[drphoto]

Saw this on AG. I have a fondness for Linn as is was part of the first great system I heard a long time ago. However, I'm a sort of a vinyl newbie. I've had TT before, but not sure they were ever set up correctly.

http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?anlgtabl&1276727654&/Linn-LP12-Valhalla-with-Linn-B

I'm worried it will be too fussy (hard to set up) It's more than I wanted to spend but figure I could sell it at virtually no loss if it doesn't work out.

I was hoping I could do this on the cheap w/ the Thorens TD-165 someone gave me, but I'm not feeling' the love.

Sorry to keep buggin' y'all, but I appreciate the help.

[orthobiz]

I love my Linn, will never get rid of it. Have upgraded it umpteen times. Runs like a rock. I never work on it, however, the springs have to be balanced just so. There are devotees and detractors, always elicits and opinion one way or another. Don't know if it's a good price or not...

Paul

[Stu Pitt]

According to my Linn dealer, the maintenence associated with the LP12 is way overblown.  There are regular things that need to be done, but if you leave the deck alone and don't constantly fiddle with it, it won't be too much of an issue.

I've never owned an LP12, but maybe I will one of these days.  Still waiting to see if this whole digital files thing will be a fad or not    Till then, I'm slummin' it with my Pro-Ject Xpression.

If I had the cash, I'd look into one.  They're pretty confusing to me.  Luckily I have a great local dealer who's never steered me wrong with anything.  He's actually talked me out of a few crazy ideas.  Hopefully you've got a Linn guy you can trust locally.  If not, I can give you contact info for my guy in Westchester County, NY. 

[Brian Cheney]

No, and I speak as a former LP12 owner.

Unbelievably fussy, full of ringing and resonances, the LP12 is perhaps the most highly colored source component ever made.  Ivor Tiefenbrunn famously remarked he could identify its sound passing by outside a hifi store, and whether it was being used with a Dust Bug. 

Many love it.  I found it frustrating and, ultimately, hellishly amusical.


B Cheney
VMPS Ribbon
www.vmpsaudio.com

[macrojack]

Take your time, Joe. There are a lot of turntables that will come your way. I've used AR, Linn, SOTA, VPI, FONS, Well-Tempered, Yamaha, Technics, and many others that don't come to my sleepy mind just now. I think a Technics direct drive is very hard to beat.

[James Romeyn]

Brian you gave me the best laugh I've had, well, in at least the last several hours.  We hate to see you blocking and unable to express your true feelings...so sad.    For reader's info, Brian's LP12 was almost certainly the 1st gen.  I'm sure the later ones are improved and more neutral in sound quality.   

I owned a bunch of Sota Saphires, A Sony PSX (900 IIRC) servo-track straight line DD, a couple LP12s, a Denon DP-59L servo tracking DD, and now a custom built TT (ash base, 1.5" solid alum plinth cut by AC member "Berndt", 70 lbs, no suspension, OEM Empire platter/bearing/motor).

Overall performance rating in descending order (large spacing between each):
Custom Berndt (equivalent OEM performance around $5k-$10k)
Sony (possibly best except for feedback issues)
Denon
LP12
Sota

One of the best known OEM values is the estimated $5k TT used by Atma-Sphere and Classic Audio Reproductions at THE Show '10 (sorry, unknown make/model).

Alan Perkins' Immedia Spiral Groove TTs (2 models) are probably as good as vinyl gets and among the best audio sources extant.  His system with small standmount Sonics Anima monitors at 2008 or 2009 CES was the best in show.  I definitely prefer no suspension now and might pass on the LP12 for that reason.

A guy who I trust owned every version/upgrade of the LP12 up to about 1990.  He was convinced the earlier generations (one of the early PS upgrades) was the most musical and his favorite overall by a wide margin.  I agree with his sentiment.  He swore by the Rega RB300 arm, as do I, at least up to about $700 MSRP.       

[lowtech]

I owned one for two decades and no, it's not fussy.  I think Brian's problem may have been related to the speakers he was using.

[James Romeyn]

In the late 70s (19, not 18) when the LP12 dawned the lowest bass cutoff from a Linn speaker (Isobarik w/KEF oval midbass) was around the mid-40 Hz range.

Fast rewind to Brian's then Super Tower IIa/R, over 6', 15PR, 1 or 2 active 15s (depending on vintage), 2x 12 midbass..............

Brian will contest this, but I still say that speaker may have had the lowest actual bass cutoff of everything he's built before or since, except for maybe the latest 400+ lb monster at THE Show 2010 (my friend, Marine aviator/San Francisco Fireman George Karawanny tossed it around like a minimonitor...he's a big friendly giant and you don't want to get on this guy's bad side...Brian and I set up ST IIa/R at the home of a guy who also owned the Infinity IRS III). 

The ST IIa/R had extreme effortless power below 20 Hz, something Linn had a sum total zero experience with in that era.  (I have personal experience building an Isobarik system, have heard the Linn more than once, and our great member Duke LeJeune IIRC will confirm that contrary to belief, Isobarik alignment affects more than driver volume and low bass cutoff does suffer...I wouldn't be surprised if the Linn Iso cutoff was more like 50 Hz).

It's not surprising Brian's LP12 had heart attacks trying to reproduce the Koto drum whacks and other assorted program material when the LP12 was in the same room with his towers and the freekin monster 350Wpc 100+ lb Iverson arc-welding power amp he used back then.

I sure miss John Iverson.   

[James Romeyn]

Sorry for the OT: not many (maybe no one except Brian, me and the customer and his visitors) people ever had the opportunity to directly AB (two different systems unfortunately) the great Infinity IRS III with the VMPS Super Tower IIa/R (one of the last of that series).  On the IRS it was very interesting to hear the motion-feedback circuit hit in some brief period after the start of the bass transients during Firebird.  Believe me, we're nitpicking because this guy had a humongous dedicated room/entryway and the sound rocked no question about it.  First the big drum whack, then immediately after you'd hear the system overdamp, kind of overcompensating so to speak.  It was quite a reveleation to listen to the same tune on the VMPS immediately after, and notice that if anything the bass may have been more natural and musical.  For the record, you'd invert the outcome above the bass range, but still the VMPS was in the hunt.   

[simoon]

As a former Linn owner and lover, I'd say that is a good deal.
But don't expect the most accurate turntable, it is colored but in a very individual way, that makes it special.

I believe the Linn was surpassed in almost every way, even in its own heyday. But you have to give it so much credit for changing the entire thought process and importance of the TT in high end audio.

I remember the first time I ever heard one. I walked into Music And Sound in the San Fernando Valley in LA. I heard it compared to whatever the high end direct drive TT was at the time. The difference was obvious.

[drphoto]

As stated in an earlier post, I'm not looking for accurate.(I've got a nice Stan Warren digital rig for accurate) I want over the top warm and lush. I want to be bathed in a golden musical glow. This is a nostalgia trip.

However, as I really want either Gedlee or Audiokinesis speakers, I think I may be out of my mind even considering this, as I'm not made of money these days.

I may just see if I can rebuild/modify the Thorens.

Nostalgia trips may have to wait until I finish grad school.

But I do appreciate everyone's input. Thanks

[simoon]

Even the most accurate TT in the world will not lack warmth.

TT's do not give up warmth for accuracy like some other audio products do. At least in my opinion.

[Stu Pitt]

I wouldn't charecterize the LP12 as "over the top warm and lush."  I've never lived with one and only heard them in demo systems that I know pretty well.

I'll let others describe their sound.

[doorman]

The Linn's I've had were musical in a very satisfying way.
The Basik Plus isn't a bad arm, but the TT deserves better.
Once set-up, I didn't find the suspension fussy. YMMV, of course. Good Hunting!
Don