[mjosef]

Since I don't listen to "commercial" radio, they are already 6ft. under, the two stations I listen to during my workdays, one listener supported(WFMU) and the other a public supported station(WKCR) serve my every musical needs without the blare of commercials, covering a wide range of music.
I think with the ever expanding availability of web accessibility, the whole world of 'radio' streams will become the norm in the not too distant future. The yakitty yak that is talk radio will shrink to niche status.

[gerald porzio]

Talk radio is an AM staple, not an FM staple. Secondly, not everyone lives in a cultural wasteland where Clear Channel rules the FM band. Putting all one's eggs in the FM streaming basket is akin to those who see Blu Ray hi def audio as the route to the promised land. These usually morph into the voices crying in the wilderness.

[Brett Buck]

easily 90% of my critical listening is done w/a quality fm tuna.  fm will easily outlast anyone posting in this forum.  but, quality programming will be hit or miss, depending on where you are located.  f

   I don't disagree with your point on the possible quality. I have in the past been very satisfied with FM when everything is perfect. But the times that it has been perfect have dramatically decreased over the past 25-30 years. And I am pretty well certain that no one is making any money off of it, which means it's not long for the world as a mass medium.

    Brett

[Brett Buck]

I have a big roof-top ChannelMaster antenna that goes into super deep fringe. I think I can safely say that the FM band is filled with stations, for now.

  Number of stations is certainly not the problem for me, nor is the broadcast power a big issue. But the multipath around here is *brutal* and short of putting up a giant dish (big enough to handle 39" of emitter) I can't find a way around it. And I have boxes full of antennas that just don't work.

    Brett

[S Clark]

So other than the programming, what makes for a quality FM broadcast?  What can the station do to improve the quality of their signal?

[Listens2tubes]

I listen to FM whenever I turn on my system. It's a great way to get things settling in while selecting the tunes I'll DJ. With the Crane FM Reflect antenna set up in the corner of the room I get excellent reception of most NY stations. Since WQXR has become public radio and has lowered its signal strength it is accompanied by a bit of hiss. Which has got me thinking about running a cable from the antenna in the attic. I also listen in my truck going to and from work. I like scanning the dial for something interesting when I feel like it.

Also my Creative ZEN has an FM tuner, which uses the headphone lead as the antenna. Actually works better with my Yuin PK1's than the crapiola that came stock.

I you are luck enough to have a good station in your area it's a great way to hear stuff you never heard before. Careful though:






You may just learn something!

[JerryM]

FM, to me, has been dead for quite some time.

Here in So Cal, you get twelve minutes of music and then eight minutes of commercials. Many of those minutes are spent telling you how many bitchin' songs they are going to play when they finally shut the hell up.

It's terrible, and has been for a very long time.

Bring on the commercial-free internet streams of musical goodness!!!    While not always the 'to-die-for' bit rate, at least they are playing music (and there are way more stations to choose from to find the reception and genre one is searching for).

YMMV, of course.

Have fun,
Jerry

[stereocilia]

Some of my favorite memories as a kid in Indiana were surfing the radio stations between Chicago and South Bend (e.g. WXRT, Notre Dame college radio).

Those of you in radio distance of Champaign, IL in the late 90's might remember 93.5 "The Web."  That was my fave.  I didn't realize how attached to it I was until it died.  WWHP "The Whip" in Farmer City is a wonderful station but never quite filled the gap.  I still listen to music I discovered on that station.

WBCN here in Boston is now dead.  (I think Mike Fremer DJ'd there back in the day).  I agree that the radio station situation here in New England is probably better than most places.  The 8 min. of music and 12 min. of inane commercials turns my stomach, and it seems to be the way that Clear Channel or the other one or two companies who own all the FM bandwidth do things.

I am digging internet radio.  The sound quality is getting better and scope is worldwide.  But, I still think people would prefer to listen to a local and live broadcast with a non-robot DJ on their way to work, even if the FM tuner isn't the conduit of the future.

[Brett Buck]

Some of my favorite memories as a kid in Indiana were surfing the radio stations between Chicago and South Bend (e.g. WXRT, Notre Dame college radio).

      This is not a technical point, just my entirely subjective observation, but I have many fond memories of radio from various times. There's something about radio, at least the way I remember it, that is just more intimate, or "present" in an emotional sense. I remember driving across Death Valley about 15 years ago listening to an AM station in Barstow - "Voice of the desert" or some such. Maybe it was the situation, but it would have been a pretty lonely drive, but having the radio on, and knowing that there were maybe 500-1000 people also listening to the same thing at the same time, made me me feel like I was part of something. Something trivial, of course, but something involving other people. Same thing as a kid, 3 in the morning listening to a 1-tuber radio I made from plans in "A Boy and a Battery" with an earphone. You knew someone else was out there, also at 3 in the morning, it wasn't just me.

    I just don't know of and haven't had any similar experiences with any other medium. It's still like that at times. I occasionally engage in AM DXing* and you still find it from time to time.  I mean, for God's sake, even utter bilge like Art Bell has a certain quality of connection and intimacy.  But unfortunately a lot of the "stuff 50 ads in this 10-minute break" roboDJ crap has completely lost that feeling. And getting dropouts ever 30 seconds from multipath or continual hiss from various computer sources just makes it impossible to sustain.

    I think it's a damn shame but I can't see it ever coming back.

     Brett

* GE Superradio II, Terk AM loop antenna, got the 50KW station in Hartford CT, from Sunnyvale CA, the first night. Can get the Lexington, NE station regularly. Not fantastic or anything better than anyone else can do, but you got to admit receiving a station from ~3000 miles away is a pretty neat trick.

[rich121]

Some of my favorite memories as a kid in Indiana were surfing the radio stations between Chicago and South Bend (e.g. WXRT, Notre Dame college radio).

      This is not a technical point, just my entirely subjective observation, but I have many fond memories of radio from various times. There's something about radio, at least the way I remember it, that is just more intimate, or "present" in an emotional sense. I remember driving across Death Valley about 15 years ago listening to an AM station in Barstow - "Voice of the desert" or some such. Maybe it was the situation, but it would have been a pretty lonely drive, but having the radio on, and knowing that there were maybe 500-1000 people also listening to the same thing at the same time, made me me feel like I was part of something. Something trivial, of course, but something involving other people. Same thing as a kid, 3 in the morning listening to a 1-tuber radio I made from plans in "A Boy and a Battery" with an earphone. You knew someone else was out there, also at 3 in the morning, it wasn't just me.

    I just don't know of and haven't had any similar experiences with any other medium. It's still like that at times. I occasionally engage in AM DXing* and you still find it from time to time.  I mean, for God's sake, even utter bilge like Art Bell has a certain quality of connection and intimacy.  But unfortunately a lot of the "stuff 50 ads in this 10-minute break" roboDJ crap has completely lost that feeling. And getting dropouts ever 30 seconds from multipath or continual hiss from various computer sources just makes it impossible to sustain.

    I think it's a damn shame but I can't see it ever coming back.

     Brett

* GE Superradio II, Terk AM loop antenna, got the 50KW station in Hartford CT, from Sunnyvale CA, the first night. Can get the Lexington, NE station regularly. Not fantastic or anything better than anyone else can do, but you got to admit receiving a station from ~3000 miles away is a pretty neat trick.

I live in Central Washington State and I have a Sansui TU-9900 tuner that I have in my system and listen to local stations using the built-in antennae...but, I found that a lack interesting music has kept me from using it much.

I have often wondered, if I bought a good antennae, and mounted it high enough, if I could get decent stations many many miles away..maybe some of the stations in the Seattle area, or better ones?

If so, then I would start to use the radio again.
Like others, I used to listen to the radio alot when I was younger, especially as a teenager in the 70's...Dr. Demento, and many other programs that filled my time...

Rick

[Wayner]

When we were young, we used to listen to the National Lampoon Radio Hour on a Twin Cities radio station every Friday night. We'd all meet downtown, park the cars and all have our car FM tuners tuned in. The local cop would stop by once in a while to see if we were selling drugs, and we said hell no, were listening the the National Lampoon. He'd listen for awhile, sometimes laugh and then drive away.

I got hooked on music when I got a 5 transistor pocket radio for Christmas one year. I listened to AM for years, listening to KDWB during the day and in the later years, Beeker (spelling?) Street from Little Rock. That is where I discovered the "underground" rock music. From that point, I built a 2-band radio in shop class, a Graymark with a fiber front panel, but that damn thing worked and worked pretty well. I hooked it up to my dad's roof top antenna and was pulling in shortwave (the other band on the 2 band) and that entertained me for a long time, especially in the winter. I listened to many stations like Voice of America, Radio Havana Cuba and others I can no longer remember.

While the quality of programming has gone down, there are some stations that are trying to produce a good product with good sound quality. One is Cities 97, which plays some of the more progressive rock from today.

In the old days, they used to play entire album sides later on at night. Returning to this format would get my attention (and recorder) going. That was also the way I got new music, listening to FM with the reel to reel at the ready, hitting the record button when I heard a new song.

Wayner

[macrojack]

When FM station ownership restrictions were lifted in the 1980s, the end began. It is now fully corporatized and there is no trace of the soulful, creative, exciting medium we knew in the 60s and 70s.

In those days, FM was the grapevine for our generation. If anything happened (or didn't) anywhere in our country or GB, we knew about it in an hour or so. There were a few stations in any area not 100 million sites like we have now. And the info sources were much more conscious and accountable than today's shouters. FM fueled the rebellion of the 60s and that is why it was one of the first things targeted when the gentry once again got us under control.

I listen to NPR because it doesn't ram itself into my ears like commercial radio does and it talks to me as if I was an adult. The mainstream stuff just panders.

[doug s.]

 I used to support our public radio station year after year, even when I could barely afford to.  One year they decided that I would be better off listening to talk of the nation and all of that other yakity-yak chit-chat stuff instead of the great jazz music they used to provide. Talk talk talk for 15 hours of the day or more. A little music thrown your way after 7pm. Weekends were worse.

They keep sending me reminder statements asking for money. They have the nerve to say "We know you're listening and you should pay for the service that is so important to you".  They're so clueless.

they're clueless unless you keep writing them to tell them why you have stopped donating, every time you receive a reminder.  that's what i have done w/a station i listen to here - they have incrementally changed their format to less music, more news, driven my fave music shows to the wee morning hours; and added hip-hop to a prime time weekday evening show.  i continually remind them why i have stopped donating, after ~15 years of support.  i also mention that maybe that's why their fund drives now take longer, and have to be run more frequently.  (this station is funded 100% by listeners.)

doug s.

[doug s.]

easily 90% of my critical listening is done w/a quality fm tuna.  fm will easily outlast anyone posting in this forum.  but, quality programming will be hit or miss, depending on where you are located.  f

   I don't disagree with your point on the possible quality. I have in the past been very satisfied with FM when everything is perfect. But the times that it has been perfect have dramatically decreased over the past 25-30 years. And I am pretty well certain that no one is making any money off of it, which means it's not long for the world as a mass medium.

    Brett

macrojack nailed it - the deregulation of the industry allowed a couple of mega-corporations to move in, and now most all commercial fm radio is a vast wasteland, both content and sound quality.  (tcg, are you listening?  deregulation is the cause of our troubles, not the other way around!    )

doug s.

[Minn Mark]

WAYNER radio ? !

I LOVE IT !

Wayner, count me IN !  Let's buy a big houseboat, float it out on Lake Minnetonka, find a way to gimble mount the turntables and, ......have at it !   Let the ice freeze us in, we'll get the beer by dogsled or Arctic-cats.  Float plane fly-in delivery of pizza?  Could be an option.  What hell, lets seceed (sic) and start crankin' out the watts (via AVA?) of tunes.

"Long live the Fighters". Paul Muad-dib (the original  )

Cheers,

Mark

[turkey]

I listen to NPR because it doesn't ram itself into my ears like commercial radio does and it talks to me as if I was an adult. The mainstream stuff just panders.

I mostly listen to NPR too, and for the same reasons. We also have a good commercial classical station that I like to listen to sometimes. Unfortunately, their transmitter seems to be powered by gerbils and they tire easily, so I don't always get a good signal.

[doug s.]

I have a big roof-top ChannelMaster antenna that goes into super deep fringe. I think I can safely say that the FM band is filled with stations, for now.

  Number of stations is certainly not the problem for me, nor is the broadcast power a big issue. But the multipath around here is *brutal* and short of putting up a giant dish (big enough to handle 39" of emitter) I can't find a way around it. And I have boxes full of antennas that just don't work.

    Brett

in your box of antennae, is there a directional yagi, designed for roof-mounting on a rotator?  this is your best defense against multipath.

also, you may want to try the diminutive sony xdr-f1hd - easily the best tuna receptionwise of any tuna i, (and many other tuna fanatics) have tried.  while its sonics are merely adequate compared to better wintage analog tuna, it can be improved dramatically by modding, (see http://www.radioxtuners.com/ ), or adding a tube buffer stage, or both.

doug s.

[doug s.]

So other than the programming, what makes for a quality FM broadcast?  What can the station do to improve the quality of their signal?

poor quality broadcasting is primarily due to analog compression, where there is no dynamic range.  everything is LOUD!!!  with new digital technology, some stations may also sin by using data compression, similar to xm, sirius, mp3, etc...

for a station to improve its signal quality, in most cases, less is more.

doug s.

[Brett Buck]

So other than the programming, what makes for a quality FM broadcast?  What can the station do to improve the quality of their signal?

poor quality broadcasting is primarily due to analog compression, where there is no dynamic range.  everything is LOUD!!!  with new digital technology, some stations may also sin by using data compression, similar to xm, sirius, mp3, etc...

for a station to improve its signal quality, in most cases, less is more.

doug s.

   As far as I can tell almost all the local commercial stations are full digital and store the data as 128K MP3 or equivalent. The compression artifacts on the high frequencies are unmistakable even on the "Mach 460" factory radio in my Cobra with 70 mph road noise. Even the weak and multipath-laden KCSM jazz station sounds better, at least when it comes in at all.

      Brett

[Brett Buck]

I have a big roof-top ChannelMaster antenna that goes into super deep fringe. I think I can safely say that the FM band is filled with stations, for now.

  Number of stations is certainly not the problem for me, nor is the broadcast power a big issue. But the multipath around here is *brutal* and short of putting up a giant dish (big enough to handle 39" of emitter) I can't find a way around it. And I have boxes full of antennas that just don't work.

    Brett

in your box of antennae, is there a directional yagi, designed for roof-mounting on a rotator?  this is your best defense against multipath.

also, you may want to try the diminutive sony xdr-f1hd - easily the best tuna receptionwise of any tuna i, (and many other tuna fanatics) have tried.  while its sonics are merely adequate compared to better wintage analog tuna, it can be improved dramatically by modding, (see http://www.radioxtuners.com/ ), or adding a tube buffer stage, or both.

doug s.

  My best results were with the Tivoli Model 2 used as a tuner, and a Parsec ARC antenna. The Parsec did much better than any of the external antennas.

    Brett