Internal wire and/or interconnects question?

Jens · « **Reply #20 on:** 14 Feb 2004, 12:02 pm »

Quote from: AKSA

Ah well,

All I can say is that I don't recall all the details, my memory is not wonderful!

However, this is not something I will argue with, as clearly there is egg on my face. I'm sure Jens is quite right, but certainly this conflicts with other experience I've had. It just goes to show that nothing should be taken for granted!

Cheers,

Hugh

Ah, memory can play us all tricks!

My point is exactly as Hugh states: Nothing should be taken for granted!

Cheers,

PSP · « **Reply #21 on:** 14 Feb 2004, 03:53 pm »

Jens and all,
I listened to Jens' system and had an audio-religious experience. Absolutely wonderful, and Jens uses silver plated copper interconnects that he swears by. Given the awesome sound of his system I would be the last person to say that it can't be done, or to argue with a man who has built such a system. I hope to try some of his wire in my system someday. Jon Risch, in one of his posts on AA, made a very interesting comment about mixing metals (I assume copper and silver) in interconnects: two different metals used in series (I suppose that he means silver = hot, copper = return or the reverse) "tends to bring out the worst characteristics of both metals" while using them in parallel (copper + silver hots, copper + silver returns, I suppose) sounds better. I e-mailed him to ask for more detail, never got an answer. I do have some nice silver and copper wire on hand, and when the GK-1R is complete, I may try some braids, twists, helicies, etc. to see what I can hear.

Metallurgy is a black art... the amazing properties of Damascus swords were an absolute mystery until a few years ago when a few reasonable hypotheses emerged (and I'm sure that it's still not entirely understood). So, I would argue that there are many ways to put ingredients together into a pot, but only some taste good, and only a few are truly wonderful. Not all silver-plated copper is created equal, I'll bet.

My post was not about interconnects, however. All I said was that I've struggled to understand what could be happening in power runs at mains frequencies (or even DC) that could inject higher frequency garbage into an audio circuit. Hugh's "grain-boundary diode" hypothesis for copper/silver systems is one way that could happen, and I found it an interesting idea. Someday, if/when life is running at a lot slower pace, it would be a very interesting thing to study.

Peter

Seano · « **Reply #22 on:** 15 Feb 2004, 10:22 pm »

Personally I can't see the point in going OTT fancy interms of power wires within the AKSA. After all, power comes through hundreds of k's of plain old copper and the spot with the greatest chance of crap wire is in your own home. Flash harry wire in the AKSA may just pass on all the artefacts out of your house/supply system and into the amp. Someone once said that the use of silver in hifi is most revealing.

In the end, as far as I can see, Hugh's recommendation of 10 to 14 gauge hookup wire stands. I use some cheapish PVC coated OFC copper wire from Jaycar and it sounds fine to me.

In terms of interconnects and speaker though I have no trouble with silver plated copper. I've had QED Silver Anniversary biwire in my setup for a week or so and have nothing poor to say about it (AU$23/m delivered from www.hificables.co.uk - as opposed to AU$45/m from Sydney hifi dealer). I suspect that it is as good and possibly better than the Risch recipe I was using but is certainly more aesthetic to look at. And WAY easier to build!. It is a bit difficult to say for sure it is better as I have a new room and in this room have moved from one amp to biwire to bi amp to new speaker position so nothing was comparable.

Silver plated copper interconnects are out there and they are fine. But they are also on the pricey side so not something I have played with. I'm still trying to get a grip on Cat5 (Which is the go? one strand or a twisted pair on each of hot and cold output from amp to RCA jack?). I figure since Cat5 is all that's inside the amp then having something better outside is just false economy.

Remember, the chain is only as strong as the weakest link.

dayneger · « **Reply #23 on:** 16 Feb 2004, 03:05 pm »

I've always wondered about this weakest link issue. There was a great topic about a year ago where someone wrote the effect of, "Hugh didn't put solid silver traces on the PCB, or include silver-wire components in the kit for that matter, and yet the amps still sound amazing. . ."

The signal path goes through so many different components, as does the power--how much snake oil was poured into your transformers, anyway?--that I have a hard time believing that good basic copper wire of appropriate diameter isn't just fine for most applications. If the opposite were true, then our components would sound amazingly better if we were able keep the signal medium consistently of the highest quality.

I know that wiring does make a difference, but I'm seriously doubtful that there's much to it other than basic issues of shielding, LRC factors, good carrying medium and clean connections. If we all cared so much about the sound then we'd hook up our components together direct point to point with good wire and appropriate shielding. If you think about it, the concept of which speaker binding post, or which rhodium plated socket, sounds the best is astonishingly stupid if the sound quality is our actual goal.

Hmmm, this is starting to sound a bit like a rant!

Maybe I'm just jealous and insecure because I can't tell if that 3" chunk of wire in some upstream component has a PE or Teflon jacket, or whether it's 0.0000001 oder 0.00000001 copper.

Or maybe (warning--sacreligious works coming) I don't really care. . .

Dayne

Malcolm Fear · « **Reply #24 on:** 16 Feb 2004, 03:54 pm »

It is good when you don't care.
I use teflon coated CAT 5 everywhere. I throw away PCB pins and solder directly to the boards. I remove RCA sockets and plugs where I can.
I can hear all of this. Now I don't care. It is great to just enjoy the music.

But maybe it would all sound better if I had the cases made from 1/2 inch Corian?

Flick · « **Reply #25 on:** 16 Feb 2004, 09:42 pm »

But maybe it would all sound better if I had the cases made from 1/2 inch Corian?

Nah, just hides all the ugly metal work underneath.

Speaking of, If I was bathing in sunny WARM weather

, I'd probably (most likely) would not care either like you guys downunder. But it is cold, icy, snowy up here

. Perfect time to dig in to improve an already top class performer

.

I just picked up some 25 gauge magnet wire today from a local motor shop for free. Lord knows, I gave him plenty of work. This is what will be used under the Corian when the TLP is upgraded.

Now, for the next question. What have you guys/gals swapped the MMK coupling caps with, in either the TLP output or AKSA 100 watt input? Any benefits here

?

I was looking here for a possible replacement:
http://www.soniccraft.com/parts/capacitors.htm Thetas at the bottom of the page.

Nice to cover all corners before 'the dreaded conversion day'...So damn enjoyable now.

John

AKSA · « **Reply #26 on:** 16 Feb 2004, 10:20 pm »

Hi John,

A 0.47uF costs $US10.53; try the RelCap for about half that. And while you are about it, maybe double it to 1uF.

Cheers,

Hugh

PSP · « **Reply #27 on:** 16 Feb 2004, 10:53 pm »

I just put replaced the stock input caps on my AKSA 55N with 0.47uf RelCap RTX. Nice change... still more resolution with no apparent downside. I just did this a couple of nights ago so I haven't had time to really listen seriously yet, but I'm quite sure that this is a positive change.

Given the recent discussion of chassis wire in AKSAs... in my case one lead of the RTX goes straight the input RCA hot and the other RTX lead is soldered straight to the board (from below). The RTX is fairly large, so I've stuck it to the chassis floor with Velcro. For the return, I used some 20 ga Vampire magnet wire, wrapped around the RTX leads to make a twisted pair.

Peter

Flick · « **Reply #28 on:** 18 Feb 2004, 10:58 am »

Hi Peter.

Who supplied your Relcaps? Had any time to give it a good ol' listen yet? Hope your in a warmer climate than I.

Thanks guys!

John

SamL · « **Reply #29 on:** 18 Feb 2004, 08:58 pm »

Quote from: Malcolm Fear

Hi Sam
For CD, I have interconnects poking out the back of the GK-1, with Eichmanns on one end, the other end are soldered to the input switch inside the GK-1. Gets rid of a pair of RCA plugs, sockets and solder joints.
On the output side I have the same thing. Interconnects from the circuit board, through holes in the back of the GK-1, terminated in Eichmanns.

Interesting

I am doing the same with my passive preamp. However, I am yet to find a way to properly securing the cat5 IC so that if someone pull the IC by accident it will not ruin the soldered join or the DACT. I used hot glue to secure the IC to the metal hole but the end look very ugly and it is not very secure so I only changed the line out to power amp. What did you do to secure the IC?

Sam

Malcolm Fear · « **Reply #30 on:** 18 Feb 2004, 09:17 pm »

Hi Sam
I use cable ties to hold the left and right IC together inside the box. I use care when I am mucking around plugging into things.
The DACT is a problem. I have lost a couple of those solder pins that are part of the DACT.

PSP · « **Reply #31 on:** 20 Feb 2004, 01:28 am »

Hi John,
I bought the Relcaps from Michael Percy. I'm off for a week (skiing in Colorado). When I get back, the caps will be well burned-in, but it will be a few days before I can listen with any care.

Peter

SamL · « **Reply #32 on:** 20 Feb 2004, 03:37 am »

Quote from: Malcolm Fear

Hi Sam
I use cable ties to hold the left and right IC together inside the box. I use care when I am mucking around plugging into things.
The DACT is a problem. I have lost a couple of those solder pins that are part of the DACT.

Good idea

Will add some silicon to prevent the metal hole from cutting into the wire.

Thanks,
Sam

Flick · « **Reply #33 on:** 20 Feb 2004, 10:20 am »

Quote from: PSP

Hi John,
I bought the Relcaps from Michael Percy. I'm off for a week (skiing in Colorado). When I get back, the caps will be well burned-in, but it will be a few days before I can listen with any care.

Peter

I had enough snow for the year...55 degrees here today

Thanks for the lead. I'm sure Michael will be getting some of my business. Nice stuff!
Give your impressions when you can.

RTX Relcaps are a bit more pricey than what Hugh mentioned. Hugh are you talking of the PPMFX caps? I read a few comments about self-healing caps, not very positive. Not many, I know, favor the MMks either. I had no problem with the MMks until the Jordan addition. Again, proving that it's all in the mix of each system or, is it?, in a set of ears:wink:

John