Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps

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bmckenney

Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps
« on: 17 Nov 2009, 02:29 am »
Just wanted to share my impressions of treating my room with 7 bass traps.  No reflection treatment to speak of.  The results are not at all what I expected, which I've noticed others have stated before.  Assuming that no reflection points are being treated with my setup, then I guess it is fair to say all of what I notice is based on smoothing out the frequency response.

Bass is obviously more defined but so are all frequencies.  So the frequency response sounds more natural.  Midrange?  Listening to spoken voice is a great way to listen to midrange and I can tell you it's not an exaggeration to say that it seems as if someone is in the room with me, even better than actually having someone in the room actually.  Real people don't speak as good as what I'm hearing.  I know there still frequency response peaks and valleys but compared to my untreated room, FR is obviously improved. 

There is a very noticeable improvement in transparency.  By that I mean I hear more detail in the recordings.  As if the recording details were masked before and now they are not.  What more can be said?  How about to what degree?  How about more than twice as good?

I'd group imaging and soundstage together and both are very much improved too.   I wasn't expecting a wider and deeper soundstage from bass trapping, but that's what I noticed.  I suppose this might be related to the increased transparency too.

I'm saving the best of what I hear to last.  Dynamics.  I was not expecting this at all.  But now that I think about it, it does make sense.  The leading edge of a big dynamic is startling, fast, explosive.  And micro dynamics, because there is less smearing, is so delicate and sweet goes on forever.  Maybe the flatter response highlights the leading edge and decay in such a way that I perceive such an improvement with dynamics.

One more thing on the sonics.  I did tell my wife that I would listen at quieter levels if I was able to get room treatments.  I suppose that is true in a sense, but I really want to listen louder now.  It is now easier on the ears when listening louder.  Less breakup at higher SPLs.

One more comment on the sonics before I hit the post button.  My son was practicing piano today and it sounded quite different to me from another room, one level down.  I went in to the room, and I know it sounded better.  I asked him if he noticed any changes.  And he said yes, Dad, it sounds more spacious.  I think he's starting to develop his first understanding of a soundstage!

The products I am using are:

4 GIK Tri Traps.  I have one located in each front wall corner.  And I have two stacked in the back left corner.  There isn't a back right corner because of an  opening to the front foyer of the house.

3 Real Trap Minis.  I have two installed up on the right side wall/ceiling boundary closer to the front wall.  I had a third one up there close to the foyer but after I measured bass build up in that location I noticed there wasn't much there, so I removed it.  And I put it on the front wall, in the center, between the speakers.  It stands up when listening and will go down on the floor out of sight when not, so the wife isn't bothered with the looks as much.

I'm quite pleased with the products I chose.  Performance wise, I can't say much about what is better because i have no clue.  I just know the net result is great.  I'm also very pleased with how I was able to do this by putting them in locations that aren't that obtrusive.  The front wall is out of the way and the corner traps don't show much, and I'll hide them more with some creeping potted plants on top or something.  The two panels on the ceiling actually look good, probably because it works with the vaulted open beam ceiling look.  The two traps in the back right corner needs some work.  My camo job with the big plant doesn't really work.  But all in all, I'm very pleased I could get the acoustic improvements I did by treating the perimeter of the two ends of the room.  I don't know if I'll ever treat the side walls because of furniture, art, piano and my understanding but not a push over wife.  Besides, my speakers don't disperses to the side.  I might do the ceiling reflection points one day.  Maybe my next area of focus will be the front wall behind each speaker (dipole midrange driver) with HF absorbers or perhaps diffusers.

Service?  What can I say about working with both companies.  I had fantastic service over several months of planning, plotting, budgeting.  They do have some products that are similar but they also have products that are different enough that it was inevitable that I ended up with some from each company.  These guys are also so very complimentary of each other.  They play very, very well together, but still look after their own business.  Its refreshing to see, after putting up with a lot of other audio industry people who can be nasty to each other.

First pic is from the rear wall facing the front wall, trying to show the panels up by the ceiling, corner traps and the one panel in the middle.  Second picture is the back left corner with the stacked Tri Traps.





Bryan

mshan

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Re: Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps
« Reply #1 on: 17 Nov 2009, 03:09 am »
Kind of sounds like everything you describe is due to increased articulation.

I was thinking about picking up some GIK panels myself.


Rob Babcock

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Re: Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps
« Reply #2 on: 17 Nov 2009, 05:04 am »
Nice looking setup!  No doubt, treating the low end really opens up everything else, too.

oneinthepipe

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Re: Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps
« Reply #3 on: 17 Nov 2009, 07:41 am »
Good going, Bryan.

Very nice looking room, too.

bpape

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Re: Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps
« Reply #4 on: 17 Nov 2009, 11:58 am »
Kind of sounds like everything you describe is due to increased articulation.

I was thinking about picking up some GIK panels myself.

Increased ability to hear the articulation due to not being masked by extended bass ringing.

Bryan

Ethan Winer

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Re: Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps
« Reply #5 on: 17 Nov 2009, 01:46 pm »
Just wanted to share my impressions of treating my room with 7 bass traps.

Great post Bryan, thanks for sharing.

--Ethan

jimbop

Re: Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps
« Reply #6 on: 17 Nov 2009, 04:07 pm »
Doesn't the piano in the room have an adverse affect?

bmckenney

Re: Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps
« Reply #7 on: 17 Nov 2009, 05:09 pm »
Doesn't the piano in the room have an adverse affect?

I would say it probably does as a reflection point and maybe even as a resonance.  But it can't be changed so I live with it.

Bryan

TooManyToys

Re: Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps
« Reply #8 on: 17 Nov 2009, 05:46 pm »
I would say it probably does as a reflection point and maybe even as a resonance.  But it can't be changed so I live with it.

Bryan

My wife has those same attributes.

jriggy

Re: Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps
« Reply #9 on: 17 Nov 2009, 09:41 pm »
Thanks for sharing! This just what I wanted to hear  :D
I have my room layout diagram and am about ready to post for help in this matter... Did you start here with direct questions regarding your room or contact the companys directly first?

Glenn Kuras

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Re: Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps
« Reply #10 on: 8 Dec 2009, 03:56 pm »


I was thinking about picking up some GIK panels myself.

Just got this picture from a local customer. I was like WOW!!




Rob Babcock

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Re: Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps
« Reply #11 on: 9 Dec 2009, 11:16 am »


I was thinking about picking up some GIK panels myself.

Just got this picture from a local customer. I was like WOW!!



That's a beautifu setup!  What are those speakers?  I recognize them but I can't quite place 'em...

Rob S.

Re: Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps
« Reply #12 on: 9 Dec 2009, 01:12 pm »
I'd love to see the sides and back of this room!!  Any other treatments in there?

Rob S.

Glenn Kuras

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Re: Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps
« Reply #13 on: 9 Dec 2009, 03:17 pm »
Actually Frank worked with the customer so I just emailed him to comment.

FrankGIK

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Re: Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps
« Reply #14 on: 9 Dec 2009, 03:28 pm »
I'd love to see the sides and back of this room!!  Any other treatments in there?

Rob S.

There are a whole bunch of other treatments in this room, including Monster Bass Traps, more Tri Traps and five or six other art panels.  I don't have any other photos unfortunately.  We've been working with him in stages to get that room just right acoustically...he's a very happy guy, that's for sure.

Frank

kyyuan

Re: Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps
« Reply #15 on: 9 Dec 2009, 03:48 pm »
Those are Sunrays from Tidal Audio, a German company.  The owner of them has a profile on Agon.  The cost of those babies is over $100k.  Tidal Audio makes very, very nice stuff; however, it takes serious $$$ to play in that arena.  For example, its smallest floor-stand speakers start at $25k.  To see and learn more about Tidal, go to Agon under the Speaker section as there is a long thread about it.  Just ignore the first couple of pages.

http://www.tidal-audio.de/english/startenglish.htm




I was thinking about picking up some GIK panels myself.

Just got this picture from a local customer. I was like WOW!!



That's a beautifu setup!  What are those speakers?  I recognize them but I can't quite place 'em...

arthurs

Re: Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps
« Reply #16 on: 9 Dec 2009, 05:31 pm »
Yup, Ozy be the man.....   :thumb:

bmckenney

Re: Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps
« Reply #17 on: 9 Dec 2009, 05:48 pm »
That looks like a very long, and relatively narrow room compared to the length.  The speakers look to be around 10-12 feet off the front wall.  I wonder if that was a semi purpuse built listening room or just an adopted one.  I'll bet it sounds pretty spectactular.  Heck, I bet it would sound great with a well thought out system that cost under $20K.

ozy

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Re: Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps
« Reply #18 on: 9 Dec 2009, 07:14 pm »
hi all,
 thank you glenn and frank for posting  my room pic! your(Gik) products have improved the sound  significantly!  as for the speakers, yes ,they are the tidal sunrays, as mr. yuan  had mentioned.
 the electronics are gryphon,  and esoteric and   cabling is  siltech.
 the room has 5 gik monster traps,8 art panels and   maple wood diffusers by core audio designs. more pictures wil follow.
 thanks again for all of  your kind words.

Jonathon Janusz

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Re: Finally have all my GIK and Real Traps bass traps
« Reply #19 on: 12 Dec 2009, 06:01 pm »
If you don't mind my asking, is that a window on the left and a diffuser on the right?  If so, how was the window treated?


Beautiful room!