[vpolineni]

I already have an eighth nerve room pack, but I wanted to buy some acoustic foam for my listening room.  I noticed some posts recommending this:
http://www.foambymail.com/Eggcrate.html

I can get 2.5" thick foam that is 72" x 80" for 42 bucks.  I'm thinking of buying 2 of these... for my front and rear walls.  is this too much foam???

[warnerwh]

Here's another good place. These guys will cut it any way you want it to within 1/8". Prices are great and although they don't advertise it I couldn't get it to burn. You want the 2 7/8" thick stuff.
http://www.foamorder.com/products.cgi?cart=b0W0t0n29193142221n6A2c1Z&item=acoustic

[vpolineni]

I think foambymail.com is cheaper.. and 2.5" should be thick enough.  My question is if 72" x 80" is too much... and I'm thinking of getting two for my front and rear walls... any thoughts?

[warnerwh]

I've done most of the LEDE which I think is a good idea and so do alot of other people. Brian at VMPS has his room set up this way too. You want to remove all the reflections from one end but not the other. This is usually best done behind your system.  Leave the other end reflective. Some people buy/make things to make them even more reflective behind them. Also I'd go with the thicker foam as it will work to lower frequencies.  Minimum recommended is usually 3" for this.  You'll be pleased when you are done.  All the sound and imaging are far better.  Without good room treatment people are missing a large part of what their systems are capable of.  If you can do at least the wall behind your system with acoustic foam you'll find it's money well spent.  Much more than upgrading any electronic components or cables could ever think of being.

[warnerwh]

Just found this on Ebay. 96 square feet for 170 dollars of 3" foam.  That would be about 10' x 10'.  Get less foam if the money is a problem and get more later. That's what I did. Once you add it you'll want more. I've ended up spending at least 5-600 on just foam.  Built a JR bass trap and that ended up costing at least another 50 bucks.  For the money it is an excellent upgrade. Next to your speakers you room is the most important component. And  your system is only as good as your weakest link.

[nathanm]

Too much foam? Never!  The two big pieces will help, but you will probably have better results if you evenly distribute smaller sections of it on the walls instead of having one huge slab.  (like in a checkerboard pattern)  But obviously a big chunk is easier to install.

[vpolineni]

nathan,
  according to the website, each large section will be shipped in 2 pieces, so that should be 4 pieces total.  Warner, are you suggesting to put the foam on one of the walls but not the other?  so the wall in front of me (behind the speakers) but the wall behind me wouldn't have it?  The wall behind me is cut in half because half of it is a sliding door that opens into the deck.  by the way, what does LEDE stand for?  thanks for the input... any more suggestions would be much appreciated.

[markC]

I have found that the LEDE system works quite well, (with bass traps also), But if I had patio doors behind my listening area, I would be inclined to hang a hunk of foam on them if I could get away with it.

[vpolineni]

mark, I have blinds which cover the door itself.. it probably does a good job of reflecting... so that should maintain the principle of lede... in that case maybe I shouldn't put foam on the other side of the rear wall right next to the door so the entire rear wall is reflective and entirely cover the front wall... does that make sense?

[warnerwh]

LEDE stands for Live End Dead End. You only want to put the foam on the wall behind your system.  Completely covered, the other post is incorrect saying to checker it.  This is the way many recording studios and some of the best audio/home theater systems are done.  If you can get away with it and afford it you'll be glad you did. You can put it up with some 3M spray adhesive.  Do a google on Live End Dead End. There's lots of info. A very common and successful way to treat a room.
 
Brian at VMPS says to cover both walls and the ceiling one third of the way into the room also.  There's an article on his website called something like a good acoustical environment. I've only done two feet of the wall and ceiling and the other end is open.  These little bits of treatment that many people do will certainly help but if you do the wall behind your system you won't be able to go back to doing a little bit.  Be sure to use the 3" or thicker foam.  Was going to say if you don't like it you can sell the foam on Ebay easy enough but once you hear your system with a well treated room nobody is going to talk you into taking it down anyway.

[bubba966]

But obviously a big chuck is easier to install.

So Nathan, how does one install a big chuck? And why is a big chuck easier to install than a small chuck?

I would think that for a big chuck you'd need more expanding foam & cable ties...

[Dan Banquer]

I hope you guys listen to warnerwh, and Brian Cheney. They are both right on the money.
The thicker the foam the more extended the lower frequency absorption becomes. 2.5 to 3.0 inches should do it for most applications.
If you apply the LEDE to your system don't be surprised if some of those room tuning cables you bought are no longer needed.
               d.b.

[nathanm]

Completely covered, the other post is incorrect saying to checker it.

I'm talking about IF you don't have enough foam to go Full Ass LEDE then you will be further ahead by spreading it around than having one solid section in one area of the wall.  Without knowing the guy's room size I have no idea if the 72" x 80" sections will be enough to fully cover up an entire wall and part of the sides.  But a checker pattern of 1'x1' squares covering a greater swath of wall will be catching more reflections than if they're all butted together.  This is what I have noticed in my own room.  When I had all the foam butted together I was still getting pingy slap echoes, (hand clap test) but when I checkered it I got less echoes.  Yes of course doing the whole thing is preferable, but if you cannot afford all the foam in one go then a spaced arrangement of 1x1' or 2x2' squares will be preferable.

(thanks for watching out for me, Bubba!  I have fixed the typo! )

[nathanm]

The BBC did an interesting study and found that you reap up to 4 times the acoustic absorption if you spread your absorbent material evenly around a room instead of putting it all on just one wall or ceiling. Just how you spread the material around is based largely on what appearance you desire, so come up with a treatment scheme you enjoy the looks and sound of. Another added plus to spreading your acoustical foam around is that you get some extra (beneficial) sound diffusion off the exposed panel edges of the panels.

From:
http://www.auralex.com/acoustics_introduction/acoustics_introduction.asp

[vpolineni]

Without knowing the guy's room size I have no idea if the 72" x 80" sections will be enough to fully cover up an entire wall and part of the sides.

I forgot to mention that.  My room is 15' x 21' with the wall to be covered being 21'.  I think that for fifty dollars, I could cover 85-90% of the wall with 2.5" thick foam... either that or i'll spend 82 bucks and have 2 sections of 72" x 80"... this way, I can cover the entire wall and part of the ceiling....

[Tim S]

I have a couple of questions about actually installing the foam. I saw that the spray adhesive is generally recommended. How easily does the foam come off once installed? That is, how much does having this on your wall eventually destroy it? I'm asking because I may be putting some into a room but I doubt I will stay in the house for too many more years so I'm curious how it will be taking it back down. Also, is there a reasonable alternative to actually attaching the foam to the wall?

Tim

[Tim S]

While I'm at it, I'll ask another question. Anyone tried the different types of configurations from http://www.foambymail.com/ ? They have egg, wegde, pyramid and tiles. Any comments on which ones perform best and if the pricier ones are worth the difference?

Tim

[nathanm]

My foam is held up with a single T-pin per 2x2' square.  It does make a small hole in the drywall but I figured this would be less objectionable than adhesives, which will probably destroy a painted wall or leave sticky residue. I think mounting it to a board and standing it against the wall would be the least intrusive but that'll of course cost more.

In my pic the smaller wedge count stuff on the back wall is Auralex while the coarser wedge count side wall pieces are Foambymail.com foam.  It's cheaper, but the cutting tolerances are sloppy.

There might be some slight measured differences between the different cut patterns, but personaly I just use wedges cause eggcrate looks kinda hokey.  I think any one of them will work well.

[John Casler]

In acoustically treating "reflected sound" the most important are points of "first reflection"

However, my preference is more to the LEDE also and I even treat some of the Live End too.  Corners, back walls and such

I seriously recomend a minimum of 3" wedge, and preferably "double" that for the first reflection points.

I also suggest that you treat the front wall minimally to a 6' x 5' "Sonic Projection Screen" of at least 3-6". (double layer)

Most don't realize that acoustic foam is much more "transparent" than you think.  It is so tranparent that it will allow you to operate an IR remote control through a single 3" wedge sheet of it.

It is so transparent that if you put it right in front of your speaker, you will be amazed at what still comes through.

I mount the foam like Natham suggest with either t-pins or long map pins

I like the wedge best and it is also easier to cut, if you have to make sizes.  If you do have to cut your foam the only thing that will work is a bread Knife or electric knife using a gently serrated blade.  Anything else and "frogetaboudit"

You can also mount one sheet of 3" foam and then mount another sheet over it for even better results.  I have often used a "criss cross" pattern when doing this to great effect.

There are "many" ways to use the foam for walls, corners, ceilings, and floors.  If you have your equipment (gear) setting on the floor in front of you, it is highly reflective.  Try taking a 24" x 48" x 3" panel and turn it on its side.  Shape it into a mild semicircle (just enough so you can stand it up in front of the equipment during the session.

More Blackness!

Blackness in sound, is like the "black levels" of video.  It makes everything more clear and defined.

Reflective sound is like "video snow" and it blurs and softens the sonic image.  Just like in video, it "washes" it out.

PRICING!!!!!

I have a place that I can point you to "individually" that has Foam by Mail quality, at LOWER prices.  It is a wholesale site and the URL cannot be given out over the web, or else they'll change it.  I can't make any money by selling small amounts of it so I am only happy to give it to you, as long as it is never posted to the web.

Do not PM me for the address.  E-mail me only!!

This, as you have all heard many, many times, is the cheapest and most significant "upgrade" you can do "IF" you do it well.

It will make more difference in your "sweet seat" sound, for a couple hundred bucks, than a $6000 amp!!! (assuming you already have a $3000 amp)

Have fun!

[vpolineni]

John, check your email   .