is there any way to change the phase plug finish from copper to brushed metal?

JP78 · « **on:** 8 Aug 2009, 12:13 am »

my parents are toying with the idea of upgrading their 10 year old nht vt 2.4 towers, and i've recommended the ht-3 among a few other speakers. mom really likes the way they look except for the copper phase plug. everything in the living room is finished in brushed nickel, and she's a stickler for details. since (to my understanding) the phase plug is purely mechanical in nature and not involved in the signal path, is there any way to apply a chemical or coating to change the finish? i would prefer any type of silver metallic, but i think even black would do.

thanks,

jp

richidoo · « **Reply #1 on:** 8 Aug 2009, 12:46 am »

Tell her that once she gets the Salks she will soon turn into an insane audiophile and the color of the cones will be the least of her problems.

There's probably a lacquer or urethane coating on that copper. Black paint will cover it, just pick the right kind for the substrate, or strip and try again if the top coats wrinkles the original base. Something like this:
http://www.krylon.com/products/brushed_metallic/ in Satin Nickel color....
My wife is a brushed nickel nut too.

But what if the nickel phase plug doesn't match the silver cone? Two different silvers might be worse than copper. Then you can spray the cones antique brass.

JP78 · « **Reply #2 on:** 8 Aug 2009, 12:54 am »

Quote from: richidoo on 8 Aug 2009, 12:46 am

But what if the nickel phase plug doesn't match the silver cone? Two different silvers might be worse than copper. Then you can spray the cones antique brass.

richardoo - thanks kindly for the help. had quite a good laugh at that one...how right you are

.

is the phase plug removable? I'm obviously worried about getting paint or stripper on the cone material.

richidoo · « **Reply #3 on:** 8 Aug 2009, 01:10 am »

I don't know about the SEAS driver specifically, but the phase plug usually just screws in. Best wait for advice from Jim. Maybe he can paint it for you as each pair is custom.

JohnR · « **Reply #4 on:** 8 Aug 2009, 01:13 am »

It might screw out but there is probably glue holding it on as well. Some Seas drivers have black or silver plugs, who knows, maybe some of them are interchangeable.

What about grills?

JP78 · « **Reply #5 on:** 8 Aug 2009, 01:15 am »

hey john - no grills on any of the speakers ('grills are so ugly'). whatever the speaker is going to be she ultimately wants a gloss finish with no grill. they picked out the last set of speakers because they came in gloss white and i imagine this set will be no different.

JohnR · « **Reply #6 on:** 8 Aug 2009, 01:17 am »

Awesome - would be a shame to hide those drivers

R Swerdlow · « **Reply #7 on:** 8 Aug 2009, 02:00 am »

The Seas Excel magnesium woofers all have a copper phase plug. There is different woofer, the Nextel W18, that has a coated paper cone and what looks like a brushed aluminum phase cone.

If I recall, Jim and Dennis once tried this driver instead of the Excel W18, but ended up not using it. I can't remember why. Jim or Dennis??

JP78 · « **Reply #8 on:** 8 Aug 2009, 02:06 am »

are the phase plugs the same size? maybe i could just buy a pair of those and swap out the phase plugs and sell the pair if she ends up with the speakers...

mr_bill · « **Reply #9 on:** 8 Aug 2009, 02:20 am »

Quote from: JohnR on 8 Aug 2009, 01:13 am

It might screw out but there is probably glue holding it on as well. Some Seas drivers have black or silver plugs, who knows, maybe some of them are interchangeable.

What about grills?

Jim,
Can you tell me what the two brown finishes are on these ST's or HT2's or whatever they are? (not the HT3)
I like these veneers and would like to know what they are.
Thanks.

R Swerdlow · « **Reply #10 on:** 8 Aug 2009, 02:40 pm »

Quote from: JP78 on 8 Aug 2009, 02:06 am

are the phase plugs the same size? maybe i could just buy a pair of those and swap out the phase plugs and sell the pair if she ends up with the speakers...

I don't know if those phase plugs can be removed easily. I kind of doubt that they could be unscrewed, but I don't have either woofer available to find out.

I mentioned the Nextel woofer because it might be substituted for the Excel woofer. This probably would not be a simple drop-in replacement, as the crossover will also have to be modified. Jim and Dennis should be able to answer this.

jsalk · « **Reply #11 on:** 9 Aug 2009, 02:09 pm »

Quote from: mr_bill on 8 Aug 2009, 02:20 am

Jim,
Can you tell me what the two brown finishes are on these ST's or HT2's or whatever they are? (not the HT3)
I like these veneers and would like to know what they are.
Thanks.

The HT2's on the left were done in block mottled imbuya. The SongTowers are pal dao rosewood.

As for the question about the color of the phase plug, I don't know that I would want to try changing it. It seems like a risky proposition that could potentially ruin an expensive driver.

If it is a ciritcal issue, the Nextel version of the W18 may be the answer. At one time, we did develop a Nextel version of the HT3. But it didn't really sound much different than the original, so there was no reason to offer it as a standard design. But we could probably do a "one-off" design with this driver instead.

My recommendation, however, would be to go with the standard W18. My guess is that it would take about a week and you'd never notice it again.

- Jim

Jeff B. · « **Reply #12 on:** 9 Aug 2009, 04:39 pm »

I don't believe that the Excel phase plug is detachable. And you would not want to attempt to paint one, as it would be almost impossible to insure that paint does not get into the voice coil. I agree with your recommendation, Jim.

Quote from: jsalk on 9 Aug 2009, 02:09 pm

Quote from: mr_bill on 8 Aug 2009, 02:20 am
Jim,
Can you tell me what the two brown finishes are on these ST's or HT2's or whatever they are? (not the HT3)
I like these veneers and would like to know what they are.
Thanks.

The HT2's on the left were done in block mottled imbuya. The SongTowers are pal dao rosewood.

As for the question about the color of the phase plug, I don't know that I would want to try changing it. It seems like a risky proposition that could potentially ruin an expensive driver.

If it is a ciritcal issue, the Nextel version of the W18 may be the answer. At one time, we did develop a Nextel version of the HT3. But it didn't really sound much different than the original, so there was no reason to offer it as a standard design. But we could probably do a "one-off" design with this driver instead.

My recommendation, however, would be to go with the standard W18. My guess is that it would take about a week and you'd never notice it again.

- Jim

DMurphy · « **Reply #13 on:** 10 Aug 2009, 05:50 am »

Quote from: Jeff B. on 9 Aug 2009, 04:39 pm

I don't believe that the Excel phase plug is detachable. And you would not want to attempt to paint one, as it would be almost impossible to insure that paint does not get into the voice coil. I agree with your recommendation, Jim.

Quote from: jsalk on 9 Aug 2009, 02:09 pm
Quote from: mr_bill on 8 Aug 2009, 02:20 am
Jim,
Can you tell me what the two brown finishes are on these ST's or HT2's or whatever they are? (not the HT3)
I like these veneers and would like to know what they are.
Thanks.

The HT2's on the left were done in block mottled imbuya. The SongTowers are pal dao rosewood.

As for the question about the color of the phase plug, I don't know that I would want to try changing it. It seems like a risky proposition that could potentially ruin an expensive driver.

If it is a ciritcal issue, the Nextel version of the W18 may be the answer. At one time, we did develop a Nextel version of the HT3. But it didn't really sound much different than the original, so there was no reason to offer it as a standard design. But we could probably do a "one-off" design with this driver instead.

My recommendation, however, would be to go with the standard W18. My guess is that it would take about a week and you'd never notice it again.

- Jim

I certainly would not mess around with the phase plug. I think it would take some kind of black magic to pull off a transplant. If the color is an absolute deal breaker, I do have a crossover for the Nextel version of the W18. I think it sounds fine (though not better than the magnesium W18), but I can't see taking a chance on it unless the regular W18 is just absolutely unacceptable aesthetically.

JP78 · « **Reply #14 on:** 10 Aug 2009, 01:52 pm »

thanks very much for the information...certainly it doesn't make sense to be attempting such a risky proposition. i'll take this under advisement and see if we can get a pass on the copper phase plug.

out of curiosity, which woofer is more expensive; the nextel or the excel?

TF1216 · « **Reply #15 on:** 10 Aug 2009, 02:00 pm »

You should contact Paul Hilgeman to ask him how the drivers for his Nomad Audio Ronins were created. He should be able to help out.

R Swerdlow · « **Reply #16 on:** 10 Aug 2009, 05:26 pm »

Quote from: JP78 on 10 Aug 2009, 01:52 pm

thanks very much for the information...certainly it doesn't make sense to be attempting such a risky proposition. i'll take this under advisement and see if we can get a pass on the copper phase plug.

out of curiosity, which woofer is more expensive; the nextel or the excel?

They are essentially the same price. Here are Madisound's prices:

Nextel W18
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=1596

Excel W18
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=784

You'll have to ask Jim what the price difference would be between standard HT3s and ones with the Nextel woofers and the modified crossovers.

earthbound · « **Reply #17 on:** 13 Aug 2009, 09:48 pm »

Quote from: R Swerdlow on 10 Aug 2009, 05:26 pm

They are essentially the same price. Here are Madisound's prices:

Nextel W18
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=1596

Excel W18
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=784

Looks like you have your answer. If the color was a make are break deal for me then I would go for the silver version and never look back!

Nuance · « **Reply #18 on:** 13 Aug 2009, 10:47 pm »

^ Agreed. If it's going to be the difference in getting the HT3s or not, get the silver version, pay whatever extra cost there is to use Dennis' modified crossover (if there even is a cost difference), and ENJOY!

Wayner · « **Reply #19 on:** 13 Aug 2009, 11:04 pm »

They make black colored magic markers.

Wayner