[RCduck7]

Since the 968 is now out for some time and the hype is gone would they really be a worthwhile upgrade over the 938?
Since i found the highs of the 938 in my setup to be sweet and a bit polite and laidback, i read reviews of the 968 saying the sound of the 968 was less hard and more polite??
This got me in doubt if i would like them more.
Any experiences, comments??

[PaulFolbrecht]

The 938 is such a well-balanced speaker I would never, ever buy the 968 without an extensive audition in my home.  I have doubts they have improved anything seriously, and it might well be worse.  For one thing I think that removing the horn-loaded tweeter was a concession to aesthetics and NOT sound quality.

True, the bass down go another 5 cycles lower but I'd still want a sub for rock so no advantage.

[amnullpunkt]

Somewhere - perhaps in this circle - I came across a potentially worrying piece of information: there is a detailed review of the 968 on IAR site  - http://www.iar-80.com/page156.html -
which is less than enthusiastic about the speaker (contrary to, say, Jim Hannon in Absolute Sound, who raves about it), pointing out serious shortcomings in its design (problems with phase and the bass) and therefore the sound quality.
I wonder whether anyone has an opinion about this.

Thanks

EMS

[PaulFolbrecht]

Somewhere - perhaps in this circle - I came across a potentially worrying piece of information: there is a detailed review of the 968 on IAR site  - http://www.iar-80.com/page156.html -
which is less than enthusiastic about the speaker (contrary to, say, Jim Hannon in Absolute Sound, who raves about it), pointing out serious shortcomings in its design (problems with phase and the bass) and therefore the sound quality.
I wonder whether anyone has an opinion about this.

"Worrying"?  What does that mean?  Does the speaker sound good or not?

This piece reads like it was written by an objectivist who knows just enough to be dangerous - and hears what he thinks he ought to hear.  "The Hyperion HPS-968 sounds hugely wrong throughout the midrange"?  What a preposterous statement.

It is very COMMON for the mid driver of a three-way speaker to be out of phase, and for good reasons.  Yes, some people say the phase anomalies are audible - and some say they aren't.  One thing is for sure - it is subtle at best and doesn't 'ruin' a speaker.

Secondly, his comment about the bass module acting "like a subwoofer" because it has a low-pass filter was rather nonsensical (and I know he was being complimentary here).  Just about EVERY three-way speaker in the world puts a low-pass on the bass driver(s)!  And, since Hyperion uses a first-order filter, as he is well-aware, he is entirely wrong to imply that they are handling no higher-frequency information - that is a very gentle slope.

I skimmed the second page very quickly.  I would not put too much credence in anything this guy has to say about audio.

[amnullpunkt]

"Worrying" ... well as I reside in Switzerland, it turns out that I cannot audition before deciding to buy. (The local representative doesn't stock the speakers; recommends them only.) Hence the 'caution'.
Your remarks may be spot on, I don't know. In the meantime I came across a review on the British AV Forum where the issues raised in the IAR critique are confirmed.
What I am searching for is a speaker that is very well integrated across the frequency range, is linear and dynamic. In addition, staging and imaging are important features (for me). I presently listen to either Martin Logan Ascents or Anthony Gallo Ref. 3.1. The former has the huge sound stage and transparency from the mid-range up (the very top could be more etched), but being a hybrid bass integration is sometimes a question. The Gallo really does all these things 'right', but I find the projection of the speaker restricted.  Curious whether your experience with Hyperion covers all these bases ... and more.

Thnaks for your observations

[PaulFolbrecht]

"Worrying" ... well as I reside in Switzerland, it turns out that I cannot audition before deciding to buy. (The local representative doesn't stock the speakers; recommends them only.) Hence the 'caution'.
Your remarks may be spot on, I don't know. In the meantime I came across a review on the British AV Forum where the issues raised in the IAR critique are confirmed.
What I am searching for is a speaker that is very well integrated across the frequency range, is linear and dynamic. In addition, staging and imaging are important features (for me). I presently listen to either Martin Logan Ascents or Anthony Gallo Ref. 3.1. The former has the huge sound stage and transparency from the mid-range up (the very top could be more etched), but being a hybrid bass integration is sometimes a question. The Gallo really does all these things 'right', but I find the projection of the speaker restricted.  Curious whether your experience with Hyperion covers all these bases ... and more.

What does "confirmed" mean?  Yes, the mid driver is wired out of phase - like 50% or more of the three-way speakers on the market.  Of what value are these observations?  The vast, vast majority of reviews, both pro and user, of the speaker are very positive.

But then it would be foolish to buy a speaker unheard under almost any circumstances.

I have never really heard MLs as I don't care for planars but owned the Gallo Ref 3s actually at the same time as my first pair of Hyperion 938s 3+ years ago.  To my ear the 938 was superior in all regards.  Or almost.  The Gallo did have a more airy and extended upper end (ribbon tweeter).  But the 938s are more pure sounding (very low distortion, I think), imaged at least as well (to me that is an audiophile trick that means little), and most importantly and better tonality and more natural midrange and bass.  The bass of the 938 is really underrated, I think; it is very natural and tactile.

So, if you can trust me, buy the 938.

[RCduck7]

For one thing I think that removing the horn-loaded tweeter was a concession to aesthetics and NOT sound quality.

I was thinking about that to a while ago.

[RCduck7]

Where i live it is difficult to listen to a pair of 968's at my home though.
I should concentrate on experimenting with matching components and fine tuning in the near future on the 938's, to get an idea what works and what doesn't on them.
Allthough i should have the chance to audition XTZ speakers soon, they are very good price/quality wise but to be honest i don't think i will come across another speaker like the Hyperion 938 that has that magic for me.
Another dealer told me i could do better and cheaper with Defenitive Technology ST Mythos speakers?!? Any thoughts on the above speakers are welcome. Allthough i found that my 906 speakers (that i use as rears) were more present and slightly more upfront in their presentation but they have to much emphasis on the highs compared to the 938. The 938's are a bit more easy sounding but i would like find a dose of that upfront energy in the 938's to, especially in the mid/high.

[RCduck7]

First couple of tweaks are done and with positive effect!
I had a power conditioner but replaced it with a balanced line transformer.

I don't really have a dedicated circuit for my hifi but made sure no refrigirator, freezer or any other device was on the same circuit. Still, mains disturbances can be had from neighbours using devices. I used a good isolation transformer and i'm very happy with what it did to the sound. It doesn't compromise on dynamics like many conditioners do. The sound is clear, good seperation of instruments, more realistic and easier to the ears as before. Before that i did try a PS audio Quintet conditioner block that i lend from a friend. It gave instant a very big diference but not in a way i like. Music sounded to soft, boring, loss of dynamics... I don't know about their powercenters if their any good from PS audio but from my experience they are very expensive and it had a negative impact so far with some other posters i know on forums to.

Before i had that isolation transformer i experimented with mains cables and i had good results with a WireWorld but with the isolation transformer installed differences are not that noticeable anymore with mains cables. I think that proves how much more important clean power is from the start then try to cure the problem with mains cables and conditioners.

To have even better results you can use 2 or more isolation transformers, 1 with a 1000VA rating for amp(s) and 1 with a 500VA rating for preamp/sources for instance. And i shouldn't connect a plasma screen to the same isolation transformer where all the sound equipment is on.

2nd fine tuning was reversing the phase of the midrange as suggested on these forums. Easy to do as i triwire (with the Anti Cable speaker cable)
I couldn't really say what was different but it seemed it sounded right, as it should sound. I read some reversed the bass driver to, i didn't... with my mains problem tackled bass was better. Is reversing the phase of the bass driver recommended to when reversing the phase of the midrange driver???

My DAC (Xindak DAC-8) has also a tube output besides it's solid state output, i seemed to like the tube output more with voices, acoustic instruments but a bit less with dynamic recordings like pop/rock.
Someone adviced me to try and change the tube inside the dac with a JJ E88CC goldpin, it should sound more fresh and dynamic. While i have to open up my DAC to replace the tube i might as well change the fuse (or fuses) with a  better quality to. Xindak sells high grade fuses but i'm not sure if they are included in the components they sell to. I should mail them for information about this.