[santacore]

I recently upgraded my Compact Hemps to the current Super 6 Alnico. Overall they're sounding good, but not quite the jump in performance I was hoping for. I'm still playing with placement and since they are only a few months old, they are probably still breaking in. Are they any other Super 6 Alnico owners out there that can suggest some setup tips that might help? Thanks.

[Mariusz]

Hi santacore

No personal experience with 6" alnico drivers but I did A/B comparison between 8" alnicos and ferrites.
Same cabinet, same setup with few audiophiles as judges. We all agreed that Alnicos were better either tho ferrite drivers were already broken-in and alnicos had about 50h on them.
We swapped  drivers at least 4 times with same results.

In short - alnicos were a bit smoother and had better balance from top to bottom.

edit
Forgot to add that the difference wasn't day and night but audible. However, ferrites are still a very good drivers.


Mariusz

[Alwayswantmore]

I recently upgraded my Compact Hemps to the current Super 6 Alnico. Overall they're sounding good, but not quite the jump in performance I was hoping for. I'm still playing with placement and since they are only a few months old, they are probably still breaking in. Are they any other Super 6 Alnico owners out there that can suggest some setup tips that might help? Thanks.

I made the same change from the latest Compact Hemp to Super 6 Alnico monitors. Both used with sub woofer. Eventually I also upgraded the sub from ACI Force XL to Deep Hemp.

I listen nearfield with great electronics (IMO). I have my speakers out from back wall in a small bed room. But have about to $1.5K in GIK bass traps / room treatments. I also spent more than a few hours playing with placment / angles. Sand-filled Syland stands.

BTW: Breakin for Alnicos is MUCH less than the standard Hemp drivers.

I found the Alnicos better in all ways, with one exception as follows...

Biggest improvements:

- Bass articulation (very clean and tight)
- Overall balance
- Tone and quality of voice and acoustic instruments
- Lack of any glare or honk in mids/highs
- Smooth as silk for vocals / wind & brass instruments (never fatiguing)
- Guitar and piano sound very natural

Biggest loss:

- Macro dynamics, where loud crescendos are better with the 8" Hemp

Personally I love my system and get plenty of Wows! from those that hear it.

Both speakers sound good, but to me the Alnico is more refined and better balanced. So it's not like going from a Honda Fit to a top-of-the-line Lexus.

Kent

[santacore]

Thanks for the input guys. I agree with both of you on all accounts. The 6's are an improvement across the board with the exception of the size of the sound they put out. I knew going into it that a 6" driver would never deliver the same sound as an 8" driver. I think it's just going to take a while to get used to them.

Alwayswantmore, could you tell me what kind of toe in you found the best? I've tried a number of different options, but still haven't found the sweet spot. Any input would be appreciated.

Thanks!

[Capt. Z]

I have XRS 5 and was wondering how the compare to the Omega 6. One of the big drawbacks on the 5's is the small size woofer cannot move huge loads of air, so sometimes I can hear the small size of the 4,5 inch driver.

Reading the comment from Santacore I can see that he can hear the smaller size driver of the Super 6.

I guess that is the one draw back we have to pay for having a superfast and imdeiate sounding and great emotionally envolving single driver speaker.

[Alwayswantmore]

I've done very well on the image, to the point the speakers are absolutely gone on most material. I listen near-field, and the speakers are probably a little further apart than I am in front of them. They cross behind my listening position. I'm not at home, but think the inside edge of the speaker is lined up with my eyes (I'll check this). I might even be seeing some of the inside edge.

My ears are at center of driver height for vertical.

Everything is away from walls. I also have points of first reflection covered with acoustic panels and a number of bass traps.

The Acoustics Circle on AC was very helpful in selecting room treatments.

I always listen with grills off.

Kent

[santacore]

Capt.Z, yes I definitely noticed a difference going from an 8" driver to a 6". Things definitely sound a bit less full and the bass is reduced. That said, I think the 6" driver sounds faster, and the quality of the bass is better. Overall, I'm still unclear whether the changes I'm hearing are due to the size of the driver, or design of the driver.

Alwayswantmore, thanks for the input. That's the kind of setup tips I was hoping for.

[Mariusz]

I've done very well on the image, to the point the speakers are absolutely gone on most material. I listen near-field, and the speakers are probably a little further apart than I am in front of them. They cross behind my listening position

I have had the same setup in my basement while breaking in speakers and cables and in fact Omega speakers are capable of disappearing act.

Capt.Z, yes I definitely noticed a difference going from an 8" driver to a 6". Things definitely sound a bit less full and the bass is reduced. That said, I think the 6" driver sounds faster, and the quality of the bass is better. Overall, I'm still unclear whether the changes I'm hearing are due to the size of the driver, or design of the driver.

I did not make my own tests but from what I've heard at Louis factory demo room listening to some smaller drivers in different enclosures that soundstage, speed and image is on par with your findings.
It's not surprising tho.
8" drivers will have a fuller presentation but can't compete with attributes of smaller drivers.

For instance, Louis show me some tinny speakers which look kind of odd but sounded quite amazing however, lock dynamics and extension of their bigger brothers.  Using sub with those is mandatory.

Mariusz




 

[Alwayswantmore]

Hi Santacore, this will give you a better idea of my set up.

The room is a small bedroom, unlistenable without room treatments. I have GIK tricorners running floor to ceiling in front corners (9' ceiling). 6" GIK Monster bass traps: 1 below plasma TV and 3 on back wall (covers 4' x 6' area), 242s at first point of reflection. And I open a closet on one back corner with 242 hung on side wall inside closet, and the closet is fairly full of clothes (making it an acoustic trap of sorts). Also have long hallway on opposite back corner, so both back corners are not typical.

When I listen to music, I move a stressless recliner in front / middle of speakers. I also take grills off and cover plasma TV with light blanket.

From front / center of drivers:

Speaker width 6 feet
Front of speak to ears (measured at 90 degree angle to the front plane of driver centers (i.e.not measured from speaker directly to ear), just under 4 feet
Front of speaker from back wall, 4'3"
Front / center of speaker to side wall 3'6"

Regarding the angle on the speaker: I see A LOT of inside edge on both speakers. I would guess the speakers intersect 6-10 feet behind my ears.

Regarding difference from Compact Hemps to Super 6, Compact Hemp is impressive in terms of dynamics. I don't listen ultra loud, so I really don't know how the two compare if pushed to the edge. But the Alnicos have it in spades in terms of tone. And as you've noticed, Alnicos do better in terms of bass articulation, balance across the frequencies. I also feel they image better. And they never bite, no matter what the material.

Bear in mind I have a DeepHemp and RWA Isabella with DAC and Signature 30.2 amp, running NOS Aperex tubes (don't recall the number, but Vinnie favored them for the price). So backgrounds are ultra black, lots of tone and depth in all acoustic instruments, excellent image and soundstage and the list goes on. There are times you could swear a vocalist, sax or guitar player is in the room standing 6 - 10 feet in front of you. Yes the near-field see up is intimate. But the sound with the right recordings can be so real.

Photo attached. Taken with flash at night, so very grainy.

If you?ve never tried near-field with Omega single drivers, you should at least give it a try.  For small rooms is a must. But even in a large room you may find it interesting if not preferable.

One other note, I have wood sub floors (basement home). On some cuts, the DeepHemp shakes my listening chair like a virtual reality ride. Electronics and sub on Timbernation Maple stands spiked to floors.

Hope this helps. Kent

[santacore]

Kent,

Thanks so much for taking the time to explain everything so well. You've given me a lot of great ideas that I'm going to play with. 

[Alwayswantmore]

Kent,

Thanks so much for taking the time to explain everything so well. You've given me a lot of great ideas that I'm going to play with. 

Good luck. I guess what I've found with my last round of major upgrads (Alnicos / Vinnies vacuum tube pre and NOS DAC) is that I am much more in tune with tone. My main focus used to be detail, air and soundstage/image. Alnicos and my latest moves in electronics has me focused on how real things sound -- especially tone/timber.