TAS review of the Khartago is out !!

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. Read 8103 times.

Oystein

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 33
TAS review of the Khartago is out !!
« on: 31 Jul 2009, 07:17 am »
As a follow up on the post of Alex G we now can anjoy the mentioned review in The Absolute Sound

I do not know if the magazine is in the stores already but last night I bought the issue online for download.
The review is (as expected) as positive as we can hope for. Jonathan Valin already discussed the Khartago in his blog a few month ago telling it was a special amp without telling all the details as the official piblication of the review had to be done yet.
This is the blog article: http://www.avguide.com/blog/800-wonder-amp
If you can not get a copy of the current issue with the full review yourself I can send you the review as PDF (3 pages).

I am actually looking for an amp and the Khartago (Plus) was high on my list and after the review I will audition one here in The Netherlands with my speakers and if the sound does not let me down (of which I would be really surprised if it did) I will buy myself this terrific amp.


Klaus: you are a hell of a guy giving our hobby so much for so little money  :D

kalel

Re: TAS review of the Khartago is out !!
« Reply #1 on: 6 Aug 2009, 06:18 am »
I received my copy of TAS in today's mail.  The TAS review was a great read and a very nice testament to Klaus, not only as the builder of great audio gear but more importantly (to me) the type of human being he is - - a thoroughly great guy who truly cares about his customers.  Of course, owners of Odyssey Audio and Symphonic Line equipment already knew it.

Thank you, KB.

Willie

mgalusha

Re: TAS review of the Khartago is out !!
« Reply #2 on: 6 Aug 2009, 05:54 pm »
Great review Klaus, congratulations.  :thumb:

I'm guessing the Khartago sounded uncomfortably close to the $115k super amp. Sweet!

Eric

Re: TAS review of the Khartago is out !!
« Reply #3 on: 6 Aug 2009, 07:07 pm »
It was a great review. Congratulations, Klaus

Eduardo AAVM

Re: TAS review of the Khartago is out !!
« Reply #4 on: 8 Aug 2009, 12:29 pm »
After 10 years I have been in contact with Odyssey as promoter and customer this is the very first time I read a review where reviewer talks more openly and clear about the amplifier, in other reviews there is always a feeling of not saying much about the amplifier's performance to not disturb or annoy other manufacturers and their advertisers and their budget.

I really liked this one.
« Last Edit: 10 Aug 2009, 02:23 pm by Eduardo AAVM »

bpape

  • Industry Participant
  • Posts: 4465
  • I am serious and don't call my Shirley
    • Sensible Sound Solutions
Re: TAS review of the Khartago is out !!
« Reply #5 on: 9 Aug 2009, 01:13 pm »
Congrats Klaus.

That's a very nice review indeed.  Better get ramped up to have a good fall business.

Bryan

BobC

Re: TAS review of the Khartago is out !!
« Reply #6 on: 10 Aug 2009, 03:00 pm »
Agree, a nice review and well deserved recognition.

To me the best was the reco from the guy from Magico (Alan Wolf?)

On one hand I like how he compared it to the $40k and $100k+ amps, just for impact...but after thinking a little, I don't.  No one expects a $1K amp to equal or beat a $40k amp, so the words say things like "almost as good as...", "good enough" etc.  To me this has a slight negative spin.  Afterall, I doubt anyone who can afford $100k+ speakers and $50k+ amps, will even be shopping in this range.

I'd rather have seen JV lead with a more realistic comparison.  Say another internet based firm like Emotiva....and talk about how the Odyssey slaughters it.  Then up the ante and discuss how the Odyssey competes with competitors in the price range of $1 - 5k like maybe Rotel, NAD, McIntosh(?), Classe (?), Bryston (?), etc.  Then iceing on the cake would be a final statement or two on how the Odyssey even offers much of what the Soulution does.   

Just my $0.02.
« Last Edit: 10 Aug 2009, 04:00 pm by BobC »

BobC

Re: TAS review of the Khartago is out !!
« Reply #7 on: 10 Aug 2009, 03:01 pm »
Also, I did like the side interview with Klaus, giving him some space to speak.

lazydays

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 1365
Re: TAS review of the Khartago is out !!
« Reply #8 on: 10 Aug 2009, 04:05 pm »
I still think the TAS tested the wrong amps. What I'd liked to have seen them do was a full blown test with Mono SE's or the new Kissmets. The Mono SE's in the glass ceiling mode will kill just about anything under $7500, and the Kissmets take it one step further. So I'm told.
    Audio related magazines are ran on advertiser's cash flow, and your almost never going to see a road test of a smaller outfit for fear that it will make big brother mad. Stereophile is probably the single worst rag at doing this, and I rely very little on what they have to say about anything these days. Their staff is a joke at best! Plus they seem to have lost touch with reallity. Lets face it when the least expensive thing that is passable in your reviews is a $30K turntable; your not in the real world! (in otherwords Freemer is an idiot). So now we have the equipment that fits 98% of the populations wants and needs, but because it's not from one of the good old boys they relegate it to the so called "mid-fi" pile! But aside from the derogatory status (lable) probably will sound as good if not better that their pet names 75% of the time at 20% of the cost.
     Probably ten years ago (maybe a little less) Sam Tellig was asked why he never reviewed equipment from smaller companys. His quip was that they never knew if they were going to be around this time next year. Of course in this day and age companys come and go, and on some occassions reemerge again. We all know that this by now was nothing but a cop out! But with Stereophile (alone) if the name happens to be Musical Fidelity or Music Hall it will always be a great review even though the equipment is cussed on a daily basis everywhere else! (anybody begining to see a pattern?). Now adays I'm left with the feeling that if the product line didn't emerge from centeral Europe ST won't even open the box (got to pay for all those free trips and dinners). Freemer has gone so far out in the looney bin that I (for one) just automaticly skip over his column. If it were not for Dudley I think that magazine would die! The rest should have been drawing unemployment a long time ago.
    I read TAS for one reason only; the record reviews! But will check out a road test every now and then if the product line interests me (rarely). I long for the old Audio magazine. These guys did excellent record tests and product tests as good as anything we see today. Or even better yet of old TAS when they did not accept advertising!!! In those days they called a spade when they saw a spade, and that's what we need in front of us right now.
sorry for the rant on magazines

gary
P.S. How does a guy earning $75K a year afford a $135K turntable? Or a system valued at $250K???? Even if he made $150K a year?

BobC

Re: TAS review of the Khartago is out !!
« Reply #9 on: 10 Aug 2009, 04:49 pm »
Well, I agree with most of your statements...but I still read the magazines.  I just need to try to see though the spin.  Even with the spin it's fun to read about this stuff  :D

I'm OK with starting with the Khartago, because it offers such value...and the target audience is likely budget conscious.  I'm hoping the Khartago recognition leads to a Stratos Mono or Kismet review. 

To me the product line's greatest strength and weakness is the upgrade options.  On one hand I love being able to upgrade my Stratos Monos as funds allow, but on the other hand if JV was to review a set, how do I know if his amps match my own?

cstory

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 130
  • Seaching for clues
Re: TAS review of the Khartago is out !!
« Reply #10 on: 10 Aug 2009, 05:19 pm »
I am glad that it was the Khartago that was reviewed. I am looking at getting an amp and want to keep the cost under $1000. I don't have room for the Stratos, don't need more than 100 or so watts/channel, so this was just what I was looking for.

As for the audio magazines, they fit in with all other print media. You cannot have one be your sole source of information, but if you read them consistently and listen to equipment, you begin to recognize those whose listening biases match your own more closely. For example, Art Dudley's taste in sound does not align with mine. I still read his column, but the fact that I don't agree with him doesn't make him an idiot.  :wink:

Cheers,

Chuck



BobC

Re: TAS review of the Khartago is out !!
« Reply #11 on: 10 Aug 2009, 10:27 pm »
...the fact that I don't agree with him doesn't make him an idiot.

Well said :thumb:

Oystein

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 33
Re: TAS review of the Khartago is out !!
« Reply #12 on: 11 Aug 2009, 07:10 am »
I see lost of discussion about the validity and independance of magazine (or online) reviews.

I never select a component based on 1 positive review only. It only might trigger my interest to see if there is more information available. Many times you read reviews in different media of a component and the reviews all have a different outcome in their conclusion.
For me this is a no-go to buy the piece.
What striked me about Odyssey is that all reviews have the same positive outcome so if all agree it must be something special.
Most available reviews are based on the Stratos and only a few on the Khartago.
For me Jonathan Valin only confirmed that the Khartago is also extraordinairy.

Oystein

lazydays

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 1365
Re: TAS review of the Khartago is out !!
« Reply #13 on: 11 Aug 2009, 04:05 pm »
I see lost of discussion about the validity and independance of magazine (or online) reviews.

I never select a component based on 1 positive review only. It only might trigger my interest to see if there is more information available. Many times you read reviews in different media of a component and the reviews all have a different outcome in their conclusion.
For me this is a no-go to buy the piece.
What striked me about Odyssey is that all reviews have the same positive outcome so if all agree it must be something special.
Most available reviews are based on the Stratos and only a few on the Khartago.
For me Jonathan Valin only confirmed that the Khartago is also extraordinairy.

Oystein

my comments about magazines and audio gear were mostly pointed to the reason we don't see certain pieces of equipment up for a full scale review. Art Dudley gave us a hint of what was going on a year or so ago when he spoke of freebies. I applaud him for that! Still if a certain guy gets his hands on a five figured amp, and knowing it's his to keep till the end of time as a "loaner"; can his review be trusted? How many of you ever look at the equipment list at the end of the reviews? I have no problem with a guy getting a free CD or LP to review, but would still rather see him just buy it (after all it stays in his collection). But when your talking a $135K turntable and $10K worth of cartridges; I have a problem. Yet on the otherside of the coin I've bought a couple pieces of equipment from a TAS reviewer in the past. Nothing really expensive, and I know for sure that he paid out of his pocket for one of the items (he included the sales reciept). For me that reviewer has far more credability than the guy with the $165K analog setup.
     gary

cloudbaseracer

Re: TAS review of the Khartago is out !!
« Reply #14 on: 19 Aug 2009, 09:15 pm »
I was excited to read the piece on the Khartago and do feel that Valin was saying that it closely approximates the Solution.  That IS great news but I do wonder how much of it is just system matching?  Meaning, will these amps sound that good on my(your) system with my(your) speakers? (By the way, I have Emerald Physics CS2).  I am really beginning to believe that the magic is in the match and not in the price tag.  I have never heard any of the Magico speakers and wonder how good they must be with all the stellar reviews?  I do know that some touted the CS2 as besting many a 15-20k speaker.  Are these products just over priced or are these "gems" we seem to have located just a great design that happens to be affordable?  I can afford a super highend system but I will not pay that amount of money for it.  Maybe I will never be satisfied until I reach for the stars and spend the money but from experience I see people selling the ultra high-end systems only to replace them with another high priced system.  If they were so great- what happened?  Possibly off subject so I will hush!

At this time, I am looking to change from my current power system which is a pair of Panasonic SA-XR700 receivers ran in digital mode with a modified Behringer that is digital straight through.  I do feel something is missing of late but don't know what that may be.  We have surely all read the great reviews on the Panasonic and I was drawn to their low heat efficiency using class D technology.  Are these like the CS2 just the flavor of the month that has passed by?

As for the categorization that TAS/Stereophile implement, I find TAS version to be a little harder to work within.  By this I mean that I can at least look in the Stereophile Class A section and find what appears to be true world beaters at a great price.  If memory serves me, I remember seeing some of the PSB speakers at 5k or less in the same classification as the Wilson/Magico/Focal at upwards of 80k?  To me, this is a better reference than stating that the Khartago is a great amp in the 1-1.5k range?  In that structure I see no real ability to discern a world beater.  Is this just me?

Either way, I look forward to venturing down the road of choosing a new amp.  Or at least I think I do.....


Congratulations Klaus!!


James

klaus@odyssey

Re: TAS review of the Khartago is out !!
« Reply #15 on: 28 Aug 2009, 05:22 am »
You've got it bang on.  For over 20 years now i am preaching synergy,  synergy,  synergy. 
Yes,  a 2 k system can beat the crap out of a 20 k system in terms of musicality, sound staging, and emotional connection to the music.  Easy.   However,  I also have to concede that there are a few areas,  especially the nth degree of true retrieval and super natural bass extension,  for example,  where money buys you a lot.  Never mind that the "a lot"  is mostly noticeable  in the sweet,  sweet upgrades towards realism and naturalness,  but that's the cost of diminishing returns in this hobby.  For the most part,  it is extremely costly to bring the Magicos, for example,  to the level they are in these respects.  Whether you like the speakers or not for other reasons such as heavy metal-ness, full blast SPL's, etc.  is a different story.  What they are supposed to do they do magnificently.  That's why for people whose taste cover the Magico's strengths,  it is pretty much without peer at this point.  And, of course,  for those who can afford it.

I guess the whole point of the Khartago review,  and especially by somebody like JV, (and love him or hate him,  agree or not,  but he has his act together,  let me tell you) is the level of that nth degree of refinement in the sound quality that the amp gives you,  especially with a speaker as revealing in these areas as the Magicos.  Will the Khartago boogie with sub 1 k speakers ???  Of course,  and obviously,  with the majority of any speakers out there,  the amp will also absolutely get the speakers to their 100 % sonic limits,  making the system and the experience that much better with the speakers xyz.

Now,  within most more budget oriented systems,  however,  you will have a host of other amps that can sound  nice. Obviously qualitatively, differences between amps will be evident no matter what,  but they can sound nice nevertheless.  Especially if you put in a few of the- made in China under slave labor conditions for people who don't care about local economies or human abuses- amps that are available cheap here in the US.  They are a far cry from the actual parts and production and sound quality of our amps,  but they can sound kickass in some 2, 3, or even 5 k system.  Yep.

BUT  when you get to a level of the Magicos,  then all of the strengths and shortcomings are BRUTALLY  revealed.  That's where we can shine.  And while indeed very close, I don't think that you can say that we are the equal of the Soulutions,  which are probably the hottest amps right now in the world market.  Then again,  95 % for 1 / 120th of the cost ain't bad.

Late,

Klaus

And no,  I never said that our amps are great with all speakers or / and in all systems.  There are also negative synergies IMO,  as is with all products.  And, of course,  the taste of the listener.  For heaven's sake,  that's why there are tubes and digital amps in the same market.

vsr123

Re: TAS review of the Khartago is out !!
« Reply #16 on: 29 Aug 2009, 05:50 pm »
I have heard the EP CS3s with the Odyssey & SL and it sounds fantastic, I heartily recommend that you try the Odyssey amps with the CS2.3s.

cheers
Sri
« Last Edit: 30 Aug 2009, 01:47 am by vsr123 »


Zero

Re: TAS review of the Khartago is out !!
« Reply #18 on: 11 Sep 2009, 10:39 pm »
Congrats on the positive review Klaus.  I purchased a Khartago from you years ago. Though I no longer have the unit, I still miss it.  To this day, the Khartago remains one of of my references for a solid state amp at its price class.