Negative Ion Generators, Quantum Physics

rollo · « **on:** 28 Dec 2009, 08:43 pm »

First a little story. Our daughter bought us a Himalayin crystal salt table lamp for Christmas. She bought it for its ability to clean the air. OK fine. My wife did not want it in the LV so off to man cave it went. Plugged it in Christmas morning and went about my business. That evening very late I sat down to chill before retiring. It was a very pleasant listening experience. Thinking it sounded better I attributed that to my mood and cleaner power at 1AM.
The next evening at normal listening time at 8PM again something was up. A livlier presentation yet not hyped very real presenc and dynamics. So on came the audiophile hat to figure out what was going on. Not only did the systems tonality change to closer to life like sound the soundstage was deeper and wider as well. A continuous sound just beautiful.
Still forgetting about the crystal lamp I'm puzzled, yet very very happy. I was beginning to think my prayers were answered and a miracle came my way. Coming to my senses, miracle? too much TV. Then the lightbulb went off could it be the lamp ? NAH.
I went looking for and found the instructions and to my surprise they mentioned the negative ion lamp was affective where magnetic fields from elecronic equipment is used.Negative ion WTF is that ? NAH! OK I bit. I removed the crystal and the result was all gone. The soundstage was smaller and the life was sucked out compared to when the crystal was plugged in. Conducted the experiment twice now with same results. It is staying put.
I wonder if the Acoustic Revive product offers even better results. My experience with the crystal lamp has peeked my interest in this area very interesting indeed.
A new frontier or just my imagination ? New frontier is my guess.

charles

BobM · « **Reply #1 on:** 28 Dec 2009, 09:05 pm »

Not terribly expensive either and available in several nice looking styles. I wonder if it makes a difference if it is placed closer in proximity to a speaker or to the equipment rack or to the listening position. Experiment and let us know Charles.

With a quick search I found these:

http://www.bestsaltlamp.com/

http://www.lampsalts.com/cart/index.php?language=en

http://www.spiritualquest.com/

http://www.amazon.com/Himalayan-Crystal-Rock-Salt-Pounds/dp/B000CDGR8Y?tag=dogpile-20

viggen · « **Reply #2 on:** 28 Dec 2009, 10:22 pm »

Uhm... does it matter if the light is turned on or not?

Reminds me of when I had a collection of crystals way back as a lad. I had a few chunks of Halite that would suit this endeavor perfectly.

So, how does this theory work? Positive ions emitted from electronics and negative ions emitted from salt crystals somehow neutralize each oether?

TRADERXFAN · « **Reply #3 on:** 28 Dec 2009, 10:42 pm »

Where do you live, somewhere cold and dry?
Could it be something with neutralizing static, like from carpets or something?

ctviggen · « **Reply #4 on:** 28 Dec 2009, 10:52 pm »

And how long does it have to be on?

BobM · « **Reply #5 on:** 29 Dec 2009, 01:26 pm »

One or two of those sites I linked to has a write up of how it all is supposed to work. Apparently the crystals, when heated, emit negative ions which help purify and clarify the air. This is usually noticeable and beneficial to those with allergies. Makes sense.

Think of the smell in the air during a lightning storm. It definitely smells a little different; perhaps a bit salty, well not quite but if you've smelt it you know what I mean.

So how might this work for audio? Dunno, but I can theorize. Soundtravels through air and any change to the air will affect the sound. Dry vs humid for instance, so maybe ionized air transmits sound differently. Then there's the negative ions floating around. Maybe this has something to do with static charge or perhaps affects magnetic fields in some way. Again, dunno.

But with the new increased perception of changes due to crystals (aka Alan Maher's products and others) I have no doubt that something may be changing. Improving, maybe, but definitely different. I've heard the affects of crystals briefly at a friends and, while subtle, there was a small difference.

Now I'm not talking about rocks in a glass vial on a table, I'm talking about direct placement of crystals on a magnetic component like a transformer. Perhaps it was a magnetic change, perhaps it acted as a vibration damper.(?)

alanmaher · « **Reply #6 on:** 29 Dec 2009, 01:56 pm »

Charles-

That is the same idea behind the Infinity CBF and Infinity passive filters. Place them near strong EM fields and they convert positive ions to negative...large Infinity filters placed around the room also allow the user to dial in the stage size. Try taping some CBF's over spare receptacles around the home and test the air quality 36 to 48 hours later....in a non-smoking home you just might say good-bye to the air cleaner....I suffer from year round allergies and all of our Sharper Image units have been replaced with 3 or 4 CBF's per circuit.

Enjoy!

ctviggen · « **Reply #7 on:** 29 Dec 2009, 02:04 pm »

How does this perform in helping your allergies?

Although I'm naturally skeptical about stuff like this, I did a small amount of research and there appears to be studies indicating positive effects of negative ions. I'm considering getting one of these for my office, to see what it's like.

carusoracer · « **Reply #8 on:** 29 Dec 2009, 02:09 pm »

Curious as to where your Lamp was positioned and the proximity to your Rig, very nice system.
Also how large is the Lamp that you received, it looks like there is a chart that shows the weight vs the coverage area of the Lamp.
Cheers

alanmaher · « **Reply #9 on:** 29 Dec 2009, 02:13 pm »

Strong EM fields produce positive ions, and it is the positive ion that causes problems for allergy suffers. Reducing the amount of positive ions around the home and replacing them with negative ions helps clean up the air quality by altering the atmosphere in the home. It's possible it's just me and I'm getting a little nuts in my old age, but I usually can't walk out of the house without getting sick and since the CBF install I haven't had one problem...I take multiple medications for my allergies 12 months a year and I have been able to scale back the daily dosage since I got home. I got into the crystals for the/v benefit....I was stunned when I started to notice the health benefit.

gerald porzio · « **Reply #10 on:** 29 Dec 2009, 02:53 pm »

Perhaps Machina Dynamica already has a working model of a snakeoil generator.

ctviggen · « **Reply #11 on:** 29 Dec 2009, 03:07 pm »

Quote from: gerald porzio on 29 Dec 2009, 02:53 pm

Perhaps Machina Dynamica already has a working model of a snakeoil generator.

In regards to ion concentrations and their effects on humans and animals, there are some studies:

http://www.djclarke.co.uk/file06.html

http://www.surroundair.com/negative-ions.htm

http://www.static-sol.com/articles/air%20ion%20effects.htm

Of course, these studies must be treated with skepticism. Nonetheless, the evidence has convinced me to try a light for my allergies. I'll report back later as to how well it works.

Wind Chaser · « **Reply #12 on:** 29 Dec 2009, 03:09 pm »

We're finally beginning to see some benefit from the Age of Aquarius.

MaxCast · « **Reply #13 on:** 29 Dec 2009, 03:18 pm »

A bit cheaper here
http://www.walmart.com/search/search-ng.do?search_constraint=0&ic=48_0&search_query=Rock+Salt+Lamp+&Find.x=8&Find.y=6&Find=Find

further looking and amazon has cheaper units.

Any links as to how many lamps it takes to treat a room.

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #14 on:** 29 Dec 2009, 03:31 pm »

If all else fails with these crystal lamp experiments, the wife and I have two, and they make very good low level lighting by the bedside...in case you want to read without waking each other

Aside from that, in 2-3 years of ownership, I haven't felt the positive force of any negative ion generation. But, I've not tried it in my listening area yet

These are the folks we bought them from: http://www.naturalsaltcrystallamps.com/

John

rollo · « **Reply #15 on:** 29 Dec 2009, 03:37 pm »

Yes the light needs to be on as the heat allows the process to work. It also emits a pleasant odor of the sea. The one I have covers the sq, footageIi have.
to the non believers out there the results I experienced happened by chance. There was no intention of improving a thing. just needed a place to put the lamp. The rest is history. We are buying more.
Last evening we put it in our bedroom. My wife suffers from a sleeping disorder and me allergies. Great nights sleep. Did not wake up once through the night. My wifes snoring could wake up Rip Van Winkle, well not last night. Yes she still snored but it was gentle. My wife who is skeptic number one ordered three more this morning. To me that says it all. BTW the brand name is Himalayan.

charles

charles

konut · « **Reply #16 on:** 29 Dec 2009, 03:41 pm »

Negative ions promote a sense of well being and calm. Rushing water creates large amounts of negative ions. Think about how you feel when in close proximity to the seashore or a waterfall.

TRADERXFAN · « **Reply #17 on:** 29 Dec 2009, 04:30 pm »

I had a cheapie unit with 3 wires I ordered to try this out 10 years ago. What I did notice was it would seem to attract black particles. It would be on the unit, on the table on the wall.... thats where the wipeable blades of the sharper image unit seemed to come in. This idea of heating up a salt egg may change that aspect of it though.

Did you see anything like these black particles?

-Tony

*Scotty* · « **Reply #18 on:** 29 Dec 2009, 04:36 pm »

A very small amount of negative ions are produced when rock salt is heated. The amount of negative ions produced is a function of the surface area of the salt heated. The ions are produced slowly at the surface the heated rock salt and they are consumed quickly by the positive ions in the immediate vicinity of the salt lamp. In other words the small amount of negative ions produced will only neutralize a correspondingly small amount of positive ions closest to the lamp, the lamp won't treat an entire room. Obviously the actual amount of positive ions produced by the electronic equipment in your home could be measured and the amount of negative ions necessary to neutralize them would also be known. As a rule there are usually more negative ions outdoors than there are indoors. Opening the window to let some of them in along with some fresh air might also be beneficial. Living in proximity to D.C. in a major metropolitan area the outside air is not always better than the inside air. I run HEPA filter air cleaners that also emit some negative ions. This seems to help but I won't make any grandiose claims for this approach. I don't drink Koolaid myself and I don't advocate its consumption by others.
Scotty

ctviggen · « **Reply #19 on:** 29 Dec 2009, 04:47 pm »

If I try one of these, I will be sitting basically immediately next to it, so I should be within the umbra created by this. This is the first year my "seasonal" allergies have lasted all year. If one of these devices would lessen that even by 5 percent, that would be about 18 fewer days per year I'd have to take allergy pills. If the device performs no function on me, I still have an unusual lamp.