[Ryanz]

Here's something to support my thesis on the American public preferring "warm" sound.

Stereophile just published the results of their poll on warmness/brightness. Here it is on short:

Do you think most high-end audio equipment is too bright-sounding?
Brighter than the sun:  4%
Generally too bright:  20%
Often too bright:  45%
Mostly just about right:  21%
Not bright enough:  4%
Most is downright dull:  4%

As you can notice, 69% of Stereophile public (which I assume is north-american) complain about "brightness" and would want even warmer setups than those currently available.

(Good old Napalm is in the 4% that answered "most is downright dull").

Is the equipment at fault or the public's taste? This comment answers it nicely:

"[...]live amplified is always too bright for me."

It basically says that the average american "audiophile" wants in his stereo system a neutered sound that's warm and mellow compared to the real thing.

Bryston doesn't do that so you will find those 69% dissing it.

And my dealer proved to be very accurate in his assessment. He said 70% prefer warm sound which is so close to the 69% result of the poll.

Nap.

I wonder why the majority of "audiophiles" prefer a warmer sound. This seems contradictive to me.  Any ideas?   

[Napalm]

Dunno. Maybe just because most of them are older guys that grew up with that sound. Maybe because it's less aggressive and works well for soft ambient music. Maybe because in their circles it is fashionable to like "warm" and dismiss "bright" as poor taste.

However it's exactly the same folks that also complain about not being able to clearly understand dialogues through their muffled muddy warm "good taste" HT setup.

Nap. 

[Ryanz]

However it's exactly the same folks that also complain about not being able to clearly understand dialogues through their muffled muddy warm "good taste" HT setup.

Nap. 

[vegasdave]

Yeah, I'm glad Bryston doesn't do the "warm" sound. Which is colored and not accurate to the source.

As far as other audiophiles not liking it. The Hell with them. You can't please everyone, right?

[werd]

People tend to lean towards warmer sounding stereos because its a counter or bandaid to lousy digital front end. Or maybe not a well thought out system using a digital front end. I said this over on the Salk board that the source is debatably the most important piece and that SF pole supports that.

That posted pole demonstrates that people do not take their frontend as seriousily as they should, because if they did the whole bandaid or neutralizing the digital playback would not be necessary. Meaning they prefer a warmer sounding soundstage. The source drives the whole sound and if its bad or not thought out it turns into a bandaid job fixing the  over-energized high freq hash with warmer sounding gear.

The BCD is excellent since it doesnt cater to a warm sound but is very controlled in keeping the cd nasties from being amplified. Its an excellent front end. But imo using wrong cabling with amp and speakers, also absence of decent AC (system dependent) can still make it sound bright. But ultimately it is not the fault of the BCD.

[Ryanz]

The BCD is excellent since it doesnt cater to a warm sound but is very controlled in keeping the cd nasties from being amplified. Its an excellent front end. But imo using wrong cabling with amp and speakers, also absence of decent AC (system dependent) can still make it sound bright. But ultimately it is not the fault of the BCD.

How about the BDA?

[Napalm]

The ultimate cure to stereo "brightness":

Go to the nearest musical instruments shop and "test" the cymbals they have. Kick them hard then go home with your ears still ringing and check if your stereo is still "bright". If not satisfied, repeat with brass wind instruments.

Nap. 

[werd]

How about the BDA?

The BDA is fricken powerhouse as a dac for the frontend. Its part 2 of the front end but is still very dependent on the source transport. The BDA will not fix a lousy transport if its being fed noise or a blahzay signal. But the BDA is really nice in keeping its own noise out of the way and with a good power cord its almost silent as far as noise is concerned. It will not present itself as bright but it can if its just placed anywhere or plugged into anything.

For me this what i have been concentrating on in system building for the last 15 years.
Lousy digital wrecks it for me and it doesnt matter what speakers i use, if the front end sucks its unlistenable , waist fo money actually. Would never turn the system on.

[Elizabeth]

Comment on Harmon 'trickle' tech... The previous owners of Levinson left over disagreements about Harmon sticking a crap rebadged Harmon amp (that skinny one channel thing that used to be a Marantz junkheap) into the Levinson line.
So it is the OPPOSITE effect. Harman is watering down the Levinson brand, to sell crap to brand suckers. The prior owners/advisors quit to protest the distruction of a once famous brand.
Also, I read all eight pages of the Canuck posts. The pro/con for Bryston was pretty even. With little complaint about newer Bryston amps, and the naysayers all were dissing older Bryston amps, or saying they preferred another brand (which they seem to prefer as being more 'musical'...ie:pleasantly colored sounding.
The discussion about quality, or price performance was equally interesting. The discussion about why so many, well they do last a long time, and folks who own them buy new ones, and  the used buy and sell. So it makes sense as why so many are out there for sale (especially IN Canada!!)
Another point to make is that Bryston uses the same system for the amps. So a very old model beginning with 4 and the evolution into 4B 4BST.. 4B-SST2 so when one reads about an amp, it can be a variety of model with nearly the same designation. Most amp makers change the model name system  enough to make a break with older models. Or, the company folds, or is bought by another company..

[werd]

The ultimate cure to stereo "brightness":

Go to the nearest musical instruments shop and "test" the cymbals they have. Kick them hard then go home with your ears still ringing and check if your stereo is still "bright". If not satisfied, repeat with brass wind instruments.

Nap. 

Actually a good idea. Lets you hear high freq energy without digital aritifacting.

[vegasdave]

The ultimate cure to stereo "brightness":

Go to the nearest musical instruments shop and "test" the cymbals they have. Kick them hard then go home with your ears still ringing and check if your stereo is still "bright". If not satisfied, repeat with brass wind instruments.

Nap. 

Ya know, I couldn't have said it better myself. Good one!

[rob80b]

The ultimate cure to stereo "brightness":

Go to the nearest musical instruments shop and "test" the cymbals they have. Kick them hard then go home with your ears still ringing and check if your stereo is still "bright". If not satisfied, repeat with brass wind instruments.

Nap. 

Better still, how many could actual tolerate a live band in their living room for more than 10 seconds.

Robert

[Elizabeth]

"tolerate a live band" i assume you mean a band with amplification?
A small group of acoustic instruments would be fine.
A classical string quartet would be great. A solo piano too.
A trumpeter might be a little too loud, and amped guitars... no way.

[rob80b]

"tolerate a live band" i assume you mean a band with amplification?
A small group of acoustic instruments would be fine.
A classical string quartet would be great. A solo piano too.
A trumpeter might be a little too loud, and amped guitars... no way.

My point exactly, although a live string quartet can be quite reviviting in a small space.
Using Bryston amplification can give us a pretty clear picture into a recorded presentation which my be one reason they get a bad rap in some circles.
The whole point in pursuing this hobby, at least for me, is getting as close as possible to reproducing a live performance or as close as possible to the original event be it a studio or live venue and your hand on the dial should be the only limiting factor, but we're still not quite there yet.

Robert

[vegasdave]

Exactly.

[sfraser]

Better still, how many could actual tolerate a live band in their living room for more than 10 seconds.

Robert

it has not happened in a while. But the last time I had a live band in my living room (The Barstool Prophets) it sounded pretty good. Room mates moving out, room mates moving in, no furniture, .....great excuse for a party. Had to paint the walls afterward however,that was not so much fun.

[1oldguy]

Somethings aren't meant to be caged except your woman.

[vegasdave]

it has not happened in a while. But the last time I had a live band in my living room (The Barstool Prophets) it sounded pretty good. Room mates moving out, room mates moving in, no furniture, .....great excuse for a party. Had to paint the walls afterward however,that was not so much fun.

Cool! That must have been a blast!

[OwenMeany]

I've also seen the Bryston gear in reference systems of American reviewers.  You know how they list their associated equipment at the end of a review.  Sometimes Bryston appears in that list.  That's high praise.

So with that recommendation, I purchased a used 2bss2 and bp6 to basically home demo.  Loved it.  Bought a 4bsst2 new to replace the 2b. 

Another thing I really like about Bryston is that they really only have 1 line of amps with different power levels.  I mean a 2bsst2 is very close in design and performance to a 4bsst2, just less power.  With some other brands, the lower end amps are completely budget amp designs that sound nothing like the more expensive offerings.  Look at Musical Fidelity or Krell.  The Krell S3300i is nothing like the high end Krells.

That's what I did...as my first "real" amp I owned a 3BST in the mid 90's and in '00 I became a reviewer for Positive Feedback Online. After reviewing several amps and deciding I wanted to put together a "reference system" I searched out a review pair of the 28BSST2. James was very helpful as were all the guys I dealt with at Bryston.

Ultimately, for me it came down to a pair of Clayton M300 and the 28s with the Brystons winning out and I purchased the review sample.  I am very happy with them and have not even thought about a change in amplification since (I am working through tube preamps now).

Thanks, jtb


Great amp and sold company.

[vegasdave]

Very cool! Nice testimonial.