Giant Killer cheap DVD player for redbook transport to XR45?

IanVan · « **on:** 21 Jan 2004, 04:11 am »

Hi all:

I'm hoping that I'm putting together a cheap giant killer system for heavy usage in my office. So far I've decided on and purchased GMA Europa's and the Panasonic XR45 digital amp. Now to complete the trifecta, I'm trying to figure out what the best of the lower-priced all-purpose DVD players is for use strictly as a redbook CD transport, digitally into the Panny XR45?

Pioneer DV-563A?
Panasonic S55?
Philips 963SA?
Marantz pro audio player?

Something else?

Thanks for any help.

Tyson · « **Reply #1 on:** 21 Jan 2004, 04:22 am »

My only advice would be to get one that has a coax digital output so you can use a bybee on the digital cable. Makes a big improvment.

bubba966 · « **Reply #2 on:** 21 Jan 2004, 04:28 am »

I'll second that a Bybee is helpful in the digital signal (in my experience).

A good quality digital cable is also critical. Be it from Bolder Cable, Streovox, Ridge Street, etc. It's surprising what a difference a digital cable makes.

I've found the Pioneer's to be pretty good RedBook transports, as have others. Doesn't matter much if it's their high-end model, or the entry level model. The entry level Pioneer's perform so close to the higher end models that you really need to have them side by side to be able to tell any differences.

I believe that Marantz still uses Pioneer transports, so there's no real need to pay more for a fancier name...

zybar · « **Reply #3 on:** 21 Jan 2004, 05:15 am »

What's cheap?

I have a Sony S-7700 that was modified by Empirical Audio. I never listened to it in stock form, but I have been told that it was pretty good stock.

This is another example of where a relatively cheap piece (the stock S-7700 can be had for $200-450 + $500-630 for Steve's mods) can be modified and easily surpass much more expensive gear.

I have compared the Empirical Audio S-7700 to transports ranging in price from $500-4000 and it still has given me the best sound in my system.

GW

Ears · « **Reply #4 on:** 21 Jan 2004, 06:09 pm »

I have tried several dvd players and a CEC cd player/ transport only to find that the 963sa sounds best whith more definition and details when used whith the Panny 45.

I curently have a Denon 5900 which is clearly a better sounding on cd when used whith other gear, but on the 45, the 963sa sounds better.

The 45 reads and displays the 192hz upsampling of the 963sa and this offers improved sonics more so than when used whith typical gear.

JoshK · « **Reply #5 on:** 21 Jan 2004, 06:17 pm »

Where can you still get the 963?

Ears · « **Reply #6 on:** 21 Jan 2004, 06:42 pm »

Apparently the list price has changed to 599.00 but here are a few places

www.brandnamz.com
www.audioadvisory.com
half.com by E bay
Tweeter
www.computers4sure.com
www.philipselectronics.com

If you do a search there are many others whith some being out of stock.

Tyson · « **Reply #7 on:** 21 Jan 2004, 06:47 pm »

Check audioreview, apparently the unit has some skipping/tracking issues, so make sure to get it from an authorized dealer!

JoshK · « **Reply #8 on:** 21 Jan 2004, 06:54 pm »

How is the PQ of the Phillips?

Ears · « **Reply #9 on:** 21 Jan 2004, 07:05 pm »

YES I read the audioreview's of the 963 but the funny thing is that there is not ONE mention of this on thousands of posts about the 963 on every audio board.

I find that, and the fact that I have owned two different 963sa's both stock and modified whithout any hint of problem for over 9 months to show the true colors of what goes on at Audioreview.

You will find these types of reviews there on every popular mass market player like the Sony 9000es for instance among many others.

I learned a long time ago that Audioreview is full of out right lies by people who have never even owned the gear they trash so it is very hard to tell the real reviews from the people whith too much time on there hands IMO.

gary · « **Reply #10 on:** 21 Jan 2004, 07:11 pm »

Although it's a great player, my 963 has acted strangely from day 1. There are a couple of cd's that it just won't read, and every once in a while it 'locks up'... the screen flashes dashed lines and i have to unplug it and power it up again. Otherwise it's been a pretty solid buy... so I'd say make sure you get it from a reputable vendor so you can exchange it if you need to.

-Gary

Ears · « **Reply #11 on:** 21 Jan 2004, 07:21 pm »

Quote from: JoshK

How is the PQ of the Phillips?

I tried 8 different dvd players since switching to a DLP including the Sony7700,9000,Samsung hd931,Denon 1600,5900,2900,JVCSA600 and the 963sa,

The 5900 is the best now that my second player whithout the macro blocking and excessive video noise is in the system.

The 963sa is second best out of the above players and has plenty of adjustments in the menu unlike most of the others.

I am using the 5900 for video and a 963sa for digital through the Panny 45 but the 963sa after adjustments is 90% of the 5900 and if you don't use a projector, you may notice little difference IMO.

AphileEarlyAdopter · « **Reply #12 on:** 21 Jan 2004, 10:42 pm »

Ears,
The menu settings only have 96KHz listed as maximum possible digital output frequency. How did you get 192KHz out of the player ?
BTW, I think, this player is great (even though Alex Peychev is not so keen about it in audioasylum). The DVD picture quality is fantastic. I am running mine now with a PS Audio High Current UO with Venhaus cryoed Flavor 3 power cord. It is much more dynamic than when plugged into a Monster Cable HTS2500 conditioner.

ABEX · « **Reply #13 on:** 21 Jan 2004, 11:35 pm »

Is everyone aiming for SACD as being the medium of choice?

What about this JVC Player that XA-SA600BK. It is suppose to be a great Redbook player according to Absolute Sound.

Ears · « **Reply #14 on:** 22 Jan 2004, 02:08 pm »

Quote from: ABEX

Is everyone aiming for SACD as being the medium of choice?

What about this JVC Player that XA-SA600BK. It is suppose to be a great Redbook player according to Absolute Sound.

The 963sa outputs a 192hz upsampled signal to the Panny or Tact amp through its digital output.
I don't know of any other gear that will pass the upsampled signal other than these two though.

Alex at AA is probably not interested in competing whith 8 other pro modders.
I don't believe there are 8 pro modders modding any other player besides the 963sa, and there is good reason for that as it is major bang for the buck when modified.

The JVC is not as good as the 963sa at cd or dvd....not even close but it does make a decent dvd-a player or in my case, I gave it to my kid who was using an x box for a dvd player.

As far as hi rez, there simply not enough available music in either format and even less music that has great sonics [too many turds] for hi rez to be a major player for a while.

Tyson · « **Reply #15 on:** 22 Jan 2004, 04:58 pm »

Ears,
Can you give a synopsis of the difference between the 192 upsampling and the non-upsampled signal?

Ears · « **Reply #16 on:** 22 Jan 2004, 06:46 pm »

Quote from: Tyson

Ears,
Can you give a synopsis of the difference between the 192 upsampling and the non-upsampled signal?

For me,[in stock form] the upsampling was only usefull on older not very well done recordings when used whith conventional gear, I probably used it on 25-30% of discs I own to liven them up in the soundstage and inner detail areas.
On better recordings the upsampling seemed to sometimes sacrifice the midrange and on bright recordings,upsampling was never prefferd.

When using the upsampling whith the Panny 45 the percentage of discs that improve seems to grow to around 60-70% whith bright recordings still being preffered whithout the upsampling.

When used whith other gear [seperates] I found myself always checking to see if upsampling improved the sound and whith the Panny 45 in the mix, I mainly leave it on and only occasionally turn it off .

The 963 needs some run in of around 200 hours before it settles in whith conventional gear so I would put around that many hours on it before making any judgements on the upsampling even if used whith the Panny 45 IMO.

Changing the main PS cap to the BG vk 150/350v cap is an easy DIY mod that is so cheap, it should be considered a must for anyone whith revealing speakers and when using the 963sa whith seperates,the upsampling takes on a more positive effect whith a smoothness that lends itself to using the upsampling whith most recordings.

I installed bybees in my first 963sa at the iec along whith an Acoustic Zen mc=2 digital,matrix reference ic's,Audience pc,lots of dampening of the case and isolation and the BG single cap replacement was at least twice the improvement of all the above after 24-48 hours whith a more organic sound and much improved soundstage in every direction whith much better inner detail.

Sometime in the next month I will be adding a bybee to the digital out and possibly an LC audio x03 clock for use whith the Panny 45.

If a more technical description than that is required,look elsewhere as I only measure all things audio whith my ears.