Elsinore DIY Speaker Build

Pez · « **Reply #20 on:** 9 May 2009, 04:25 am »

That makes one of us.

I always HATED the 4.0s.

Tyson · « **Reply #21 on:** 9 May 2009, 04:31 am »

Tru dat, which makes sense, since only one of us has good taste (ie, not you).

satfrat · « **Reply #22 on:** 9 May 2009, 04:41 am »

Quote from: Tyson on 7 May 2009, 01:55 am

Hello all,
I thought I might post some pictures from my "work in progress" build of the Elsinores. These speakers are designed by Joe Rasmussen who is a big contributor over on diyaudio.com and it looked like a fun/interesting project to do. The link to the plans, design goals, and other project details can be found at http://www.customanalogue.com/elsinore/elsinore_index.htm

First, 1 inch (25mm) thick mdf is hard to come by, so I had to buy several sheets of 1/2" (12.5mm) MDF from Home Depot and glue them together.

Lots of Glue:

OK Tyson,,,, lots of glue but how much scotch is this project consuming?

Really tho, very interesting project and I've always loved looking at pictures better than reading so this "gem" thread has been bookmarked. Good fortunes for your project Tyson.

Cheers,
Robin

Tyson · « **Reply #23 on:** 9 May 2009, 04:45 am »

I should be doing final assembly tomorrow, so more glue on Saturday! But tonight (Friday), lots of Aberlour has been consumed

Tyson · « **Reply #24 on:** 11 May 2009, 03:09 am »

Things are moving along, here's the latest in the build.

Got the braces installed on the rear panels:

And the "stiffening panel" behind the tweeter. Since the tweeter is sealed (not vented), we'll put another board on the back to completely isolate the tweeter from the mid/bass soundwaves.

Sanding out the tweeter leads:

CLAMPS!

Even cooler clamps:

and:

The manly nail gun we used to lock down each side and the mid brace while the glue sets:

Yes, it really is that insane:

ALMOST DONE:

Tyson · « **Reply #25 on:** 11 May 2009, 04:01 pm »

Also, I've decided to do the veneer work myself, so any tips or tutorials would be appreciated!

JoshK · « **Reply #26 on:** 11 May 2009, 04:22 pm »

There are a ton of useful threads on htguide.com (where ThomasW hangs out) about veneering. They are worth browsing.

I won't profess to be an expert, but I've done it a couple times. I had very good luck with the iron on method with normal wood glue like Titebond. I did not have a good experience with using contact cement. I think the iron on method makes it pretty easy. Then use a trim bit on your router or trimmer to flush the edges. Its worth buying such a bit, or use Thomas's.

I'd think Thomas would be a great resource for guiding you through the process.

Pez · « **Reply #27 on:** 11 May 2009, 04:32 pm »

Tip: Truck bed lining dude, truck bed lining. No wait... wood glue and sparkles!

That was a blast working on these this weekend! Sorry about that little fire I started, but I could have sworn you said "Burn that brace towards me"

Tyson · « **Reply #28 on:** 12 May 2009, 11:41 pm »

Yesterday we form-cut and installed the stiff board fiberglass in the speakers. Stiff board fiberglass was much, much better to work with than loose fiberglass or other "floppy" materials that you have to glue down or leave "floating". This stuff just got cut to shape, then friction fit to the different areas. It's in there pretty tight!

Now, all that's left is for the ports to get here so we can cut that out, clear the sawdust, attach the top and bottom of the cabinet, and install the drivers! Should be done in the next few days

JoshK · « **Reply #29 on:** 13 May 2009, 03:06 am »

And I thought my baffles were thick!

Tyson · « **Reply #30 on:** 13 May 2009, 05:54 am »

That is interesting that we are both former VMPS owners and we moved on to building our own stuff.

JoshK · « **Reply #31 on:** 16 Jun 2009, 02:46 pm »

Any more pictures?

Tyson · « **Reply #32 on:** 8 Sep 2009, 05:13 pm »

The speakers have been assembled for a long time, but I've not done any finishing work on them because I've been have a very, very difficult time getting them to sound good.

First, the bass was boomy and woolly, and I figured out we'd overstuffed the cabinets. So, I took out 50% of the fiberglass. That helped a lot.

Then I simply could not get the highs to sound right. Even got what sounded like distortion coming through them semi-regularly. I tried everything, from changing amps, upgrading amps, getting a tube preamp, getting a tubed source, getting Jensen Iso-Max XLR-RCA converters to replace my Cardas XLR-RCA converters (for my DCX, which is XLR only, to/from my other equipment which is all RCA based).

Finally, I focused on the tweeter, the Peerless HDS. Maybe they were damaged. Called Madisound, they felt it was very unlikely they were damaged, as those are very robust tweeters. But they commented that they were very, very, very transparent, leaning to analytical and dry sounding. Basically said that they sound almost exactly like the Scan-Speak Revelator 9700's.

I asked if I should upgrade to something like the Scan-Speak 6600 Illuminator, to get good transparency with better sweetness and musicality (even if it cost $220 per tweeter!!) But they said no, a better match for the Peerless HDS mid-woofers I have would be the new SB Acoustics SB29 Ring Radiator tweeter. How often does a company direct you away from the $220 item and advise you get the $50 one instead? Props to Madisound!

I was skeptical that a $50 tweeter would solve my problem and maintain the level of performance I wanted. But I figured for $100 total, I couldn't really lose (and I could resell them if they didn't). They were a perfect size to be a drop in replacement for the HDS tweeters. After a bit of unscrewing and swapping, they were firmly seated in my elsinores.

Right out of the box they sounded far better than the HDS ever did, even after months of tweaking the DCX active crossover. Smooth, musical, detailed, transparent, and very well integrated. I dropped the crossover from 2.3khz to 1.6khz and it just got better and better. It was the HDS tweeters that were causing the poor sound all along.

I've had them in for several days and they are breaking in more and more, and the overall sound continues to improve. I've heard a lot of different tweeters and this is probably the best dome tweeter I've ever heard. It's got a flat response from below 1khz all the way out past 20khz, its off axis performance is excellent, it's detail is exceptional, and it's tonality is beautiful. At $50, it's a screaming bargain. Here's a pic of the tweeter. It looks like the center is pushed in because there is a small pole in the center, under the tweeter dome, that the tweeter attaches to. This is a "dimple" approach to the ring-radiator application, as opposed to the "nipple" approach that Scan Speak and Vifa use.

One other thing to note - the guys that started SB Acoustics were all senior engineers from Scan-Speak, most of whom were responsible for designing the Revelator and Illuminator lines for them. They formed SB Acoustics after Tymphany bought out Scan Speak and Vifa and Peerless. This is their first offering to the market. My opinion is that they are deliberately putting out a tweeter this good and this inexpensive as a way to thumb their nose at Scan Speak and "show off" to the industry how good they are at building speaker drivers.

All I know for sure is that I'm finally getting world class sound in my home again. Thanks again to Madisound for steering me correctly to this gem of a tweeter.

jimdgoulding · « **Reply #33 on:** 11 Sep 2009, 04:32 pm »

Awesome!! Very impressive, Tyson. Happy listening. Superb coverage, too. Best.

JoshK · « **Reply #34 on:** 11 Sep 2009, 04:55 pm »

I'm curious now. Do you know what kind of nails he used in the nail gun? I can't see the head, so that isn't a framing nailer, although it looks about a big as my framing nailer (also a PorterCable).

Tyson · « **Reply #35 on:** 11 Sep 2009, 05:04 pm »

He called them "brads" I believe. They have tiny little heads, and they have a coating of glue on the front part of the nail that is heat (friction) activated. Pretty cool, actually....

Pez · « **Reply #36 on:** 11 Sep 2009, 05:06 pm »

I'm pretty sure we used straight finishing nails. They have a very narrow head that is barely visible. They really aren't their for a lot of support, mostly just intended to keep things taut while the glue dries. The glue thing Tyson mentioned is an option for this type of nail.

JoshK · « **Reply #37 on:** 12 Sep 2009, 04:40 pm »

I don't think my brad nailer is nearly that big. Those must be some big brads.

Tyson · « **Reply #38 on:** 16 Sep 2009, 07:15 pm »

Quote from: Marbles on 16 Sep 2009, 07:01 pm

Sorry I missed this post when it first came out. Will these speakers replace your RM40's?

Yep, the 40's are gone - Jason (Pez) bought them from me.

Hebrew Hammer · « **Reply #39 on:** 16 Sep 2009, 07:49 pm »

looking great.. how do you plan on finishing them?