your home is squeaky clean, that's exactly what you'll run into with the JT Dynamic power supply. It's unregulated, which means all the noise running through your power lines will go through the amp and directly to your speakers.

Now, if you have inefficient speakers / are sitting far away from them / don't give an earthly crap about noise - then its no biggy. If however, you think such a thing would bother you, I'd highly encourage you to take the battery route.

My toes are fine, we're all friends here

. I'm using the JT Dynamic power supply with my M901, my speakers are 88-89 dB sensitive, and I have absolutely no issues with noise. You have to be right up against the speaker to hear the faintest hiss. Now, I live in a fairly new neighbourhood (8 years old) with good, quiet power lines, but I don't use any fancy power filtering devices, just TrippLite surge protectors. YMMV of course. BTW, although I have no experience with them, it's been said here and elsewhere that batteries are DEAD quiet. One day I may try them if I can find a way to deter a climby little cat...
As for sound quality, the more power you give any of the Virtue amps, the better they will sound. Stepping up from the stock 24v/65w to the 30v/130w or the JT Dynamic is a dramatic improvement in bass output and control, dynamics, you name it. As for life expectancy of the amp, I don't think that's an issue as long as you don't feed it more volts than it's rated for, which I think is 30-32 max.
Hope I haven't muddied the waters, just trying to spell out your options...

Cornelis

Zero · « **Reply #11 on:** 20 Sep 2010, 11:37 pm »

PSB,

I envy your power grid.

That said, going from the stock laptop-esque power supply to the JT Dynamic power supply gave me a massive boost in sound quality. I akin it to going from a 320kbps Mp3 to the CD itself. I'd imagine that the batteries will deliver the same kind of performance, sans all noise! Will report back once I have a chance to take em' for a spin.

ratso · « **Reply #12 on:** 20 Sep 2010, 11:53 pm »

thanx guys! you have laid it all out as clear as day for me, hope some other noob to virtue sees this thread and gets the same help i have gotten today! with around a 45% jump in power over the 30v/130w power supply (55wpc) it looks like i will have to choose between a battery system or the 30v/300w supply (87wpc). that's just too much power to give up and i think i may need it in my room. i will probably wind up just getting one and if it doesn't work out, turn it back in for the other. thanx again!

eclein · « **Reply #13 on:** 21 Sep 2010, 12:16 am »

ratso--Enjoy your soon to be awesome setup!!!! Let us know how you make out..

ratso · « **Reply #14 on:** 21 Sep 2010, 01:30 am »

i will. now for the most important part - what color? i'm gonna do yellow. but the white is nice... or maybe...

eclein · « **Reply #15 on:** 21 Sep 2010, 01:52 am »

Just to give you and idea on color, Mesa(Yellow)/Columns/Cherry top

ratso · « **Reply #16 on:** 21 Sep 2010, 03:27 am »

ohhhh yeahhhhh

Mama Virtue · « **Reply #17 on:** 21 Sep 2010, 04:53 am »

2 things.
1. 30V MAX on any of our amps, anymore and its out of warranty if you

it. there isn't really 30-32V leniency (Seth can correct me if I'm wrong)...

2. Ratso, def. go with COLOR!!! check out the gorgeous gear thread (probably last updated Sept 8th or so) under the Virtue Circle, lots of combos listed. We are getting low on yellow sides so if you choose yellow do so in the next couple weeks, not sure when they will be gone and when we will get more in. I personally like the red-brick combo either silver or black, keep in mind it's a little more orangey then red red (like the difference between a fire-engine and tomato...its closer to a tomato

).

Either way, PM me if you have questions, if I can't answer them I'll forward to Jason (JT Supply) or Seth!

Cami

virtue · « **Reply #18 on:** 21 Sep 2010, 08:01 am »

Hey Ratso,
Definitely don't exceed 30v. Sensation is no slouch but if power is decisive, choose another amp!
The Dodd battery pack is really a set-and-forget option. Ugly but good for 4-5 years before cell replacement. We had one bad charger go out last week but otherwise, nothing but praise for that guy. The JT is fantastic but fully half of customers are concerned with hiss/etc. We're playing Varsity here and that comes with the territory.
Seth

Mattyboy · « **Reply #19 on:** 21 Sep 2010, 07:06 pm »

Quote from: eclein on 21 Sep 2010, 01:52 am

Just to give you and idea on color, Mesa(Yellow)/Columns/Cherry top

A fourplay fan huh?

Sweeeeeet 'n' fon K