[chadh]

I'm incapable of keeping up with technological progress, so I thought I'd ask for advice here.  Mini-notebooks (like this one: http://www.buy.com/prod/hp-mini-notebook-fw376ua-notebook-pc-10-1-diagonal-sd-led-brightview/q/loc/101/210904034.html?adid=17653&dcaid=17653) are cheap, wireless capable, and use solid state storage so there's no nasty hard-disk noise to worry about.  So I could store my music files elsewhere, and have the streamed wireless to the little notebook, and hook this thing to a decent USB DAC.

So, what are the drawbacks with this kind of idea?

Chad

[jrebman]

Chad,

This is exactly what I do with my office system, and will do for the bedroom.  I have an Acer Aspire One netbook, but mine does have a 160 gb drive, not SSD.  I think you'll find most of the noise comes from the fan needed mostly to cool the CPU, so in theory at least, the SSD version won't be much quieter.  If you start a play list and put the laptop under your chair, it's not a problem, and I'm super sensitive to extraneous noise and have a very, very quiet listening room.

The only other thing you have to be prepared for is a longer USB cable, and no, you can't use active hubs or repeaters for the USB connection.

It probably isn't a problem with most deecent USB dacs at redbook resolution, but higher res is going to demand a more sophisticated USB cable (2.0) and a well-designed USB receiver -- generally, but not exclusively meaning, not powered from the USB bus.  There are exceptions to all of this, so just take it as generalizations.

-- Jim

[mcgsxr]

I am not sure there are many drawbacks, but can I ask what else you want your music server to do/be capable of?

I recently went down the path to create a dedicated PC for my music, and once I considered cost, location, expected use, and what I NEEDED, I landed on a used small form factor Dell that I run headless.

The noise of the CPU fan is not an issue for me, as I run it wired ethernet to my SB3 from over 30 feet away in my basement, and the PC lives (with 2 external HD's) in an old stereo unit.

I use the SB3 as a wireless bridge for the times I need to connect to the PC for admin, and the rest of the time the PC and SB3 are "islands" from my wifi altogether.

Total cost for the used PC (P4, 3.0Ghz, XP Pro, 1G RAM), and some cables was ~$110.

Clearly not an elegant solution, and pointless for net surfing while listening etc, but as a dedicated resource, it works wonders.

[jrebman]

Mark,

That's similar to what I have in my other system -- a small, ultra-quiet Asus EEE Box pc, hardwired to ethernet, and a USB dac.  This little machine cost me $275, and uses only 20 watts of power.  It has a DVI out, which I use with a DVI to HDMI cable into an Oppo HDMI switch so I can switch between the computer and the Oppo 980 for movies.  All the music is streamed from the NAS in the basement.

-- Jim

[chadh]

Thanks for your answers.

Currently, I'm using a modified Squeezebox, which I really like.  However, it's annoying to me that, if anything were to go wrong with it, I've little option but to throw this thing away and find a new source.  Maybe that's not significantly different from anything else, but given that the squeezebox was clearly developed as a relatively cheap piece of consumer hardware, I don't have a lot of faith it it.  Moreover, despite Wayne's heroic efforts to prevent this, I occasionally have to deal with some interference in the signal (whether this is wireless interference, or from the display I'm not sure).

In many ways, I'd feel more comfortable splitting the two roles of the squeezebox:  have one item as a "transport" of some sort, and then use a DAC.  The squeezebox (or duet or whatever) could easily be a transport, and many people use it that way.  But it still worries me to think that I need to invest significant amounts of money in power supplies and modifications in order to get a decent SPDIF output.

To me, the downside of using a PC directly to USB DAC is that the computer generates a lot of noise.  Plus, having your PC sitting in the middle of your audio rig isn't necessarily a convenient arrangement.  But something small and cheap like a mini-notebook would be great.

In fact, I think an even better arrangement would be to use a wireless USB hub.  But from Jim's earlier post, I gather this won't generate great outcomes.  Why?

Chad

[jrebman]

Chad,

In terms of noise from the computer, are you talking machine noise or electrical noise?  The little Asus EEE Box computer I mentioned is as quite or eve more so than most laptops, and as far as electrical noise, this thing was designed as a media center computer and has a provision to bolt it directly to the back of your TV.

The disadvantage to wireless is the usual disadvantage to wireless -- more prone to interference, dropouts, etc.  Generally considered to be a step down in audio quality.  I realize that some people run this way, and have with no problems, but my SB3 was clearly, audibly better with an ethernet connection then when running with wireless.  My wireless in this house is very good and I get excellent signal strength everywhere, and neither of the neighbors on either side have a wireless setup, so even under those more ideal conditions, the ethernet direct connection was easily better.

I'm not trying to talk you out of the laptop idea by any means -- I use it myself and like it, just want to let you know about the other option, which I also like, and which keeps the USB cable shorter, which can also be a plus.  Downside is you have to run headless and use some sort of remote control, or have a monitor.

-- Jim

[chadh]

Jim,

I think the ASUS option does look appealing, as long as you can run an ethernet connection to it.  How do you control it?  Wirelessly, from another laptop?

I notice that they've also released the Asus EEE Top, which packages the EEE box with a touchscreen monitor.  I think that would make a pretty sweet little transport, sitting next to a USB DAC.

Chad

[rajacat]

Why can't you wirelessly use a netbook to control your main desktop computer which would be connected via ethernet to a Squeezebox and thereby have access to your music folder? The netbook could be an excellent remote.

-Roy

[chadh]

Why can't you wirelessly use a netbook to control your main desktop computer which would be connected via ethernet to a Squeezebox and thereby have access to your music folder? The netbook could be an excellent remote.

-Roy

You wouldn't even need the netbook, since the squeezebox has a remote.  The point, though, is that I'm looking for an option that replaces my squeezebox.  It's not that I dislike the squeezebox.  I actually love it.  I just don't trust it to hold up indefinitely, and have occasional trouble with interference when using it.

If I were rich, I'd probably upgrade to a transporter.  But I'm not, so I won't.   The problem is that it's hard to find all of the functionality of the squeezebox in a package that sounds as good and appears more robust.

Chad

[jrebman]

Chad,

I cheat.  I currently have a usb keyboard and a 16 foot usb cable, which is plenty long.  I don't have any use for rodents, so that's not an issue.  I may try my wireless keyboard, but that's another usb device and introduces the possibility of RF contamination from the wireless link.

Most of the remote desktop control apps don't work very well with my screen reader, so I just haven't ventured down that road -- meaning using another laptop for remote control is more trouble than it's worth.

Didn't know about the new Asus gizmo -- definitely looks cool.

-- Jim

[ebag4]

Jim,

I think the ASUS option does look appealing, as long as you can run an ethernet connection to it.  How do you control it?  Wirelessly, from another laptop?

I notice that they've also released the Asus EEE Top, which packages the EEE box with a touchscreen monitor.  I think that would make a pretty sweet little transport, sitting next to a USB DAC.

Chad

My PC sits in the basement, I was able to connect it in the office (where my 2 channel system resides) with a 16" USB cable, not ideal but it keeps the PC out of the listening space.  I run the unit headless from the office using a program called Xlobby which has a thin client running on my iPaq PDA.  Here are a few pics of the iPaq used as a remote:






Sorry about the poor quality of the pics, I'm not much of a photographer.  This gives you an idea of what can be done with Xlobby.  Best of all, older versions are still freeware.

I am runnng Foobar 2K with Asio4all on an XP Pro machine, 3G, 1 gig of Ram.

Hope this gives you some ideas with regard to being able to run your machine headless.  BTW, you can program the hard buttons to control different things as well.

Best,
Ed

[jrebman]

Hi Ed,

Just using the little usb keyboard that came with the Asus -- on an extension cable that runs under the area rug.

Still trying to find a decent remote client that will work with my screen reader.

-- Jim

[jrebman]

Chad,

Take a look at this:

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=66927.0

Put this on the Asus EEE Box, get the $30 logitech Rumble gamepad, and viola, simple, wireless remotely controlled media PC.  Need the $10 pro version for asio though.

I love that it has no music store interfaces, advertising, skins, and other flash and glitter.  Very basic, very powerful, and very flexible.

-- Jim

[chadh]

Thanks Jim.  I'm glad I have you working on this for me!

I'll be interested to hear what you think.  I'm not sure why it would sound significantly different from Foobar, though.

Chad

[jrebman]

Chad,

I'm not sure why either, but some implementations of media players and asio sound different, but at least in my experience, not drastically so.

Anyway, happy to report that with the Pro version of quuxplayer, things sound just great in my very limited testing.

Pro version is a must as the standard version only supports a database of 1000 tracks.

I'm going to order the gamepad now that I see that I can use the program without too much trouble (with the screen reader, that is.)

-- Jim