"Clint the Troll" Stratos review is GONE

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Bob A (SD)

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"Clint the Troll" Stratos review is GONE
« on: 10 Feb 2004, 01:49 am »
At least it would seem that the site's moderators are fairly expeditious in reponse to requests for action on spurious garbage.

BikeWNC

"Clint the Troll" Stratos review is GONE
« Reply #1 on: 10 Feb 2004, 02:05 am »
The sad thing is that his "review" got pretty high marks from other readers as to the usefulness of the info provided.  I can see how a 5 star glowing review without comparisons might not be too informative to the reader also.  But come on, if he is expecting the sound equivalent of a $300 receiver from the Stratos then of course he will be disappointed.  If what he likes is the $300 receiver sound.   :o

Andy

jackman

"Clint the Troll" Stratos review is GONE
« Reply #2 on: 10 Feb 2004, 02:09 am »
It's good to see the folks at Audioreview policing their site.  It's one thing to not like a component, but that guy obviously was making that stuff up.  Klause and I haven't always seen eye to eye but I have total respect for the way he takes care of his customers.  Plus, I admire the fact that his products are made in the US.  He could save a lot of money by shipping productions off shore but he is willing to make a bit less for better quality control, because he cares about his customers.  How can you NOT admire that. :D

The good news is there are enough loyal, happy Odyssey customers to call people like Clint (I think that's his name) on the carpet when they spout off like he did on AR.  Odyssey makes high quality/high value products with excellent resale (this is important!).  It's good to have choices and Odyssey offers an excellent choice for anyone looking for high performance at a low price.  Now if Klaus would ever come out with an Xtreme integrated with remote!  ...can you say CODA Continium killer???


Later,

Jack

klaus@odyssey

"Clint the Troll" Stratos review is GONE
« Reply #3 on: 10 Feb 2004, 07:34 am »
Can't believe that I'm saying that,  but yes,  thanks so much Jack.  Hope that this means more moderation from now on,  I would like that.

Anyway, this issue with the review pisses me off in several ways and for several reasons.  For one,  what is wrong with people attacking other's livelihood like that ???  As you guys know,  I have never talked down on other brands,  and the question is what kind of motivation there is  ???  5 possible reasons,  1. of course,  an unsatisfied customer ( naaah),  2. another manufacturer for his own gain,  3. a dealer fed up with us being direct,  4. most likely,  someone who can't stand that his/her gar is rated lower,  and 5.  someone just plain nuts and mean.

What makes me really,  really sad,  and where I can definitely wear my emotions on my sleeve is the fact that so many times I have tried to make others happy.  Tried not onlt to go the extra mile no matter what,  but also doing dozens and dozens and dozens of times things either for free or at cost.  Heck,   look at the Extreme mod.  It's not here to make $$$,  but to give a better value and make the customer happier and more satisfied.  I really and truly believe in  enriching peoples lives through my part in audio and my personal relationship with customers.  I honestly try to be friends with each and everybody whom I deal with,  which, of course is not always possible,  but then again,  when I'm on the road,  I always meet customers to hang out with.  Hehehe,  I probably have a couple hundred dinner invitations,  so yep,  I love to freeload this way.

At any rate,  I'm in this really ridiculous business for 16 years now.  13 + of them have been very, very difficult,  (most of you know the issue with ODL, for example) so yes,  I paid my dues and made my big mistakes (way too many) and know the industry and more important,  equipment , synergy and setup issues, etc.  very well.  13 + years of hardship,  man,  and then when it finally goes well,  others try to simply destroy it.   That's why I love to work my ass off,  literally 13-14 hrs average !!!  days,  because I enjoy the relative success based on where I've been before.

The internet is a true catch 22 if you think about it.  However,  in one instance, a year  ago in a similar situation,  I was forced to go legal,  and I know that this person will not be happy for a long time,  if I want to play hardball.  Have to see if I'll pull the trigger, the decision will come down soon now.  So,  legally,  there are more than enough precedences with web related slender etc.  issues,  and I can only see this spiraling out of control more and more the worse the economy and market gets.  Desperation time.

At any rate,  I would like to think that I have always been decent,  helpful, and nice to everybody over the past years.  So,  besides the attempt to file a bad review,  I just don't get the personal attacks,  because that's what it was.

To all of you guys,  thanks so much for your support.  I really, really appreciate it and I also like to call AC  my web home away from my web home,  hehehe.

Klaus

rosconey

"Clint the Troll" Stratos review is GONE
« Reply #4 on: 10 Feb 2004, 12:32 pm »
:o WOW :o  klaus and jackman getting along  :o
can world peace be far behind :lol:

jackman

"Clint the Troll" Stratos review is GONE
« Reply #5 on: 10 Feb 2004, 01:48 pm »
Hey Rosconey, I reserve the right to stop being an asshole in these matters and to grow up!   :) I have this nasty habbit of standing up for decent people who I feel are in the right.  Klause is trying his best (and doing a very good job, based on the most important criteria, his customer's feedback) to run an honest and respectable business in a very difficult and competitive business.  He doesn't cut corners, makes his products in the US, and stands behind them with the best warrantee in the business.  When that guy said Klause dodged him, I knew he was lying.  

Unlike Klause, I don't think that guy was a dealer, manufacturer or responsible person.  He's probably a bitter, unhappy loser trying to spread his venom and unhappyness to others.  Like they say, misery loves company.   I imagine reading all of the positive posts about Odyssey products really set him off and his response was his post.  Like any scumbag terrorist knows, it's easier to break things down than to build things up.  I'd be willing to bet that he has never SEEN an Odyssey product let alone auditioned one.  His post was disgarded into the vast internet dumpster...too bad we couldn't do the same with ol' Clint!

Cheers!

Jack

PS - luckily Audioreview is populated with 16 year old's whose only quest is to find a source for  Paradigm on line and ask idiotic questions about wires.  That site is a Mad Max style ghost town, only eclipsed by HD.   :D

Chazz

"Clint the Troll" Stratos review is GONE
« Reply #6 on: 11 Feb 2004, 05:50 am »
Well, based on product/service/value for money performance I became a repeat customer of Klaus (I think I'm also the first international Lorelei owner!).  

Customer service was important for me as I was not in the US and (at the time) there was no dealer in the country I lived.

If there's one criticism that can be levelled at Klaus is that he works damn too hard! :nono:    Slow down Klaus, we want you around for a long while so that you can continue to make us products!  :mrgreen:

tensne1

  • Newbie
  • Posts: 2
"Clint" is back!
« Reply #7 on: 13 Feb 2004, 12:50 pm »
The "Clint" review is back on audioreview.com :? WTF...?

rosconey

"Clint the Troll" Stratos review is GONE
« Reply #8 on: 13 Feb 2004, 01:10 pm »
i wonder how that happened :?:

pugs

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 454
"Clint the Troll" Stratos review is GONE
« Reply #9 on: 13 Feb 2004, 03:05 pm »
Quote from: rosconey
i wonder how that happened :?:


Maybe AR found out it was a legitimate review.  I'm not saying I agree with it though.

Eduardo AAVM

"Clint the Troll" Stratos review is GONE
« Reply #10 on: 13 Feb 2004, 05:13 pm »
Maybe this is a stupid idea, but How many of you have posted a review in audioreview.com?

Well, the ones who haven't what if then post your review, it will in a way improve the average rate.

Anyway that poor man is damaged... Let's better pray for him...  :wink:

BeatleFred

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 29
  • Sansui BA-5000/Infinity Renaissance 90
"Clint the Troll" Stratos review is GONE
« Reply #11 on: 26 Feb 2004, 05:56 am »
Is the review that was put back on Audioreview the same as the first review written by Clint?, which I didnt read. Or was anything changed in the 2nd review?

I did read the 2nd review, and while I am not interested in taking sides or looking to defend Clint(since I have no idea who he is anyway), I dont quite understand why anyone here is so upset with his review or thinks he's lying. Its one thing if he has never heard the amp, but he says he spoke with Klaus on the phone and he did order the amp, so I dont see why some people here view him as an imposter.

To repeat, I have no motive to defend Clint, but I feel he is entitled to his opinion and has the rite to return the amp for a refund if he is not satisfied with it. And he is allowed to give the amp a less than 5 star rating on Audioreview if he wants to, if the fact is he did buy the amp and actually tried it out.  I can understand that other Stratos Owners who are happy with their amps wont like his opinion, but its wrong to have Clint censored in order to "protect" the perfect 5 star rating. Its not like Clint bashed Odyssey, or Klaus in his review, and made a whole ongoing rant about it, he just said he wasnt satisfied with the amp and he found another one he likes better for less money. So why dont you guys just take the the viewpoint of "good for him" and just leave it at that? Do you think he had nothing better to do other than to place an order on his credit card only to want to get out of paying for the amp? Maybe the amp needed that "breaking in" time that seems to be so typical of the Stratos, and had Clint been patient to let it "break in", he wouldve eventually heard an amp that sounds alot better to him.

B/F

amandarae

"Clint the Troll" Stratos review is GONE
« Reply #12 on: 26 Feb 2004, 07:12 am »
BeatleFred,

With all due respect,  I am speaking for myself only.  You have to read the review (1st) and then perhaps you can answer your question on "why" my reaction comes out like it is (see post).  I believe you will realize that it is just .  

Are you an owner of an Odyssey amp?  
To borrow Klaus words; "You have to own one to understand"!  
What I am getting at is that if you have the amp, then it is easier to relate to what the guy's (Clint?) message really is.  

Then perhaps you will see where we are coming from......

klaus@odyssey

"Clint the Troll" Stratos review is GONE
« Reply #13 on: 27 Feb 2004, 12:10 am »
Actually,  Fred is correct.  It's the guy's right to voice his opinion but  I won't go so far as to say  good for him.  Thre's more to the story, and I don't want to get into that yet.  In general,  I think that most people posting are genuine with their opinions and experiences.   However,  obviously there are a few bogus reviews in there,  and as for the lates one,  it's obviously that there are different levels of experience and sophistication of listeners and owners.  

 Yep,  did I ever mention break-in ???  Also, make sure that you listen to a quality $ 500 pr. of JBL  midfi speakers through your Soundblaster card in your computer.  That makes for a true reference review,  if you know what I mean,

Klaus

Matthew Wilson

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 18
Clints' review!!
« Reply #14 on: 27 Feb 2004, 12:27 am »
You are quite right in your assertion that people have a right to voice an opinion, whatever it may be. However, the comment's 'Clint' made were way off base and I believe left many genuinely puzzled as to how he could form an opinion that is so clearly out of step with the consensus.
Moreover, and to my mind more importantly, he made a very clear point of inferring (without any hint of subtlety) that Klaus in some way avoided, dodged and made it difficult for him to contact Odyssey to gain a refund. He then qualifies his experiences of dealing with Klaus and Odyssey in his summation in a particularly vitriolic manner, warning others to be wary. This is not on. It doe's a huge amount of damage to the reputation of both Klaus and Odyssey Audio, and there is no basis of factual history to coroborate such a claim. I personally have never found Klaus to be anything other than friendly and courteous to a fault, even when I know he has a lot on his plate. This you will find is a view of the man that resonates both through these circle's and beyond. Such a reputation is hard won and it is this that wrankles the man himself, and rightly so.
As for Clints comments regarding Stratos. It was such self-evident shite, that I was supprised it did'nt prevoke an even greater number of howls of dirision. We can all voice an opinion but it is always useful to be able to describe your comments in a relevant context. If you don't, people will quite rightly raise an eyebrow, glance over the top of their monitors' to see Mr Bush or Blair on the box, and be reminded of the faint smell of Bullshit! :D

BeatleFred

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 29
  • Sansui BA-5000/Infinity Renaissance 90
"Clint the Troll" Stratos review is GONE
« Reply #15 on: 28 Feb 2004, 09:48 pm »
Yes, I did own an Odyssey Stratos back in '01 and I had it for about a year. But I'm more into vintage 70's hi fi equipment (along with alot of the folks at my main 'hangout', www.audiokarma.org)

I did re-read Clint's review. Aside from his implying that he had some trouble getting his money back, most everything else he wrote, in my opinion, was not so bad that censorship is required. If he paid by credit card, then there should not have been any anxiety on his part about losing his money, thats understood. But if Clint and the amp just didnt "hit it off", well its probably for the best that he returned it and he can enjoy his HK 3475 instead. According to whats listed on the bottom of his message, he's been trying out different types of hi fi equipment for the past 30 years, so I imagine Clint is not a young novice in this hobby :)

Most of his comments on the Stratos' sound could be valid if the case is that the amp hasnt 'broken in' - though the issue of break-in shouldve been agreed upon during their phone conversation. If Clint didnt have the patience to wait for break-in or if he shares some other peoples' skepticism about break-in being a bogus amplifier characteristic, then he should have declined to buy the Stratos in the first place, along with the preamp as well.

Clint made some comments about the bass response, it lacked punch, well, I wouldve been interested to know more details which werent provided, such as what type of music was he listening to and was the lack of bass heard on just this one type of music or on everything he played??

Also, (and very important), Clint didnt elaborate on his main speakers. Most people seem to want to attribute bass response, Soundstage etc..., to abilties that the Stratos can provide when, in my opinion, these qualities are things that inherently come from the loudspeakers that a listener is using. Would others agree that given a choice, a superb pair of speakers with an average-quality amp would sound better than a superb amp partnered with average speakers?- Think about it folks.

If we want to really get analytical about things, I wonder what speakers cables & power conditioner device Clint was using. Maybe the Stratos & Tempest units he had were fine, but he used cheap speaker cables and plugged his equipment straight into his wall outlet.

By the way, while I no longer have my Stratos, I do have the Groneberg Quattro speaker cables. Any other people here using them?   I am interested to know, what makes this spkr cable have an exceptional sound?  I will look into further since I am curious, but based on the wires underneath the blue tubing cover, I dont detect anything that seems to be extraordinary in any way, did I miss anything?, if so fill me in.

If I connect the Groneberg cable to the right speaker and say, Monster cable, to the left speaker, and I then listen to some music,  will the right speaker sound better than the left?   And if I swap the cables will, the left speaker then clearly sound better than the right??? Think about it folks, and let me know the answer :)

Regards,

B/F (ps - I hope Clint's last name wasnt Eastwood, as in "make my day"  :)