[Stuartbranson]

Does anyone weigh down their speakers?  I have mine on 24" sand filled Atlantis Reference XL stands.  Thought of trying the Aurios trick between stands and the speakers(worked well for another set of speakers), cones or putting about 20lbs on the top of the speakers.
Nothing is too bad (in fact it sounds really good)but just looking for a bit more resolution especially in the bass.(probably my room)
Rest of the gear is a Vaic 15w SET integrated and a Copland CDA-289 in Daruma isolators.

[mcrespo71]

I have not weighed mine down at all.  I have tried BDR, blu tak, and vibrapods b/t the speakers and the stands.

Michael

[Stuartbranson]

Did anything work out best in the end?

My stands have a kind of sticky pad at the corners to anchor the speakers.  I imagine they act like blu-tak.

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?action=systems;system=255

[mcrespo71]

They each have their pros and cons.  The cones were the most detailed, but could get strident in my room.  Blu tak is pretty neutra and vibrapods bring out the midrange and smooth out the highs in my room, but at the expense of some tautness to the bass.

Michael

[moray james]

Does anyone weigh down their speakers?  I have mine on 24" sand filled Atlantis Reference XL stands.  Thought of trying the Aurios trick between stands and the speakers(worked well for another set of speakers), cones or putting about 20lbs on the top of the speakers.
Nothing is too bad (in fact it sounds really good)but just looking for a bit more resolution especially in the bass.(probably my room)
Rest of the gear is a Vaic 15w SET integrated and a Copland CDA-289 in Daruma isolators.

   You can increase the massloading of your speaker/stand system by a significant precent for almost no cost. You will also make the performance and adjustment of your speaker/stand much easier to do at the same time.
   No this is not a mass multipier scam but it is as close to free extra mass as you will ever come and your system will be the betterr for the change! Find a buddy with a drill who also owns a 1/4 - 20 tap and die set. Drill a single hole in the middle of the back edge of your stand about 1/2 inch in from the edge. Cut a 1/4 - 20  therad in each of these two holes. Now mount three of your threaded spikes into the new 3  hole set. Now your speaker stand has only three spikes and the mass load per spike has been greatly increased over the previous distribution of four spikes. Now your stand is sitting upon a fully and unconditionally stable tripod. You only ever need to adjust two spikes for perfect full stand adjustment. The spike at the rear adjusts for and aft tilt while only one of the front spikes needs to be adjusted to set left to right tilt. Now experiment with ceramic or such cone devices (three per speaker bass) and have some fun. Please post to inform others of your findings. Best regards Moray James.

[Stuartbranson]

Hi Moray James.

Thanks for the tip.  My stands are already in  a tripod design for the spikes.  I guess the manufacturer knows about this.

I don't have any extra isolation devices right now so I was asking around to see what tweaks others have used on or under their speakers.  

Thanks.

[John Casler]

Although I haven't tried it with the De Capos (I should I'm a dealer ) I certainly have been mass loading speakers for over 20 years.

Over the years, many devices have been marketed:

Bags of sand
Bags of shot
Magic Bricks

etc, etc,

But the absolute best thing I have found is rubber coated weights.  These are available in both "plate" form and "dumbbell" form.

While maybe not the most attractive solution they do the best job because the rubber mechanically couples to any surface without marring it and the thin coat of rubber also acts as a damping agent while the actual weight itself adds mass.

These can be placed on top of speakers and the difference in many cases is astounding.

since the top of the speaker sitting on top of a stand is the area most likely to move (similar to the top of a tall building in an earthquake) the mass at the top causes the greatest improvment.

I have over 45# sitting attop my 626Rs and over 180# on top of my sub.  I have "tight bass" to die for!!!

So to answer your question, play some "bass heavy" cuts at a very loud level.  Feel the speaker and cabinet.  It they are vibrating then "mass loading" can certainly help.

Just my 2 cents

[Stuartbranson]

So to answer your question, play some "bass heavy" cuts at a very loud level. Feel the speaker and cabinet. It they are vibrating then "mass loading" can certainly help.
...

Tried it out and remarkably there was little vibration.  Granted they weren't cranked or anything.

Is your sub a ported design or sealed?  I can see weights helping a sealed design more but maybe my logic is not logic.

I'll try it out.

[Stuartbranson]

Well I did two things.  First I raised my speakers onto patio stones (home Depot cement variety) to raise them to about 26".  I was slouching one day and notice that the "size" of the music or soundstage or performers seem more life-like.   Then I added two more large patio stones, weighing, I would guess about, 40lbs total(per pair), on top of my speakers.  Then I tried a tripod config. of those rubber and cork isolators between speakers and stands.  I took out the rubber/cork thingys until I get a fourth as I am terrified of coming home and seeing a broken mess on the floor.  The mass loading has definitely seemed to "add" bass to the sound.  Much clearer and defined.  I do wonder if it is a product of the cement base as opposed to being on the floor but as usual I change a few things at once and thus lose sight of each manoeuver's effects.  Sounds great though so...  Though the big bricks don't really look great, my wife doesn't mind too much for now.

[John Casler]

So to answer your question, play some "bass heavy" cuts at a very loud level. Feel the speaker and cabinet. It they are vibrating then "mass loading" can certainly help.
...

Tried it out and remarkably there was little vibration.  Granted they weren't cranked or anything.

Is your sub a ported design or sealed?  I can see weights helping a sealed design more but maybe my logic is not logic.

I'll try it out.

Hi Stuart,

My sub is a VMPS Larger with 12" and 15" drivers and a 15" slot loaded Passive radiator.

The primary purpose of "mass laoding" is to negate "reactive" forces of the woofer cones "pushing against" the air, and to also defeat their inertial reactions as they start their excursion and reach the end of it.

Much like firing a canon in a canoe is not as effective as firing it from a battleship, which has more mass.

If as a woofer starts to push air, the cabinet moves in the opposite direction, the leading edge of the bass wave is "softened".  If at the end of that excursion, the cabinet moves forward, the bass note, "hangs" and this causes wooliness.

As mentioned, the mass will also in many cases help qualm cabinet vibration also, but the primary purpose is to increase mass.

[Stuartbranson]

Much like firing a canon in a canoe is not as effective as firing it from a battleship, which has more mass...

Love the analogy.  Makes perfect sense to a Canadian!

[Stuartbranson]

Well, if anyone cares, I took the weight off the speakers.  At first there was an illusion of tighter bass but what I think was really going on was a mid-bass dampening that happened to correspond to some room problems I have.  Kinda like a low tech EQ.  Anyway, the EQ'ing extended a bit high in freq and, as my friend put it, "kinda sucks some of the life out of it."  
Interesting, those moments when you try something then when you go back, you realize how good it originally is.  
I did end up putting them on those cork and rubber isolators on a patio stone.  The latter adding a couple inches and some weight on the stands (which are filled with sand anyway) and the height difference has created a "larger" soundstage in that I don't feel that I am looking "down" on the performance, as if in a balcony but rather from the floor seats.  More realistic and extremely enjoyable overall.  Love these speakers.

[brucegel]

I know I must sound like a broken record or a scratched cd but it never makes sense to twiddle with things like mass loading when a designer/engineer didnt do that in the first place.Better yet if you did improve a speaker this way then the design is flawed or the design is unfinished.When I bought the decapo i I bought a finished speaker.It was tuned sans any additional weighty objects.Its the other components that arent synergizing or more likely the room itself and there are now a billion ways to diy or purchase products to amelliorate your room anomalies.

[Stuartbranson]

I know I must sound like a broken record or a scratched cd but it never makes sense to twiddle with things like mass loading when a designer/engineer didnt do that in the first place.Better yet if you did improve a speaker this way then the design is flawed or the design is unfinished.

Yeah, I know and  I completely agree.  But then again, people alter the wiring internally etc. so maybe the speaker is as intended at it's budgetted design but it's not the end of the 3A line.  Anyway, just thought I'd try it for myself and partially so, to try to compensate for some room problems.  I am a renter so I cannot alter much and it's our living room so...   Maybe I will just try re-arranging the room..
BTW, the patio stone is under the speakers not on them.

[brucegel]

Not to worry stuart ...there are plenty of low cost solutions for portable sound control.Check out the auralex line of products.You could buy the foam panels and slap it onto sound proofing sheets and make some leg supports and move them about the room at will.I do that when I isolate instruments for recording sessions.