New Mac Mini -What format to rip cd's ?

Rclark · « **Reply #20 on:** 24 Jun 2010, 06:46 pm »

That's funny. I've always been able to tell a difference between compressed and cd. To me it's like the difference between a coke and a diet coke. But I've never tries lossless.

Still, other reasons I prefer the CD are aesthetic. I like having the disc, with the artwork and packaging. And all my discs are pristine and well kept. I also mostly buy used and with great success from Amazon. I'm about to go pick up Piper at the Gates of Dawn from my PO box, actually.

Yeah, in fact the CD player I'm buying will be single disc only. I like listening to albums and I only buy sure things or classics.

But who knows, it would be nice in the future to have the option of lossless compression, so maybe I'll give it a whirl. If it's good, I'll still buy CD but rip for listening. Maybe get a DAC, etc. But that's on down the line. I still need to order my N3. Very soon.

skunark · « **Reply #21 on:** 24 Jun 2010, 06:57 pm »

Quote from: Rclark on 24 Jun 2010, 06:46 pm

That's funny. I've always been able to tell a difference between compressed and cd. To me it's like the difference between a coke and a diet coke. But I've never tries lossless.

Still, other reasons I prefer the CD are aesthetic. I like having the disc, with the artwork and packaging. And all my discs are pristine and well kept. I also mostly buy used and with great success from Amazon. I'm about to go pick up Piper at the Gates of Dawn from my PO box, actually.

Yeah, in fact the CD player I'm buying will be single disc only. I like listening to albums and I only buy sure things or classics.

But who knows, it would be nice in the future to have the option of lossless compression, so maybe I'll give it a whirl. If it's good, I'll still buy CD but rip for listening. Maybe get a DAC, etc. But that's on down the line. I still need to order my N3. Very soon.

There are a lot more variables when using a computer or a music server and might take some additional time to iron out when compared to a CD, but the end goal is to send the exact same bits off of the CD to the DAC. Excluding any reading errors, difference in jitter/quality between devices, it should sound the same if one were to use the same DAC.

I think everyone here would agree that a lossy format like MP3s and AACs are inferior, but with the lossless there are format wars, music server issues, computer usb dac issues, and just goes on and on

.. Do you stream the music or do you store it locally to the player. Lots of different things to discuss...but with hi-rez music on its way there's now that potential to sound significantly(or marginally) better than a CD.

planet10 · « **Reply #22 on:** 24 Jun 2010, 07:11 pm »

I have just RIPped/re-RIPped all my CDs into AIFF format, replacing as many ALAC as i could. I am now able to actually get at all my music... with CDs you end up playing the ones in the most recently sorted stack, and swearing when you can't find the CD you want to play.

dave

bunnyma357 · « **Reply #23 on:** 24 Jun 2010, 07:16 pm »

Quote from: planet10 on 24 Jun 2010, 07:11 pm

I have just RIPped/re-RIPped all my CDs into AIFF format, replacing as many ALAC as i could.

dave

Any reason why you didn't just convert you ALAC's to AIFF? They should be bit perfect and would keep any tagging you might have added.

Jim C

planet10 · « **Reply #24 on:** 24 Jun 2010, 07:57 pm »

Quote from: bunnyma357 on 24 Jun 2010, 07:16 pm

Any reason why you didn't just convert you ALAC's to AIFF? They should be bit perfect and would keep any tagging you might have added.

Rumours of bugs in Apple's ALAC encoding.

dave

tg3 · « **Reply #25 on:** 24 Jun 2010, 08:30 pm »

Quote from: planet10 on 24 Jun 2010, 07:11 pm

I have just RIPped/re-RIPped all my CDs into AIFF format, replacing as many ALAC as i could.

Dave,

Do they sound any better?

I have most of my collection in ALAC, but am open to other formats.

Quote

I am now able to actually get at all my music... with CDs you end up playing the ones in the most recently sorted stack, and swearing when you can't find the CD you want to play.

+1

dvenardos · « **Reply #26 on:** 24 Jun 2010, 08:32 pm »

As a programmer I am pretty skeptical that it takes more processing power to process lossless compressed files. If you have to transcode like with the squeezebox ALAC to FLAC, yes. But as per the comment on the gzip format you aren't actually decoding anything you are simply foregoing one or more reads from the disc (when there are multiple null bytes on the source before compression) so it should actually take less CPU to process a compressed lossless file. I am not a low-level programmer so this is not gospel. For example instead of storing null, null, null, null, null on disc you are storing some kind of code and five like x5 (you get the gist). This is what lossless means, any non zero information is preserved. Different lossless formats would have different codes/formats for signifying multiple zero byte combinations.

Quote from: bunnyma357 on 24 Jun 2010, 06:31 pm

Performance in decoding lossless compressed files does require more processing, so it may sound worse on some systems, but I would guess that it is system dependent and less of an issue as computers improve.

planet10 · « **Reply #27 on:** 24 Jun 2010, 09:02 pm »

Quote from: tg3 on 24 Jun 2010, 08:30 pm

Do they sound any better?

Don't know. I'd have to re-rip some stuff into ALAC to compare...

dave

patricksalter · « **Reply #28 on:** 2 Jul 2010, 06:58 pm »

Well, Danny, I just gotta ask. You say you play off of a computer whenever possible. I would love to know what kind of setup you are running. From the software, to the DAC, and what you are using to rip. Inquiring minds want to know!

Danny Richie · « **Reply #29 on:** 2 Jul 2010, 07:40 pm »

I am using a Mac Mini with external hard drive. I use an after market power cable and power conditioned from an Uber Buss. Everything that is running in the back ground is shut off. I play back using iTunes or Play software. Play sounds better most of the time.

I use iTunes to prompt burning or copying the CD and save in AIFF format.

S Clark · « **Reply #30 on:** 2 Jul 2010, 09:43 pm »

Quote from: Danny on 2 Jul 2010, 07:40 pm

.... Play sounds better most of the time.

But interestingly enough, not all of the time. Danny had his rig in at my place, and certain songs sounded better on iTunes, and others on Play.

I can't remember what we were listening to... Keb Mo???

avta · « **Reply #31 on:** 2 Jul 2010, 10:48 pm »

I puy my vote in for AIFF or flac. You can also try Squeezeplay for playing files. http://downloads.slimdevices.com/nightly/?ver=7.5

bunnyma357 · « **Reply #32 on:** 3 Jul 2010, 03:37 am »

I have been very happy with Pure Vinyl for playing ALAC files - sounds much better than iTunes direct to me. There is also the cheaper Pure Music, which gets rid of the vinyl digitizing capabilities. Not free, but not too expensive for the capabilities and sound improvement they bring to iTunes.

Amarra can also be used to enhance iTunes, but it is much more expensive.

Jim C

Construct · « **Reply #33 on:** 3 Jul 2010, 03:56 am »

ALAC works fine. AIFF if you really don't need to save space.

patricksalter · « **Reply #34 on:** 3 Jul 2010, 04:46 am »

I'm having a hard time understanding how AIFF's can sound better than FLAC's. It just doesn't make sense to me. Somebody got an explanation for me?

patricksalter · « **Reply #35 on:** 3 Jul 2010, 04:48 am »

Danny, you never mentioned which DAC you were using in your rig.

dvenardos · « **Reply #36 on:** 3 Jul 2010, 06:54 am »

Any differences would be software related and dependent. Perhaps timing issues?

Quote from: patricksalter on 3 Jul 2010, 04:46 am

I'm having a hard time understanding how AIFF's can sound better than FLAC's. It just doesn't make sense to me. Somebody got an explanation for me?

jdbrian · « **Reply #37 on:** 3 Jul 2010, 10:50 am »

Hi Folks

Great discussion. I am the OP on this thread. I have been busy and haven't gotten an external drive to store my music yet. I ripped a few CD's using AIFF and am playing them back with Toslink. I must say they sound superior to my old Rotel 971 used as a transport. My DAC is a slightly moded DEQ2496. I have a HAGDAC usb to spdif converter but haven't tried it yet. The toslink works fine even with a 15$ plastic cable. I have never had a tick or hiccup of any kind playing back cd's while using Safari but my mac is new with no software installed other than iwork.
One thing I notice is that when importing CD's some will come across at like 14X while others will be 4X. Is this an indication of the cd quality with faster speeds indicating fewer errors?
Also should the error correction box be checked in the import setup of itunes. The wavelength site says yes, other references don't mention it.

Cheers
Brian

Cheers
Brian

PhilNYC · « **Reply #38 on:** 3 Jul 2010, 11:01 am »

Quote from: Rclark on 24 Jun 2010, 06:46 pm

That's funny. I've always been able to tell a difference between compressed and cd. To me it's like the difference between a coke and a diet coke. But I've never tries lossless.

Still, other reasons I prefer the CD are aesthetic. I like having the disc, with the artwork and packaging. And all my discs are pristine and well kept. I also mostly buy used and with great success from Amazon. I'm about to go pick up Piper at the Gates of Dawn from my PO box, actually.

Yeah, in fact the CD player I'm buying will be single disc only. I like listening to albums and I only buy sure things or classics.

But who knows, it would be nice in the future to have the option of lossless compression, so maybe I'll give it a whirl. If it's good, I'll still buy CD but rip for listening. Maybe get a DAC, etc. But that's on down the line. I still need to order my N3. Very soon.

I'll say this...I definitely like the sound better in my system when I'm spinning a CD in my transport over the sound of my Transporter (both feeding an external DAC). However, using the Transporter, I listen to *so much more of my music collection* because of the convenience of not having to get up, look for a CD, change the CD in the transport, and sit down again. In addition, having all of my music on a central computer allows me to access my entire music collection from any one of the 4 systems in my house. I'm pretty sure that my transport sounds better than my Transporter because it is a much better transport, and not because of where the data is being read from (CD vs. computer). In the case of the computer, I am using ALAC and having SlimServer transcode to WAV before sending to the Transporter...

Danny Richie · « **Reply #39 on:** 3 Jul 2010, 04:36 pm »

Quote

Danny, you never mentioned which DAC you were using in your rig.

Now using a USB cable from db Labs to a Tranquility DAC.

I was using a CEC transport but not missing it at all.