Best place for GIK panels ...

Marc B · « **on:** 9 Sep 2009, 11:40 pm »

I ordered some GIK panels ,6x242s and 2x mega bass traps, but must have accidently ordered 4x 244s (i wondered why my order was more expensive, but anyway...)

My room is roughly 13ft x 11ft x 8ft and pretty bare with a couch , hifi and tv.

My original plan was to use 242s as 2 each side wall reflection points and 2 on the rear with the large bass traps in the corners behind my speakers.
Now I have the 4x244s and 6x242s I'm wondering whats the best way to set up ? (hanging on ceiling is a big NO by the way)

I've set them up this way..

244s in each corner behind the speakers and 2x 244s horizontal behind my head and above the couch. Also 3x 242s on each side wall.

Is this the best way to set them up ? Do I have too many now and would I be better off not using some of them ?
Also , I'm struggling getting a good centre image with the traps in place, any suggestions ?

thanks

Marc

pics..

bmckenney · « **Reply #1 on:** 10 Sep 2009, 03:48 am »

Doesn't GIK in the UK have someone you can talk to on the phone? I know Bryan in the US was very good about discussing placement when I was scoping things out.

Glenn Kuras · « **Reply #2 on:** 10 Sep 2009, 12:46 pm »

Quote from: bmckenney on 10 Sep 2009, 03:48 am

Doesn't GIK in the UK have someone you can talk to on the phone? I know Bryan in the US was very good about discussing placement when I was scoping things out.

Actually Bryan covers both the US and Europe.

Marc,
I just sent Bryan a email to jump in here to give you a hand. It might be best to send him a email also so he can go over your room to give you a little more one on one service.

This email is Bryan.p at Gikacoustics dot com.

bpape · « **Reply #3 on:** 10 Sep 2009, 01:15 pm »

Hey Marc

That setup doesn't look bad. I might consider playing with the 2 horizontal panels on the side walls in different places - potentially hung straddling the front wall/ceiling junction.

Bryan

Marc B · « **Reply #4 on:** 10 Sep 2009, 01:38 pm »

thanks for that

Hi Bryan, which one do you mean ?

1. same wall as it's already on flat in the corner
2. wall near window
3. diagnal across the corner, directly above the 244 panel

I was thinking that since I haven't got any in the rear corners that 242s placed here may be better , though it has to be higher as the door handle will hit them ?

thanks

bpape · « **Reply #5 on:** 10 Sep 2009, 02:31 pm »

Actually, I was thinking about hanging them horizontally and straddling the wall/ceiling junction rather than the wall/wall junction. So, you'd have 1 4' edge on the ceiling and 1 4' edge on the wall - facing them down into the room at 45 degrees.

Bryan

Marc B · « **Reply #6 on:** 12 Sep 2009, 05:39 pm »

I can't place them on the ceiling due to the place being rented.

I'm thinking of either another pair of 244s or the larger bass traps. Placing the larger bass traps in the corners to replace the 244s , but where then would be the best place to put the 244s ?

I've discovered placing the 242s really high totally robs the room of any ambiance.. really dead sounding. Not sure if I like it like that as it's very unatural sounding.

cheers

srlaudio · « **Reply #7 on:** 14 Sep 2009, 08:16 pm »

Hello. You have found out what we already know.... to much absorption kills the room. Hello....... we have known this for 30 years... is anyone listening? You need some of our properly designed diffusion panels. They will radically improve your room and leave with dough left over to expand your music library. How does THAT sound???

http://www.srlaudio.com/woodsyi.pdf
http://www.srlaudio.com/dan_penn_studio.pdf

Allen Rumbaugh
SRL Acoustics

Glenn Kuras · « **Reply #8 on:** 15 Sep 2009, 01:13 pm »

Quote

I've discovered placing the 242s really high totally robs the room of any ambiance.. really dead sounding. Not sure if I like it like that as it's very unatural sounding.

You could then place something like your D1 below to start on some diffusion. What you are going for is over all balance in the room.

oneinthepipe · « **Reply #9 on:** 15 Sep 2009, 08:39 pm »

Quote from: srlaudio on 14 Sep 2009, 08:16 pm

Hello. You have found out what we already know.... to much absorption kills the room. Hello....... we have known this for 30 years... is anyone listening? You need some of our properly designed diffusion panels. They will radically improve your room and leave with dough left over to expand your music library. How does THAT sound???

http://www.srlaudio.com/woodsyi.pdf
http://www.srlaudio.com/dan_penn_studio.pdf

Allen Rumbaugh
SRL Acoustics

The other "professional" circle members don't disagree with you. When I initially sought assistance on this circle, Bryan suggested diffusion on my ceiling. GIK designs and manufactures diffusers, and Real Traps designs and manufactures diffusers. I think that everyone is listening. I don't know whether or not everyone will agree that "You need some of our properly designed diffusion panels," as you posted in another thread. You seem to be very knowledgeable, and I do not have any reason to believe that you don't make a great product, but your posts seem overly zealous, almost combative. For me, just someone that enjoys listening to audio, wants to learn as much as possible, and is not in the audio business, the hostility detracts from the discussion.

Regardless, if I had a larger room and the financial resources, I would give significant consideration to your products and other manufacturers' diffusion products.

Vinyl-Addict · « **Reply #10 on:** 15 Sep 2009, 08:55 pm »

Quote from: srlaudio on 14 Sep 2009, 08:16 pm

Hello. You have found out what we already know.... to much absorption kills the room. Hello....... we have known this for 30 years... is anyone listening? You need some of our properly designed diffusion panels. They will radically improve your room and leave with dough left over to expand your music library. How does THAT sound???

http://www.srlaudio.com/woodsyi.pdf
http://www.srlaudio.com/dan_penn_studio.pdf

Allen Rumbaugh
SRL Acoustics

Allen, Since the room in question looks very small, where would you recommend placing your diffusors?

Marc B · « **Reply #11 on:** 16 Sep 2009, 08:53 am »

Quote from: srlaudio on 14 Sep 2009, 08:16 pm

Hello. You have found out what we already know.... to much absorption kills the room............

I'm in the UK and as far as I know your products aren't for sale here ?

Also , I've read conflicting info stating that in smaller rooms you shouldn't worry too much about diffusion - which is why I went for absorption.

out of interest, how much do those huge skyline diffusors cost ?

DTB300 · « **Reply #12 on:** 16 Sep 2009, 01:00 pm »

Quote from: Marc B on 16 Sep 2009, 08:53 am

out of interest, how much do those huge skyline diffusors cost ?

And what are the Skylines made of??? Wood??

Marc B · « **Reply #13 on:** 18 Sep 2009, 09:59 pm »

Ok , done a few test sweeps for bass (by ear as I don't have a mic) and it's pretty even apart from a large peak at around 180-200hz..

Any ideas ?

bpape · « **Reply #14 on:** 18 Sep 2009, 10:38 pm »

Did you move the panels as I suggested?

Just having 1 easily audible peak when sitting that close to a wall is actually pretty good.

Bryan

Marc B · « **Reply #15 on:** 18 Sep 2009, 11:15 pm »

I've done a few bass tests and I get a roll off at about 35hz which I guess is about right for the Dali H400 speakers.. they are pulled out quite a bit into the room though. I'll try and get a mic next week and do a few plot charts.

I can't put the panels onto the ceiling as I rent this place and I wouldn't be in my landlords good books if I started putting holes in it.
I did try the 242s higher up the wall towards the ceiling and as I've already stated, it sucked out all the life from the room.
The 242s are now directly left/right of my head and about 3ft off the ground to clear the door handle. To be honest , I don't think they're doing much where they are but it looks neater

It's a shame you don't make the thick bass traps in 2x2 squares as I could fit them in 4 ceiling corners then.

Glenn Kuras · « **Reply #16 on:** 18 Sep 2009, 11:35 pm »

Quote

It's a shame you don't make the thick bass traps in 2x2 squares as I could fit them in 4 ceiling corners then.

Sure we can make them into 2x2 squares.

Marc B · « **Reply #17 on:** 18 Sep 2009, 11:45 pm »

PM sent

srlaudio · « **Reply #18 on:** 7 Oct 2009, 03:16 pm »

I would take the side wall panels down and reposition them. Behind the speakers stack one on each side to give floor to ceiling absorption. On the side walls, place the SRL three piece one diffuser. In a 45 inch horizontal this makes a prime 23 QRD. I am not trying to sound combative, let me tell you about how my process is different. I discovered that high density polystyrene is a good material to make diffusers of, all of my products are cut from a solid block, this differs from the stamped plastic used by the other manufacturers. Stamped plastic is not manageable in a large format, and the expense of making a mold is considerable. I created many designs in lots of sizes, and had them all made, in the factory it is just a matter of changing the software to generate different designs. This gave me a large batch of diffusers, large and small. I found in listening tests that the larger units had greater effect, and the model I have recommended to you is part of that research, I thought that if people were going to buy 2 or 3 of the prime 7 small units, It made more sense to make 3 pieces a sort of puzzle, that you put together to make a bigger picture. I already know that it performs better than 3 identical prime 7 placed side by side......

jtwrace · « **Reply #19 on:** 7 Oct 2009, 04:12 pm »

Quote from: srlaudio on 7 Oct 2009, 03:16 pm

and the expense of making a mold is considerable.

To a point but it's all realative...the consistency pays for itself. I have designed many injection molded parts (not audio related) and have had great success. If there is somewhat high volume, it's a no brainer IMO.