Blu-Ray Players look no more

Levi · « **Reply #20 on:** 19 Jul 2009, 05:24 am »

There is a big difference between 720p and 1080p.

ajzepp · « **Reply #21 on:** 26 Jul 2009, 02:23 pm »

Quote from: Kevin Haskins on 18 Jul 2009, 06:44 pm

I like the analog outs. I hate most HT processors. To me, the true simplest system, with analog outputs from the source run through a simple multichannel analog volume control would be the most appealing approach.

I have been trying to figure out which direction to go in with regard to my HT processing. I have a nice little 2-channel preamp with HT bypass, outboard tube DAC, etc. I've had an outlaw 950 pre/pro that has done a nice job for me for the past six or seven years. BUT, I have not been able to get the idea of a simple multi-channel analog preamp out of my mind. I've had my eye on a McCormack MAP-1 for over a year, and I finally pulled the trigger a month ago. I run the analog outs of my Sony BDP into the MAP, with the player handling bass mgt and the MAP trim settings for calibration. I absolutely LOVE this piece. My system became more simple, and in the process more enjoyable. The biggest difference for me was with dialogue. The McCormack piece with my Maggies seems to be a fantastic match, because I have a front stage that is as good or better than the outlaw, but with vocals being absolutely pristine. Center channel integration is a beautiful thing now, and I have to give credit to the MAP.

But anyway, the point is that I completely agree with you about simplicity. And I also have a pretty darn nice back-up stereo preamp to boot.

zybar · « **Reply #22 on:** 26 Jul 2009, 02:28 pm »

Quote from: Bob in St. Louis on 19 Jul 2009, 05:10 am

Quote from: tf121682 on 18 Jul 2009, 05:19 pm
Any interest in adding a PS3 into the Blu-ray showdown?
Would be interesting to say the least. aa

Due to some challenges in the HT, we didn't do a Blu-ray showdown yesterday.

Yesterday was the first time I finally got to see the Oppo play a movie and I wasn't disappointed. I will need time to really maximize things, but out of the box it was excellent.

George

cujobob · « **Reply #23 on:** 27 Jul 2009, 04:55 am »

Quote from: Levi on 19 Jul 2009, 05:24 am

There is a big difference between 720p and 1080p.

Sure, if you're watching television two feet from your face

Screen-size + seating distance determines the need. I'm trying to convince myself that my 720P projector is just fine, of course

Levi · « **Reply #24 on:** 27 Jul 2009, 06:03 am »

That's what most audiophiles said. However those individual(s) who said it, do not have a good 1020p displays or projector.

I know because I was one of them.

Now that I have an ISF Pro calibrated 1080p display and an excellent Blu-Ray/SD DVD player. I highly doubt I will be coming back to 480p/720p.

Quote from: cujobob on 27 Jul 2009, 04:55 am

Sure, if you're watching television two feet from your face
Screen-size + seating distance determines the need. I'm trying to convince myself that my 720P projector is just fine, of course

launche · « **Reply #25 on:** 27 Jul 2009, 01:09 pm »

Where you using the same televisions?
The screenshot that is indicated to be 720P looks more like 480P. Something is the process just seems a bit off.

ted_b · « **Reply #26 on:** 27 Jul 2009, 01:30 pm »

It was taken a quite a different angle (notice the center channel tweeter) which for whatever reason, with projectors and cameras, can make a significant difference in perceived saturation, brightness, etc.

Levi, I assume you meant 1080p displays. And don't lump 480p with 720p, as big a difference between them as you are trying to state between 720p and 1080p. 480p is by no means HD (and not a Blu Ray spec either).

zybar · « **Reply #27 on:** 27 Jul 2009, 01:40 pm »

Guys,

There is a definitely a difference in 720p vs. 1080p - that really isn't debatable. More than doubling the number of pixels produces a better image - period.

What is debatable, is whether the improvement is worth it.

Depending on display size, room size, viewing distance, etc...it may or may not be worth stepping up to a 1080p display from a 720p display.

Having almost finished painting my HT room (flat black ceiling and the entire area behind my screen + dark colors elsewhere) and added the new Oppo Blu-ray player, I can tell you that a 110" image from a 720p pj (Panny AE-900) is nothing to be ashamed of. In fact, my buddy who has the 1080p SIM pj, thought my picture looked very good. Is it as good as his...NO. But I can definitely enjoy the HT experience.

As some point, I absolutely plan on upgrading to a 1080p pj (either the Epson 6500UB or JVC RS-10), but for now, I am very happy with what I have.

George

Levi · « **Reply #28 on:** 27 Jul 2009, 01:44 pm »

The pictures are two different displays.

My comparison pictures were roughly a good comparison by AVS Forums standard. The 1080p/24 is much more detailed and no video noise through BLU RAY. Likewise, sound effects specially on DTS-HD or Dolby-HD is something to really look into.

This is redundant post. I was happy with my 720p ISF Pro calibrated Plasma display until I saw what a 1080p video can do.

ted_b · « **Reply #29 on:** 27 Jul 2009, 02:19 pm »

Quote from: Levi on 27 Jul 2009, 01:44 pm

The pictures are two different displays.

My comparison pictures were roughly a good comparison by AVS Forums standard. The 1080p/24 is much more detailed and no video noise through BLU RAY. Likewise, sound effects specially on DTS-HD or Dolby-HD is something to really look into.

This is redundant post. I was happy with my 720p ISF Pro calibrated Plasma display until I saw what a 1080p video can do.

Levi,
The fact that you are mentioning audio, and specifically Blu Ray differences has me a little confused...is the top picture not Blu Ray at 720P? I thought this thread was about going from Blu Ray 720P to Blu Ray 1080P. Audio would be the same at either resolution.

Levi · « **Reply #30 on:** 27 Jul 2009, 02:35 pm »

Ted,

To keep things clear. This thread is about top of the shelf BLU-RAY players and not about my new LED HDTV or going 480, 720, 1080.

The pictures I took above are from a 720p Panasonic Plasma ISF Pro Calibrated (top) using a Denon 3800bdci and Hell Boy 2 Blu-Ray player. The other one that looks considerably sharper is a Samsung 1080p display which is new and not calibrated (bottom picture) and all else being the same. The point I was trying to make is that when I only have a 720p display and SD DVD player, I was very happy with the picture. Now that I have seen a 1080p display in my living room, I will not go back to my 720p display and SD Player. aa

I no longer use the Denon 3800. I am now using a Pioneer BDP-09FD and my LED HDTV is now Professionaly calibrated.

Picture now is stunning! The sound coming from the Pioneer betters the Denon all across the frequency board.

I hope this helps.

--Levi

Lyndon · « **Reply #31 on:** 27 Jul 2009, 02:54 pm »

I viewed Levi's system with the last year's Batman film, and it was almost 3D in its effect.
I also would like to see a comparison between the Oppo player and the Pioneer. The Pioneer seemed much better than the Sony
and the Panasonic that friends have in Salt Lake.
Apples and Oranges.
Best home theater system I have seen is my friend's projection system, will post more on those details on a later date.
But Levi's Samsung set is jaw dropping in its blacks.
Lyndon

Levi · « **Reply #32 on:** 27 Jul 2009, 03:05 pm »

Thank you for the complement Lyndon.

hometheaterdoc · « **Reply #33 on:** 27 Jul 2009, 05:59 pm »

Quote from: zybar on 27 Jul 2009, 01:40 pm

What is debatable, is whether the improvement is worth it.

Depending on display size, room size, viewing distance, etc...it may or may not be worth stepping up to a 1080p display from a 720p display.

George hits on the key.

If you are using a screen size and sitting at a certain viewing distance, even though there would be a noticable difference up at the screen, at your seated viewing distance, you really won't appreciate all the improvements that can be seen that close.

I just put a 50" plasma in a bedroom where the room dimensions and layout dicated that it was mounted on the wall directly opposite the bed. But it was >21 feet away. At that viewing distance, you can't differntiate the improvements going from 720P to 1080P... but you sure can tell the difference between 480P and 720P/1080P...

If you are watching a 110" diagonal image from 12 feet away (1.5X screen width), you bet you can tell a very real and very noticable difference between 720P and 1080P.... it's very easy to tell the difference, even on modest quality equipment...

so the question becomes are you going to be sitting at a distance from a screen large enough to show the differences... and if so, is it worth the extra $$ to get the improvement... same value judgement we run into with improving our audio systems... it's just that it's a little less subjective in video as some folks like different flavors of audio

ted_b · « **Reply #34 on:** 27 Jul 2009, 06:56 pm »

This is a discussion ad nauseum in the HT world. I think the overall conclusion is that both sides have their points; 720P is practically (95%+) indistinguishable at certain distances, but like audio, that last 5% is quite sweet.

At other distances, it's not a debate. Me, I'm at 14 ft, so my 110" screen benefits significantly from 1080P. My Sammy 710 pj is 720p and so far it's great (beat the crap out of my previous Runco CRT 3 gun); but, like George, it's stopgap until the 1080P pj is there. Ah, the crosses we must bear.

Here's a take from a few years ago:
http://s3.carltonbale.com/resolution_chart.html

jeenie67 · « **Reply #35 on:** 28 Jul 2009, 06:02 pm »

Hi again. I just had to throw in my three cents worth. Numero uno: you're only as good as your eyes. Duo: you're only as good as your ears. I've only had the opportunity to view various large screen TV's with various video drivers (DVD players etc.) at others homes over the past few years, and dollar for dollar, I cannot see the expenditure (mine) for mega-pixal monitors and reproduction units (players etc.), nor can I justify mega-bucks for a modest increase in audio specs. I've owned an Oppo DV-980? ..the first one and love it. It does the job. Sound is excellent and for my 56 year old eyes, I can see the writing on the football....fine with me! I will be purchasing the new Oppo Blu-Ray for Christmas (my gift to me) only because my poor little Oppo took a bad fall and now it freezes up sometimes in DVD video playback. It's out of warranty and the cost to repair it is questionable to the cost of a new unit; so I rap the thing when it freezes up with a wooden mallet and I'm good for the rest of the show! And hi to Bob! Jeenie.

Lyndon · « **Reply #36 on:** 28 Jul 2009, 06:33 pm »

Ted,
I enjoyed that!

Quote

My Sammy 710 pj is 720p and so far it's great (beat the crap out of my previous Runco CRT 3 gun); but, like George, it's stopgap until the 1080P pj is there. Ah, the crosses we must bear.

Good points, all. Distance is a key factor from the screen. Levi is almost 7 feet? So does that translate into nearfield viewing on 46" and higher? Not including monitors, of course.

Jeenie67,
My mother just hit 90 years old, and she was tickled pink when I hooked up the Vizio (yeah, I know...) 1080p 42" LCD for her living room last month. My siblings said she wouldn't know the difference between HD and SD. Not true, so I am glad I bought it for her.
What makes me lean towards the Oppo BluRay machine would be the universal player aspects, or doesn't it play SACD? I thought they left the MediaTek chipset, and that did in the SACD, or am I wrong? If it doesn't do that, or DvD-A, or carry both Dolby HD and DTS MA (lossless and uncompressed), then I will wait on the fence some more.
Lyndon

ted_b · « **Reply #37 on:** 28 Jul 2009, 06:38 pm »

The Oppo BD-83 is a true universal, playing Blu-Ray codecs (internally decoding both TrueHD and DTS-HD as well as bitstreaming them if needed), SACD, DVD-Audio and the rest of the classic disc spinning stuff (cd, HDCD, MP3, etc).

Lyndon · « **Reply #38 on:** 28 Jul 2009, 06:41 pm »

Thanks, Ted_B,
I thought it just converted the SACD into PCM? But perhaps I was wrong about that.
Have to do my homework, when I am not on a 7 year old iBook.

Lyndon

zybar · « **Reply #39 on:** 28 Jul 2009, 08:12 pm »

Quote from: jeenie67 on 28 Jul 2009, 06:02 pm

Hi again. I just had to throw in my three cents worth. Numero uno: you're only as good as your eyes. Duo: you're only as good as your ears. I've only had the opportunity to view various large screen TV's with various video drivers (DVD players etc.) at others homes over the past few years, and dollar for dollar, I cannot see the expenditure (mine) for mega-pixal monitors and reproduction units (players etc.), nor can I justify mega-bucks for a modest increase in audio specs. I've owned an Oppo DV-980? ..the first one and love it. It does the job. Sound is excellent and for my 56 year old eyes, I can see the writing on the football....fine with me! I will be purchasing the new Oppo Blu-Ray for Christmas (my gift to me) only because my poor little Oppo took a bad fall and now it freezes up sometimes in DVD video playback. It's out of warranty and the cost to repair it is questionable to the cost of a new unit; so I rap the thing when it freezes up with a wooden mallet and I'm good for the rest of the show! And hi to Bob! Jeenie.

The reason you like the Oppo so much is that it is an excellent player!! If you look at the test results for the 980 at www.hometheaterhifi.com, you will see that it performs at a very high level - bettering many units that cost much more!

George